"THAT which you believe"---"An open letter to Republicans"

6/23/02 | redrock

[redrock]

"This is free ground. All the way from here to the Pacific Ocean. No man has to bow. No man born to royalty. Here we judge you by what you do, not by who your father was. Here you can be something. Here's a place to build a home. It isn't the land--there's always more land. It's the idea that we all have value, you and me, we're worth something more than the dirt. I never saw dirt I'd die for, but I'm not asking you to come join us and fight for dirt. What we're all fighting for, in the end, is each other."

What is it that you believe???

A real question....since so many times on this forum, and others, the Republican 'mantra' has become a simple one.

Defeat the Democrats..whatever the cost..the Democrats are the enemy...(sort of Orwellian in it's simplicity)..repeated time after time...and anyone who dares to ask questions of George Bush's policies and actions is loudly shouted down.

But here's a 'news flash' for ya.......It may be that the Democratic Senators...Representitives.....leaders ARE the enemy of maintaining a Constitutional Republic.

But...the average member of the Democratic Party...is not.

The average member of the Democratic Party is just brainwashed..(for want of a better word)...

Just like the average member of the Republican Party is in danger of becoming.

"This is a party, this Republican Party, a Party for free men, not for blind followers, and not for conformists. "

So..I'll ask my very simple questions once again......

And Republicans who wish to rant and rave about 'third party' this or that...go right ahead.

But George W. Bush barely won the last election.....

You NEED staunch conservatives ( nowadays I guess we would be considered 'radical'.....) to help re-elect him....and others of the party..

CONVINCE us.........that at a certain point you will be willing to fight for 'old time values'.....

CONVINCE us ...that you have not become slavish followers of GWB...in much the same way as some did with Clinton....that you will ask the 'hard questions' (and demand the answers).

CONVINCE us.......and you will not do so by the constant dismissal of our very real concerns.

CONVINCE us.......

-----------------

So where do we 'draw the line'????

Should we elect rapists or murderers...if they are members of the Republican Party..and could 'help retake the Senate'???

At what point do you say 'this far and no further'???

Must every single American 'prostitute' themselves in order for one political party (one which on CLOSE examination is no different than the other one) to 'control' government???

I have certain values and beliefs...based upon my Belief in God.

Should I just throw those Beliefs and Values away...and close my eyes....just so the Republicans can win???

The basis of this Nation is a hardcore belief that the values and ideals (sorry to use that word..ideals...seems that word anymore has the same effect on Republicans as a Cross does to evil) that founded this Nation are important....

[agitator]

I'm not really sure why I'm chiming in here and I'm sure I'll be ignored or promptly told to go away, but I'm a glutton for punishment so here we go, I'll be brief.

This is what passes for politics in America today:

Politicians in America

Which one of these guys is the Democrat and which one is the Republican?

Does anybody bet money on which one of these guys is going to win?

Does it really matter that much who wins?

Not when you have an electorate that wouldn't know what real freedom was if it walked up and bit them on the a$$. Not when you have an electorate that is too lazy to own a legal dictionary. Not when the "promoters" like this:

have control of the money system and nobody knows who this guy was, or what his modern day equivalent is, and what role they play in controlling your life and country.

In my opinion (yeah, I know, who cares...) unless there's a whole lot of brainwashing de-programmed and a whole lot of education caught up on, we're just going to get a lot more of the same soap opera. So find something out about who that guy is in the picture. Learn about what money is in the context of the Constitution. Form a study group with like-minded friends. Talk to anybody that will listen about what freedom really is, not what the toob tells people it is. Challenge your friends to think "outside the box" - the box being the TV. Educate the children about what freedom really means. Learn something about the law the way it is and compare it with what you think it ought to be or the way it was 150 years ago. Take a trip to the state archives sometime. Try carrying around a copy of the Bill of Rights and see how many people around you can remember what's in it. Try filling them in on one of the Amendments they didn't guess. Endeavor to build a Bill of Rights culture in your little piece of America so we can get rid of the pro-wrestling and get back to what matters.

[cva66snipe]

If we re-elect them even after they reveal themselves to be liberals, politicians are justified in assuming that we want to elect liberals.

And for that very reason change of party direction will not be forthcoming. Why should they change? The Blind Sheeple will vote for their sorry hides anyway. Only one thing gets a person in office that's the voting public. That is the one sole way short of another Declaration of Independence we have to change this nations course. Our right to vote was never intended to be used as a tool for minipulation by parties bestowing fear upon the general public that they had but one choice. We have many choices. The Constitution ststes that many are allow no limits except age and citizenship. The more who run for office the more choices we have. By all means for this nations preservation make that choice to be what canidate best represents your political and moral beliefs and not what some tyrant politico dictates to you. Do you vote out of fear of events or losses that they say will occur if you don't vote as they say? Or do you chose the best person for the job based on their beliefs, record, and character? I say it's their beliefs, record, and character and not their party that earns them the privlidge to represent me and recieve my vote.

[exodus]

What about Bernie Sanders, then?
Bernie isn't the only socialist in Congress, but he's openly socialist, which to me is a synonym for communist.
# 256 by exodus

To: exodus
There's a marked difference between socialista and communists.
# 260 by Luis Gonzalez
*************************

How is socialism and communism different?
Either way, property is taken from individuals and controlled by the State.
In both, the individual must not question, but only obey.

That seems the same to me.

[exodus]

In my opinion (yeah, I know, who cares...) unless there's a whole lot of brainwashing de-programmed and a whole lot of education caught up on, we're just going to get a lot more of the same soap opera. So find something out about who that guy is in the picture. Learn about what money is in the context of the Constitution. Form a study group with like-minded friends.

Talk to anybody that will listen about what freedom really is, not what the toob tells people it is. Challenge your friends to think "outside the box" - the box being the TV. Educate the children about what freedom really means.

Learn something about the law the way it is and compare it with what you think it ought to be or the way it was 150 years ago.

Take a trip to the state archives sometime. Try carrying around a copy of the Bill of Rights and see how many people around you can remember what's in it. Try filling them in on one of the Amendments they didn't guess.

Endeavor to build a Bill of Rights culture in your little piece of America so we can get rid of the pro-wrestling and get back to what matters.
# 301 by agitator
*************************

Thank you, agitator.

Your posts, and your work at the radio
are an inspiration to all of us.

Everyone, ignore the men in the ring.
They're following a script handed to them by others,
and it really doesn't matter which one wins.

The only way you can effect the results is to vote third party.
Force the major parties to earn your vote.
Don't vote based on what they say,
hold them accountable for what they do .

[exodus]

To: exodus
I say it's their beliefs, record, and character
and not their party that earns them the privilege
to represent me and recieve my vote.
# 302 by cva66snipe
*************************

If everyone, or even a high percentage of people
voted based on their beliefs
we would still have a Republic,
instead of this Democracy we are stuck with today.

[CDHart]

Thanks for the info! :^)

Carolyn

[B. A. Conservative]

Rock solid!

[Luis Gonzalez]

I think you better start reading what my posts say, and quit putting words in my mouth.

The posts talks about rhetoric, and how politics really work, where did I even say the words "conservative values"...this dysfunction probably has a lot to do with the way you view everything in general.

You read the words, then imagine they say something other than what you read.

This ends our conversation, do whatever you have to do, and justify it however you wish to justify it.

If you believe that the way to make an impact on the GOP is to walk away from it, that's fine.

See you later.

P.S. I don't think that you either supported nor voted GOP these past elections anyway.

[Luis Gonzalez]

That's not my question.

[Luis Gonzalez]

"How is socialism and communism different?"

That statement alone shows your utter ignorance of politics.

[ImpBill]

#236 - Bravo. One who gets it .... deserves it bumped up again.

"The Leglislative Branch is out of order. Fix that and it doesn't matter who is POTUS as it will be the voice of the people once again in control. You can't curse one parties Congressmen and senators as being tyrants and socialist when you refuse to weed out those in your own party as well."

[First_Salute]

God love you, buddy.

[Twodees]

So, they just surrender, huh? How many democrat Senators would have been reelected after being forced into a public confrontation over this? Probably fewer than were reelected. By backing off, Lott and his gang allowed the democrats to keep all this out of public view.

How does it help to go ask the opposition for permission to do what you're required to do to fulfill your oath? That kind of thing might look like conservative principle to you, but it looks like surrender monkey tactics to me.

When the democrats say this kind of thing, they should be forced to back it up publicly, not allowed to go around acting as though they had the winning hand all along. Republicans in the Senate are the reason we have a democrat Senate. Before Jeffords jumped, Daschle ran Lott anyway, so what's the difference?

[First_Salute]

Recommended:

Washington : an abridgement in one volume by Richard Harwell of the seven-volume George Washington by Douglas Southall Freeman
  - by Richard Barksdale Harwell

Available through Barnes & Noble, also Amazon.com.

Also recommended, about the author of the seven-volume George Washington:

Douglas Southall Freeman, by David E. Johnson:

[First_Salute]

Bump - R'314.

[Twodees]

Good find, sniper. I knew there was something screwy about that. I don't look at the number of democrats who blustered that they wouldn't convict, I look at the number of republicans who actually voted to let Clnton slide.

DJoyce calls the "two" parties the Screw party. That sums it up for me.

[Jethro Tull]

"The legacy of those "principled conservatives" who broke from the GOP in 1992 to stand by their convictions, will forever be known as the Clinton presidency."

And the legacy of the neocon movement which now grips the Republican party is one of liberal capitulation; or better stated, vote for me, because I'm not them."

[Twodees]

Fine, allow communism to exist. Just don't defend your party's politicians when they embrace it. We're all free to choose communism if we're stupid enough. The people elected to office aren't free to do so because they took an oath to the US Constitution and the Constitution doesn't contain any communism.

[ImpBill]

While the Immigration issue is indeed quite important, and I in no way want to degegrate it, I feel the deeper concern I have is that the leadership of the GOP, as in the other party, have absolutely abandoned our Constitution.

Tightening our borders, while necessary, and looking the other way as our 1st Amendment Rights are violated by CFR, and 4th/2nd Amendment Rights as well as "due process" are violated by Anti-Terrorism legislation, and on and on and on, will not get me nor many other disenfranchised little "r" republicans back into the big "R" Republican tent.

When the GOP offers up and we elect Americans whose fidelity is to the Constitution as written and act accordingly, perhaps I will then re-associate myself with the "party" and work once again for that party. Until then I will be quite content to exercise my voting responsibilities as a "NON-ALIGNED" citizen.

Not directed necessarily at you I would be curious to know exactly why the people that are still Republicans, are?

My guess is that in the main the response would be along the lines that the GOP is the only obstacle to the Democrats, which of course defines more what one is against than what one is for.

The argument will work for a limited time, but as more and more principled conservatives come to understand that once in office there isn't much difference between the representatives in the manner in which they legislate, I would guess more and more folks will become as I, dis-interested in and self dis-enfranchised from the GOP.

It really is not anywhere close to the party of Goldwater and Reagan these days, IMHO.

[Twodees]

Oh, yeah. Those of us who know how politics work and are tired of letting it go on are the stupid ones. You can't polish a turd, Luis. Party politics is a big unflushed turd, stinking up the whole house and the faithful of both parties are trying to polish it instead of flushing it.

Many of us don't have the tolerance for rot and corruption necessary to keep allowing the RNC to thwart the conservatibve movement. Those of you who do aren't going to convince anyone that you're holding the keys to success when all you offer is a plan to be increasingly loyal to a gang of increasing treacherous politicians.

I'm expecting you boys to tell us to line up for the kool-aid any minute.