Bad Kids in Class [Palm Beach teachers: 'We leave teaching because of kids' bad behavior.']

Bad kids in class

By Shannon Colavecchio and Kimberly Miller, Palm Beach Post Staff Writers

During an unruly school assembly at Forest Hill High, a student hit veteran English teacher Tadziu Trotsky upside the head as he tried to maintain order. The strike left his temple swollen.

Trotsky has watched students tear down blinds in his classroom and walked in to find their obscene messages written on the walls.

He has been cursed at countless times and called unprintable names by students who didn't feel like doing his assignments or following his orders.

"After a while, you don't want to say anything to the kids because you're afraid of what they'll do," he said.

Little by little during his 35-year teaching career, Trotsky's excitement for teaching great literary works waned in the face of these increasingly defiant students, who are too busy calling him names and destroying the classroom to care much about Othello and Robert Frost.

By the time he left the school in 1996, even the honors students were coming in with bad attitudes.

"It was awful, gut-wrenching really," said Trotsky, who now teaches at the Sabal Palm alternative school in West Palm Beach. Sabal Palm is one of 29 district alternative education programs, established especially for students with repeated, serious discipline problems.

Ironically, Trotsky finds the teaching is more tolerable at Sabal Palm because the school is strict enough and students' time managed tight enough that it cuts down on discipline problems.

During interviews with dozens of Palm Beach County teachers and school district officials, The Palm Beach Post heard account after account of chaotic classrooms where smart-aleck students make a habit of disobedience -- stealing teachers' attention and disrupting learning for the rest of the children.

Teachers interviewed said student discipline problems are the worst they've ever been, and district records show the number of student disciplinary infractions reported has risen sharply among middle schoolers. Teachers describe schools where administrators brush aside behavior problems for fear of a negative image or they're overwhelmed with other duties, and where parents provide little support to educators. Consider: At Roosevelt Middle School, a student spit in a teacher's coffee, and at West Riviera Elementary, two girls got into a fight so nasty that one smashed a coffee pot to use the sharp edges as a weapon. Students have thrown desks at teachers and threatened to have them beaten up.

Teachers -- often only in private teacher lounges or on the condition they not be identified -- complain that student behavior is their No. 1 problem, and it's getting worse.

Marjorie Haughton, a teacher at Belvedere Elementary in West Palm Beach, hasn't been hit or threatened or called bad names.

But she is leaving her profession this summer after 20 years because she is tired of constantly reprimanding her students and seeing her classroom control tactics fizzle amid students who are "deceitful."

She used to put marbles in jars, and the team of students who got the most marbles for good behavior would win a prize. Then students started putting their own marbles in the jars behind her back. If she wrote points on the blackboard for the teams to rack up, some student would brush by them "on accident" and erase the points.

"I'm tired of playing those games," she said. "It's a doggy biscuit training thing. If they don't see you holding the biscuit, they won't do the right thing just because it's the right thing to do."

School records for the past two school years -- 1999-2000 and 2000-2001 -- show unruly student behavior rose districtwide, up to 211,082 incidents last year from 205,605 incidents the year before.

It's difficult for teachers to teach and students to learn amid the misbehavior of a comparatively small number of children wreaking large amounts of havoc on the classroom.

Those unruly few cost the district $18.3 million each year in alternative education programs for them.

School officials attribute the deepening problem to a variety of factors: district administrators afraid they'll be sued for disciplining too harshly; principals, afraid of the "bad school" label, who downplay teachers' concerns; a societal shift that has left educators, in the eyes of both parents and students, at the bottom of the totem pole of respect; and broken families run by dysfunctional parents or relatives who don't know how to raise children.

Some have problems at home

Consider from a student's perspective:

A child at Okeeheelee Middle School started acting out. When administrators investigated, the student was found to be living by himself in a trailer home after his mother left him. A little girl at Barton Elementary has dreams about killing people. A grandmother is raising eight children, one of whom is falling asleep in class because she has to help take care of her siblings.

"In the old days, when I was in school, teachers got classrooms where students were ready and willing to learn," said Alison Adler, director of the district's Safe Schools Center. "Now you get students with barriers like being behind academically, coming from unstable homes. They get frustrated and they act out."

Adler conceded it's mostly discipline problems -- and not low salaries or the school violence concerns that have garnered so much attention -- that beat down teachers and prompt many of them to flee the profession.

"The bulk of the problems in our classrooms are the three D's: disruptive behavior, disorderly conduct, disrespectful language," Adler said.

Discipline is especially problematic in middle schools, according to a Palm Beach Post analysis of school district figures, based on incidents reported by school administrators.

Students in the district's middle schools last year committed 108,630 incidents, from stealing and pulling a false fire alarm to cheating and battery. That averages to three incidents for every middle school student.

Most significantly, just over two-thirds of those incidents -- 75,970 -- were discipline problems affecting the classroom: disruptive behavior, disobedience and insubordination, rules violations and disrespectful language.

Last year's incidents in those categories marked a 13 percent increase from the 1999-2000 year, when administrators reported 89,959 incidents, or 2.6 incidents for every middle school student. Of that year's total, 66,012 incidents reported were for disruptive behavior, disobedience and insubordination, rules violations and disrespectful language.

The numbers are not as high in elementary and high schools, where reported incidents actually decreased from 1999-2000 to 2000-2001. But students in grades K-5 and 9-12 have the same tendency toward the "three D's" as middle schoolers, according to The Post analysis.

For example, high school administrators last year reported 74,793 incidents, or nearly two incidents per student. Of the incidents, 49,264 were cases of disobedience, disruptive behavior, rules violations and disrespectful language.

In elementary schools, 19,483 of the 27,659 incidents reported last year were in those categories.

Dave Benson of the district's Safe Schools Center, which keeps track of student discipline reports, cautioned that the statistics might not accurately reflect what's going on from one school to the next.

One principal might be vigilant about documenting every student who comes into the principal's office; another might handle incidents like back-talking and cursing without paperwork.

And changes in reporting requirements from year to year have left many administrators confused about how to document incidents, Benson said. Just this year, district officials unveiled a new, more uniform reporting form for administrators that has a host of new categories, including "repetitive disobedience" and "disruptive play."

Teachers counter that some administrators aren't confused; they just don't report everything because they don't want to paint a less-than-rosy picture of their schools.

Action taken immediately

Egret Lake Elementary Principal Amy Sansbury said she tries to handle discipline problems immediately and has even hired a special teacher whose only job is to work with misbehaving students.

"We need to be able to provide teachers with the means to be able to teach the whole time they are in the classroom," Sansbury said.

But principals also admit that support is inconsistent.

Ellyn Smith, president-elect of the Florida Association of Elementary and Middle School Principals, said problems with contacting parents sometimes can make it appear that the administration is dragging its heels on discipline issues.

Most principals address problems based on the severity of the incident, Smith said. This could leave teachers with minor misbehavior issues waiting while bigger problems are addressed.

"The teacher may feel that it should be dealt with immediately, but there could be extenuating circumstances that delay the issue," Smith said.

Middle school special education teacher Jay Back said he spends 30 percent of his time dealing with student behavior. That's 16 minutes in each class period, leaving just 34 minutes for actual instruction.

During a year's time, maintaining student discipline eats up 48 hours from each of Back's classes.

Students who repeatedly misbehave in class also carry a hefty price tag for taxpayers.

If the students are placed in one of the district's 29 alternative education programs, the annual individual cost to educate them could climb from about $5,150 to $8,051.

Nearly 2,300 Palm Beach County students are now in alternative education programs, whose annual budgets total $18.3 million. Much of that money goes to keeping class sizes at 17 students.

The majority of alternative education schools, some of which are run by the Department of Juvenile Justice or contracted out to private companies, are for students with discipline problems.

And there's no shortage of applicants. Nearly 800 students were reviewed for alternative education seats before the beginning of this semester, recommended for placement by frustrated administrators or parents.

"Alternative education is expensive, and if you want to help kids, you need funding," said Shelley Vana, president of Palm Beach County Classroom Teachers Association. "We don't want teachers worrying that if they put a student out of their classroom, another teacher in the school will have to handle it. We want the student put in a school where they'll get help."

Superintendent Art Johnson says maintaining discipline requires a constant vigil.

"Curriculum is the lifeblood of the school, and discipline is the backbone, the spine that holds things up," Johnson said. "If you don't have that discipline, that structure, learning doesn't happen."

A no-nonsense system can be implemented districtwide, but "it takes a considerable amount of time when you're talking about 150 schools," led by administrators with different styles and levels of experience, he said.

Teachers must set the tone

Education experts say teachers must set the tone of the classroom from the first day. Yet in most colleges and universities, courses in classroom management aren't required for a teaching certificate. Moreover, teachers say student behavior shouldn't be all their responsibility.

Where are the parents, they ask.

"You simply can't put this all on teachers," said University of Virginia professor Robert Pianta, who specializes in classroom management and student behavior.

Sometimes, the problem lies in the parents, who can be as ill behaved as the students, Pianta said.

"I think every principal has had the experience when a child gets in trouble, we call the parents and they just come in and scream at us," said Terry Costa, principal of Christa McAuliffe Middle in suburban Boynton Beach. "I can't imagine my parents ever doing that. Years ago, I think there was a respect that entire families, our society, instilled for teachers."

But the problems vary from school to school and classroom to classroom.

Harry Winkler, a teacher at Forest Hill High since 1972, says his students are increasingly apathetic and disinterested in learning, but they generally don't misbehave.

Scott McNichols, a 26-year-old teacher at Westward Elementary School in West Palm Beach, said his fifth-grade students are so well behaved he rarely has to raise his voice.

He said he sets a serious tone in his classroom from day one and follows through with consequences for each student who breaks a rule.

"Every year, of course, it's something new," McNichols said. "Behavior management is one of those things where you just have to try different things and see what works for you."

Staff writer Mary Ellen Flannery and database editor Christine Stapleton contributed to this report.

The State educational bureaucracy operates at the beck and call of the teachers' unions. The administrators are largely former teachers. The state has told those kids that they are in charge. The kids are fed a steady diet of boredom, frustration, and guilt precisley as directed by NEA standards (the NEA adopted the UN global curriculum). If the parents do anything beyond finger wagging to harm their child's self-esteem or enforce discipline, the child is to complain to the teacher. Once they complain the teachers must report it. State child protective NAZIS come for visit. Both child and parent quickly learn who is in charge.

Then the State and the teachers blames the parents? Who do they think that they are kidding?

The State, the TV, and every other media institution informs the children that they have RIGHT to sexual freedom. They pay fat consulting fees to GLSEN for demonstrations, plays, and other twaddle. The kids are bathed in non-stop violence and sexuality. Those kids become abusive poverty-stricken parents and the whole thing starts over and the State gets all the welfare cases it could ever want. Budgets go up. Program Adminstrators are hired. Special certificates are allottes for special educational credentials with higher pay. We pay more for education now, in constant dollars, than ever. Media mavens waggle their tongues solemnly, "It's the parent's fault," "We don't have the funding."

Yeah, right. Nobody but a moron would teach such kids and that is much of what we get. When the unions got the State to take the power from parents: to control the curriculum, fire teachers, and discipline their kids, they earned ACCOUNTABILITY for the destruction we have seen. It's their own damn fault. If they don't like it they can stick it or give the power back to parents.

Twice you mentioned "beating children" in reference to school paddling.
Obvously you know NOTHING about paddling.

I was a rebelous kid in school and as a result, I recieved a few paddlings.
They were laughable in terms of physical punishment.

Now, later when my dad got home from work and learned about it, that was a different story.
I got whipped and it wasn`t laughable.My dad whipped me because he LOVED me and wanted me to grow up and be something other than a thug.
I know, as sure as the sun rises, if my dad hadn`t taught me respect, I would be dead or in prison now.

Teachers paddled kids because they cared about them getting an education. Nobody bacame a teacher "for the money"!

I liken the public schools here as cattle farms. Round them up in the morning, pen them in for the day and let them back out to wander the meadows at night. All that is missing is the cattle prod to keep the strays in line.

"You simply can't put this all on teachers," said University of Virginia professor Robert Pianta, who specializes in classroom management and student behavior.

True. I did find some good teachers at these schools, but they were few and far between. Their hands are tied for the most part. They do have a boss you know. You may think it is the parents, but it's not, it's the administration. I've also found that those teachers interested in pleasing their boss, don't want any help with the classroom. The teachers that are interested in doing what's best for the children, jump up and down for joy when a parent offers assistance.

My youngest son had a teacher (5th grade science) that constantly lectured the poor kids with the plight of the rain forest, day in and day out. My guess is that his religion was environmentalism. My son would come home and monitor my garbage tossing habits. Recycle, Recycle, don't use paper plates, paper towels, we need to save the rain forest, it will be the end of us all if we don't save the forest. He would set on the floor and cut open the little circles of the plastic 6 pack soda can holders. The rings can get caught on fish, manatees, pelicans, etc. I'd tell him that I never throw my garbage into the ocean, I pay for it to be delivered to the local dump. He still insisted on cutting them up.

Sometimes, the problem lies in the parents, who can be as ill behaved as the students, Pianta said. "I think every principal has had the experience when a child gets in trouble, we call the parents and they just come in and scream at us," said Terry Costa, principal of Christa McAuliffe Middle in suburban Boynton Beach. "I can't imagine my parents ever doing that. Years ago, I think there was a respect that entire families, our society, instilled for teachers."

I've found that those parents with unruly children are and can be even worse than the child. They yell, throw fits, usually in the presence of their children, aimed at getting the administration to cave and the adminstration usually does whatever it takes to placate the parent. Now what did that child just learn at that moment? Do you think he'll try it the next day on his teacher? In essence, all a parent has to do is go into the principals office and throw a big hissy fit and they get what they want, just like a spoiled rotten little child.

That reminds me of a complaint my uncle was voicing to me one day. He is a city councilman and was complaining about his fellow council members. They had all agreed, before the public meeting to vote one way on a particular proposal before the city. During the meeting two people (members of the public) stood up in opposition of the proposal. All of his fellow council members flipped their vote and he was the only one that voted as originally agreed upon.

I think the major problem is that nobody has a backbone these days. People cave everywhere. From the manager at the local department store with an irate customer, to school administrations and irate parents, to elected officials and irate constituents. Principles, morals, responsibility are all up for redefining, like "is".

Maybe teachers need to gather together and start yelling and throwing temper tantrums in the principals office everyday? :-)

Twice you mentioned "beating children" in reference to school paddling. Obvously you know NOTHING about paddling. I was a rebelous kid in school and as a result, I recieved a few paddlings. They were laughable in terms of physical punishment. Now, later when my dad got home from work and learned about it, that was a different story. I got whipped and it wasn`t laughable.

Perhaps I don't know anything about "school paddling" since fortunately, it was outlawed by the time I was in school, but to me, any physical discipline directed at a young child is physically/psychologically harmful. You might have been a thug at age 16, but were you a thug at age 4, 5? Besides some very extreme cases, what could a 4 or 5 year old child ever do to warrant a beating, no matter how laughable one may think it is? And just because your dad happened to be really abusive towards you doesn't take away from the fact that the paddlings were abusive too. Please excuse the hyperbole, but if person A cut off my finger and Person B Cut off my arm, does that make what person A did acceptable just because Person B's crime was far more egregious?

But you're taking my comments out of context. I was making the point to Appy Pappy (who is a member of onemilliondads.com - a pro-censorship faction of the AFA that aims to get shows which they deem "offensive" removed from the air) that he was being a hypocrite. He blamed television shows for violent tendencies in children and aimed to have shows cancelled to protect his children from violence, yet at the same time, was a proponant of corporal punishment. I argued that his efforts were misdirected. Before he went on a crusade to censor television shows, perhaps he should stop beating his kids. Perhaps that's where their violent tendencies were originating from. Its just like Tipper Gore and the PMRC. God forbid the little children hear some four letter words in a song! That would be the end of the world . . . but its okay to KILL THEM while they're still in the womb.

My other point was that for someone who wanted to protect his children from all the evils of the world, the fact that he was willing to put the right to beat or paddle or whatever you want to call it back in the hands of non-family entities was highly negligent. Everyday on FR there is a new story about a teacher that breeches parental trust or does something completely out there with his/her pupils. If we reintroduced the right to physically discipline children, the floodgates would really open and the children would only get hurt more in the end.

My dad whipped me because he LOVED me and wanted me to grow up and be something other than a thug. I know, as sure as the sun rises, if my dad hadn`t taught me respect, I would be dead or in prison now.

No offense, but I think the whole "my dad whipped me cause he loved me" comment is sick and reeks of Stockholm Syndrome, but hey, if it worked for you, then good. But I doubt its because of your dad. Its because of your character. What about the good kids who are beaten and grow up to become thugs BECAUSE of the abuse and not the contrary? It been proven that kids who are beaten as children are a gazillion times more likely to be abusive themselves when they are older, have anger management issues, etc. than kids who are not. An astonishing percentage of criminals in this country were beaten as children. Abusive behavior is learned. Its not innate. There are better ways to discipline your children than beat them.

Yes, I did see that on O'Reilly. For once Gloria Allred is on the right side of things (Proving the point that a stopped clock is right twice a day).

What that case goes to show is that how good/poor a school (private or public) is dependent largely upon the attitude from the top. The principal in that case (as in my wife's Catholic School experience) allowed the school to become a free for all. The teachers got no support and the kids got the message that harassing teachers and acting like animals was permitted.

However, in my wife's current school (and the private schools you speak of), such activity is not permitted by the principal and punishment is severe. I don't care if its the richest or poorest district, if the teachers and kids know the principal will tolerate no bad behavior, the school will run well.

Re your post #96 - You're right. And, that's why some private school will tell a parent, point-blank, that if their kid has already been kicked out of the public school system, the private school will NOT enroll the student. Other private schools are different. It all depends.

There was recently a longterm study done, and reported over the weekend in USA Today, about the benefits of small class size -- and, the study found the benefit was minimal. What had much greater impact was the environment of the entire school, regardless of whether the school was large or small, public or private, or located in an urban, rural or suburb. The environment of the school had a greater influence on the student's behavior, conduct and achievement than the size of the class in every case. Meaning: Does the school tolerate the students' misbehavior?

People would be surprised to find out that in some schools, the teachers are told by the administrators NOT to ever send a kid to the office, period. The teacher alone is supposed to deal with every incident. And, frankly, that can take a lot of time away from teaching.

In Asian families, education is highly valued. The Asian student gets that message early on,

Isn't it considered embarrassing to be uneducated in the Asian community?

I know that from the time when my children knew how to behave out in public (and I'm talking a year old at the youngest), it was impressed upon them not to embarrass themselves or our family. Bad public behavior is considered an embarrassment to our entire family. Because of this, my boys are delights to take out in public. Polite and discreet and cheerful. We talk and discuss things without even considering a discipline problem.

I had a woman in Walmart ask me once if my boys always behaved so well...a complete stranger! She startled me and I said "Oh, yes!" Then she told me that she hates to bring her kids out in public! Can you believe it?

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