BUSH DISMISSES ADMINISTRATION REPORT ON 'WARMING'

Drudge ^ | Drudge

[CoolGuyVic]

"'I read the report put out by the bureaucracy,' Bush said dismissivly... "

More to come, I'm sure

[Deb]

Bush hasn't changed a thing he has ever said on this subject. It's members of the press with their own agendas that have twisted and distorted his positions on every issue in order to inflame the Left and disspirit the conservative base.

Yesterday's phrase was "flip-flop". There was none. The bashers lose (again).

[My2Cents]

I believe that some gasses deplete the ozone

I agree with you. Rush keeps saying that the theory of global warming hasn't been conclusively proven. Well, it hasn't been conclusively disproven either. Some evidence indicates one thing; other evidence indicates something else. I suspect there are some chemicals that deplete the ozone, and I suspect there are some hothouse gases that contribute to a greenhouse effect. While I'm conservative, I also think government has a role in preserving environmental quality. People hate air quality measures, but the fact that California skies are as clear as they are today (which, in all honesty, are clearer than they were 30 years ago) is testimony to the effectiveness of air quality programs and requirements.

I worked for an oil refining company ten years ago, and we never were opposed to environmental controls. Our position was that there be good science to justify them, and that the controls be applied to everyone equitably. We considered it good corporate citizenship to support necessary and equitable environmental regulations -- and I'm referring to the nasty old oil industry here. I think it's reasonable for conservatives to be good conservationists.

[concerned about politics]

Then, there would be massive changes in these departments with the life long card carrying rats still pushing the rat agenda.

That would be nice to be able to rid Washington of these folks, but it's important to remember that what ever bills we pass now may be used by a Democrat later as well. (Which is why the patriot act is so horrorfying! Imagine Clinton with that power! And it is now law!)

[B Knotts]

You act as if there is no cost to environmental regulation. There is a cost, a human cost in lives. When environmental regulation lowers the standard of living, people die. Environmental regulation is only justified when it saves more lives than it costs.

[Redcloak]

Anyone happen to know when the "Patriot Act" sunsets?

Or should that be if it sunsets?

[Miss Marple]

Okey, dokey. I take it that you have data to back up your claim that there is no global warming? Please refute the data on the NOAA site.

If you have no data, you are taking the statement that it is not occurring on blind faith, which is no more scientific than the junk science of the envirals.

As I said, the data on this site seems to support it, but they do not give enough explanation of the data collection methods and variables for me to judge its accuracy.

As I said, this is what THIS web site says. It is the National Oceanic and Amospheric Administration. Their mission is to collect weather and climate data.

The question about the data that I am raising is how reliable certain portions are, such as tree rings.

Obviously, you just want to shout that there is no global warming and end the discussion. You also want to bash Bush.

[MJY1288]

". Just because they're not as middle of the road as you, doesn't mean they don't love their country.

Giving away everything to the Democrats really isn't doing us any favors, you know."

Why are you using "They" and "Thier", Yesterday it was "WE", And you bashed the president and proclaimed your Pure Right Wing Idiology, I guess your core beliefs have waffled a bit huh, or are you fence sitting now?

[RAT Patrol]

Bush hasn't changed a thing he has ever said on this subject. It's members of the press with their own agendas that have twisted and distorted his positions on every issue in order to inflame the Left and disspirit the conservative base. Yesterday's phrase was "flip-flop". There was none. The bashers lose (again). I believe I told you I was reserving judgment until I heard the words come from his mouth. I 100% agree with you about the press. They did it continually during the election campaign and continue it to this day. However, Bush burned his trust bridge with me and I will need his constant reassurance on key issues from now on.

No, he apparently did not flip-flop on this one. The bots win one (for a change). I am really glad about that, actually. I want you guys to be right. But a flip-flopper rightfully makes his base nervous.

Let me add that Rush and Drudge are not members of the liberal press out to get Bush. They are people like me who still have steam coming off their burnt promises. Trust is not easily won, it is lost in a snap (though we were very longsuffering with him) and it can be regained but very, very slowly. That is just the way life works. I hoping bush regains it. We shall see.

[MJY1288]

Dec 31st 2004

[Deb]

You and Rush are full of beans.

Rush screamed that Bush 'flip-flopped". He did not.

By treaty a report must be filed by the EPA every five years with the UN. This one was started over five years ago by the Clintonistas. Bush had Christy Whitman stall the release as long as possible. The EPA is made up of career bureaucrats who can't be fired.

Neither you or Rush have bothered to do any research into the report, the people who created it or the story behind it.

[VRWC_minion]

Look for yourself, become self sufficient.

I did and found zip, nada, zilch and that's is why I am calling you on it.

[My Identity]

ECO-POLITICS
Eco-warnings are now politicised and are being spun by those who profit from them.

Kyoto Paradox I:
Climate is an extremely complex, chaotic, coupled, non-linear, time-dependent system
with massive, external, naturally-occuring inputs and wide variability in measurables.
Therefore,
To say we can control it by tweaking a small set of factors is ridiculous on its face.

Kyoto Paradox II:
Climate is an extremely complex, chaotic, coupled, non-linear, time-dependent system
with massive, external, naturally-occuring inputs and wide variability in measurables.
Therefore,
You can no more successfully predict the outcome of doing something than you can of
not doing something. In other words, the impact of trying to "fix" a climate problem
is as unpredictable as the impact of ignoring it.

It is "a media myth" that only a few scientists are sceptical of global warming theories.

---

MODEL BUILDING:
Climate models are filled with assumptions, bad data, tweaks, simplifications, etc.
These parameters can be "tweaked" to force the model to show any desired result.

Projections of climate change are based on models and assumptions which
"are not only unknown, but unknowable within ranges relevant for policy-making"

Models fail to adequately handle clouds, water vapour, aerosols, precipitation,
ocean currents, solar effects, complex weather patterns, etc.

Model simulation of surface temperature appears to be little more than fortuitous
curve-fitting rather than a demonstration of human influence on global climate.

Temperature rise projections this century are "unknown and unknowable".

"Climate models [are] projections, story lines, [more aptly termed] fairy tales."
-- Hartwig Volz, geophysicist, RWE Research Laboratory, Germany

"Global warming projections [are] completely unrealistic...assuming extreme scenarios
of population growth and fossil fuel consumption"
-- S. Fred Singer, atmospheric physicist, University of Virginia, Environmental Policy Project

"The balance of evidence suggests that there has been no appreciable warming since 1940.
This would indicate that the human effects on climate must be quite small."
-- S. Fred Singer, atmospheric physicist, University of Virginia, Environmental Policy Project

---

PREDICTING THE PAST:
Climate models, which serve as the basis for long-term climate predictions,
have clearly failed when tested against observed climate data.

Models fail to reproduce the known difference in trends between the
lower troposphere and surface temperatures over the past 20 years.
They don't show the actual amount of temperature change at the Earth's surface
Models can't predict the recent past, let alone the long-term future.

Antarctica has been cooling since 1966, directly contradicting model results
that suggest that warming will be more pronounced in the Earth's polar regions.
-- Nature magazine

the Antarctic ice sheet is expanding rather than shrinking,
contrary to what global-warming enthusiasts would have us believe.
-- Science magazine

---

REALITY:
Mt. Pinatubo, (just one of hundreds of active volcanoes) during a single "small" eruption
in 1991, emitted 20 Megatons of SO2. Compare this with the 18megatons of SO2
emissions for all of the US in 1995.

[MJY1288]

"Let me add that Rush and Drudge are not members of the liberal press out to get Bush"

I agree, but yesterday the NYT's strummed them like a cheap guitar

[SerpentDove]

>>But it seems the difference between you and me when it comes to the President, is that I believe he has earned my trust, so my view is that there are things that he knows that I don't, which mitigate what appears to be on the surface.<<

You are welcome to presume this. While I hope you are right, and I sincerely do, I do not go so far as to presume it. He has capitulated to Democratic ideals far too often for me to presume this.

>>For you, it was a betrayal and you no longer trust him to do the right thing, which belies your claims that you support him. <<

I hope he (against mounting evidence) that he does the right thing. You trust that he will. I guess this is a faith-issue after all, isn't it?

>> All I know is, whether you define yourself as a basher or not, you don't have much respect for the President..........and I do.<<

I wish he respected his conservative base enough to explain to us what he is doing from time to time, when many of us have honest concerns that our conservative principles are being walked on. But I suppose that is too much to ask, and those who express concern are to be dismissed as troublemakers and placed in "the enemy camp."

[VRWC_minion]

You'll notice that the restrictions were not outrageously expensive and did not give the Environmentalists that much ammunition

Patently false. Freon is multiples cheaper than the replacement chemicals.

In addition the science on the ozone whole is as well founded as the global warming crap.

But let me guess is Bush were to push new restrictions on ODC's you would be up in arms ? Right ?

[SW6906]

"Humor me."

I'm waiting for Nick Danger to take you on. He must have better things to do, as do I right now.....

[Deb]

Rush used to know the NYT is the corrupt mouthpiece of the Democrat party. He also used to know that the Bushies don't leak. If they are the source of a story they say so and it first goes to FOX News, then the Washington Times. Only phony leaks (created by the reporter himself) and false stories end up in the Washington Post and NYT. During the entire length of the Clinton presidency Rush knew this and talked about it all the time. Suddenly he's accepting unsourced stories from the Wash. Post and NYT as Gospel. Weird.

I appreciate your response. Thanks.

[concerned about politics]

Anyone happen to know when the "Patriot Act" sunsets?

I asked that same question when it was being signed. There is no deadline, so far as anyone could come up with.

[gramho12]

Hm-m-m. I never said it was Clinton's fault, just that Bush and his administration have been ham-stringed the first year with delays and a little thing called war. How did you get there from my comments?

[Badray]

" HEY .. I've been stuck on the phone with her for 3 hours now and she keeps repeating the SAME story over and over LOL"

Are you sure you're not talking to my mom? LOL