Man who sued to stop pledge explains reasons for suit

SF Chronicle via AP ^ | 6/26/02 | STEFANIE FRITH

[I_Love_My_Husband]

Sacramento atheist Michael Newdow said Wednesday he was trying to restore the Pledge of Allegiance to its pre-1954 version because no one should be forced to worship a religion in which they don't believe.

But if the threatening messages on his answering machine are any indication, the American public is not thanking him.

[joesnuffy]

Even though his daughter wasn't forced to recite the Pledge of Allegiance, it was wrong to require her to listen to it when she doesn't believe in it, he said.

Bet she is forced to memorize her multiplication tables when she would rather watch MTV

[agrandis]

I got no problem with the "under God" part (seems kind of obvious to me we ARE "under God"). It's the "one nation... indivisible" I always had a problem with, since I was raised to understand the Confederate cause.

Whatever, though - that's the problem with governmental schools, especially ones under the iron hand of a centralized Federal Leviathan, like we have today. Whoever is in charge at the time will be indoctrinating our children with THEIR view of the world. It used to be people that believed we are "one Nation, under God, indivisible...", now it's people that believe the only truth is that there definitely is no truth. A degradation, to be sure...

[ijcr]

He should take up cigarettes--talk about being an outsider,just because you use a legal product and pay extra taxes.

[Johnny Crab]

Maybe he's growing the next "American" traitor. As to what will happen......well maybe he'll be asked "And why should I let you in? You struck MY NAME down so I removed yours from the Book of Life.".....enjoy.

(Sarge yelling)"Are you a peter puffer? Do you ....."

[TommyDale]

I'm ready -- are you?

[Utopia]

The Declaration of Independence is a historical document, not law,

Gimme a f'ing break. Don't they teach anything in schools any more? The Declaration of Independence is what started it all. You can't look at the Constitution without looking at the Declaration of Independence. the D of I establishes the mindset for the Constitution.

[bannedonce]

"The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries." - James Madison, 1803

[twntaipan]

I think the phrase "under God" is more of a philosophical construct than the establishment of a religion. It does not argue for a particular religion, just the philosophical category "God".

Self-labeled free-thinkers are in truth tyrants, for they will use every means of compelling others to bend to their will. Fundamentalist atheists do not seek permission to abstain from participation, rather they insist that the act (of pledging to the flag) should be altered so that no one can participate. Fundamentalist Atheists are like spoiled children.

[DugwayDuke]

"Even though his daughter wasn't forced to recite the Pledge of Allegiance, it was wrong to require her to listen to it when she doesn't believe in it, he said."

I can't wait to tell my boss that it's unconstitutional for him to tell me things I don't like. Maybe I can wait, come to think of it.

[Toast on a Stick]

As an atheist, I have to respond to the comments on this post: First of all, you would think conservatives would support a return to the pre-1954 pledge which I support.

Who would think? You? In all sincerity, I really don't care what you think. Your OPINION is relevant to those who respect it.

I loved the wording of the pledge before it descecrated with religion. I'm a veteran and more patriotic than any of you.

Oh really. Well I'm a veteran too. Big deal. Because you wish the constitution meant freedom from religion and I don't that makes you more patriotic than anyone else? I would love to see the causal link for that one. What self-righteous garbage!

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, 'Under God' is an establishment of religion.

Says YOU and a very few liberals on unarguably the most liberal court in this country. There are some who don't agree. I guess because they don't agree they're not real Americans or real patriots to you. This might come as a shock, but I would be willing to bet that a great many people couldn't give a #$%! what you think is patriotic.

How is this man taking away your freedoms? Your free speech?

This guy admits that his point is he doesn't want his kid to have to hear religion. Well, you know what? We have to hear things we don't like all the time. Tough. It is a price of the freedom. Noone is asking his kid to believe anything. Our freedoms are not determined by how someone else FEELS when we use them.

If you want your children indoctrinized in religion, try church.

Thank you your majesty for determining where we may enjoy our rights.

The man has received death threats and threats of violence? How Christian of these people. Oh wait...violence is a popular theme in Christianity. Finally, you attack his sexual orientation and his funny name...

This TIRED old crap never ceases to raise it's rotting head. Violence is a theme everywhere. You don't mind if everyone judges you by the actions of all atheists I'm sure. If I were some of the atheists I've seen posting around here, I would be distancing myself from some of the truly ignorant things you've been posting as well.

Now drag out the recent history that is the CRUSADES, or go to your little atheist website for bible quotes that display violence. It must have been at least 15 minutes since one of your little cohorts has posted them. The reality is, if you found yourself alone at night in a very dangerous place without shelter and you saw a church up ahead in the darkness with the lights on, your putrescent little heart would be instantly filled with hope and you know it.

I guess when you can't win an arguement with logic, try name calling.

Like impugning someone's patriotism?

Frankly, I find your post disgusting.

[TommyDale]

"What kind of person thinks it is OK to defend the inclusion of the words "under god" by calling this man up and threatening his life? "

Probably a person who has been pushed over the edge from all this nonsense.

[Utopia]

You quote Madison, without knowing what he says. You do have any idea what fide defensor means? How about PONMAX?
HINT: That's what Madison was referring to.

[Mad_Tom_Rackham]

Promises, covenants, and oaths, which are the bonds of human society, can have no hold upon an atheist. John Locke, A Letter Concerning Toleration, 1689

Yes. The basis upon which our free society operates. Knock it out, and the society will collapse. Which is what the leftists want to see.

The homosexuals have joined the leftists in the cause. Little do they realize that if the fascist leftists ever gain control, the homosexuals will be jailed or incarcerated, either way, they will be gone.

Ironic that the society they are trying to destroy is the only society that would grant their freedom to live.

[Arizflash]

Bravo. Good one. Another thing, I'm sure this particular DOKTOR musta messed up at least one bandaid. He wants lawsuits, give him some. Heeheee.

[PhiKapMom]

Done in convention by the unanimous consent of the states present the seventeenth day of September in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and eighty seven and of the independence of the United States of America the twelfth.

[TheOtherOne]

     Newdow’s complaint in the district court challenged the constitutionality, under the First Amendment, of the 1954 Act, the California statute, and the school district’s policy requiring teachers to lead willing students in recitation of the Pledge. He sought declaratory and injunctive relief, but did not seek damages.

That is directly from the opinion. It appears he did not seek damages.

[ArmoredCav]

Here's his license info:AIM
Association of State Medical Board Executive Directors

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Medical Board of California Search Results


Licensee Name MICHAEL ARTHUR NEWDOW
Primary License Status Code RENEWED/CURRENT
Secondary License Status Code NONE
License Number G48913
License Type G
Address PO BOX 233345
City State Zip SACRAMENTO CA 95823-5429
Country USA
Original License Date 09/20/1982
License Expiration Date 06/30/2004
Medical School UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA LOS ANGELES SCHOOL OF MEDICINE
Year Graduated 1978

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Note: data current as of: 06/18/2002

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Direct questions and comments about these results to the
California Medical Board Home Page or you may
E-Mail the California Medical Board directly
This Board's data has been searched 15773447 times since 12/11/1997

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[RebelDawg]

I really didnt have to read any further than your rediculous statement that you "are more patriotic than any of the rest of us"... but I did anyway.

You claim to be a veteran? A veteran of what? The peace corps?

I don't know what rock you crawled out from under but I suggest you crawl back, real quick and quiet like.

You see in the United States Marine Corps (not the peace corps like your outfit) we say Always faithful to GOD! country and corps. You might notice that God comes first and thats because being faithful to god is more important than the other two, being faithful to our country is more important than the corps and being faithful to the corps.. well there you have it. I suppose you will now join your friend Newdow in suing the corps??? You are no more a veteran than my dog is. Actually I have a world of repect for my dog but none for the likes of you.

See ya around chump!

Oh and by the way you may want to read the book Stolen Valor...

[JessicaDragonet]

I think this hidious little creature should be teaching his daughter that in her lifetime...she will be seeing and hearing a myriad of things that she neither believes nor agrees with. But frankly...he probably doesn't give a rats ass about her. If he did, he would have found a way to do his thing without causing her to be ostracized...and maybe ending up a pariah in her own country.

[DensaMensa]

Newdow ??? Now what kind of name is that??? >Most likely Polish, possibly anglicized from Nevedovsky.


Interesting----

NovelGuide: Novel Analysis: Anna Karenina: Novel Summary: Part 6 ...
... Nevedovsky wins the election and all of Levin's friends are happy
about it. Part 6 section 31: Nevedovsky and the other members ...