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Love is ... life without the pitter-patter of tiny feet (Angry Feminist alert!)
Sydney Morning Herald ^ | 1/2/2 | Rachel Roberts

Posted on 01/02/2002 6:49:27 AM PST by dead

Is it really so hard to understand, asks Rachel Roberts, that there can be more to a couple's relationship than having children?

I am one of a growing number of women who will elect not to have children. And at least in my experience, the decision to not have children isn't one that is met with much enthusiasm.

From the family, there are comments like "But don't you want us all to have kids playing together at birthday parties and barbecues?" and "I've just always thought that part of a couple's life together is having a family".

From friends, there are protests like "But you'd make such great parents!" or "You've had such a good family life, don't you want to re-create that yourself?"

On the whole, though, the standard response is scepticism. Brush-offs. "Oh, you say that now, but wait till you turn 30!" And "I thought that, too, when I was your age but, trust me, that biological clock really gets you."

Well, I am fast approaching 30 and I have never been surer that I don't want children. My partner feels the same. We have thought about it a lot and have decided time and again that no, it's not for us. We don't want to be woken up at all hours to attend a screaming infant that knows only the need to suck. We don't want to sacrifice our time and energy chasing death-defying toddlers or taxiing around teenagers who have recently learnt to hate us.

More importantly, neither of us (me, especially) wants to see my body torn asunder during childbirth. We already love our life the way it is, child-free. And that is why the brush-off response interests me the most.

It's as though those who either have, or some day want, children refuse to recognise other possibilities in life. They are mentally closing off to paths different from their well-worn one. Particularly for women, it seems that in the face of all political and cultural change, we can always rely on some things staying the same.

Thirty years on from second-wave feminism, people are still incredulous of the woman who declares she doesn't want to be a mother.

Feminists have long argued that the social and political resistance to women who choose to remain child-free reflects a far deeper cultural anxiety about what is expected of women. Traditional femininity is inextricably bound up with notions of mothering, nurturance and birth.

Since day dot, motherhood has been viewed as the natural female career. And now, thanks to an enduring belief in biological determinism, the desire to bear children continues to be seen in terms of instinct, as a drive that is universally hard-wired into the female psyche. To be a normal woman, we must at least want children, even if for some reason we cannot have them.

Yeah, yeah, I hear you say, we've all done Feminism 101 - tell us something we don't know. Well, having experienced the reactions couples meet when revealing that they do not want children, I suspect there is something more at play than simply challenging the traditional ideology that surrounds women. Certainly a woman who elects not to have children is treading a less orthodox path. However, it's not just the woman's decision to not have children that disturbs convention, but the man's as well. As partners they upset traditional understandings of what heterosexual love is about. Why do I think this? Well, when was the last time any of us saw a romantic film where one lover whispers to the other "I love you so much, darling, I never want to have your baby!" It just wouldn't seem right.

From wedding ceremonies to popular culture, we are saturated with the idea that children are the symbol of a man and woman's love for each other. Undoubtedly the outcome of their physical union, children are moreover portrayed as the embodiment of a couple's emotional bond. The place where a man and woman's DNA and souls enmesh.

Having children remains integral to our contemporary mythology of love and desire, and those couples who reject parenthood disappoint our romantic expectations. They let us down by not making what is seen as the ultimate declaration of heterosexual love.

So perhaps that is why society shrugs off couples who don't want children. Perhaps the sceptical comments from family and friends reflect an unwillingness to accept romantic defeat. At the very least, it shows a distinct lack of imagination when it comes to recognising signs of love.

After all, for couples like us, the real romance is in being child-free.

Rachel Roberts is a freelance writer.


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To: discostu
should some one partake of something they do not enjoy, is that something still "best" if they, for whatever reason, have no capacity to find the experience pleasurable or desirable?

No. But look at it this way--somebody's blind; should they go to an art museum, or be a painter or racecar driver? No. But my point is that it's a fallacy to say "well, that's just as good." It's not. It's the best the blind man can hope for, but people with sight shouldn't pluck out their eyes, nor should they say, "well, I guess seeing isn't for everybody!"

Because best, in all things, is a matter of taste and choice and what's best for you has little if any bearing on what's best for me.

What if my taste runs to raping and murdering virgins? It's my choice, and what's best for you has little if any bearing on what's best for me.

You and I both know at bottom that position is ridiculous. Is there a human nature? Yes. Does it involve children? Absolutlely, or there wouldn't be "humans" to have a "nature." Your argument only applies in matters of taste. Children are not a matter of taste, but some are not suited to raising children, just as some have not the vision to become pilots or the wits to become mathematicians. But those people have a defect when viewed against the best human soul; even people who give up childbearing to pursue holier paths have souls that love children. Not liking kids is a flaw in your soul.

221 posted on 01/02/2002 1:58:46 PM PST by Pistias
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To: Askel5
So you're saying the majority of the time you've had sex it resulted in a pregnancy? Every time you have sex and there isn't a pregnancy it's non-procreative.
222 posted on 01/02/2002 2:02:48 PM PST by discostu
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To: Pistias
"To sacrifice the things of this world to focus on the things of the next are dear to Him--though I would hesitate to comment on the priesthood."

You know, I don't want to argue with anyone about having children, but the things of the "next" that are dearest to my Lord are surely the souls of my childen. There is no greater beauty in this world that I can offer up to Him.

God bless.

223 posted on 01/02/2002 2:03:37 PM PST by joathome
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To: discostu
poise, attitude, false fronts, that kind of stuff.

You're getting warmer...

for some it greatly impedes it because of the massive layer of fear that threat adds.

Of what? And to what? Don't stop now, you're nearly there.

224 posted on 01/02/2002 2:04:45 PM PST by Pistias
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To: Emmanual_Goldstein16
We're all childish to someone.

I don't have a problem with this woman not wanting a child. Children should be brought up in an atmosphere of love. They should be wanted. At least this woman is smart enough to reliaze she couldn't handle the responsibility of having a child. Unlike someone like Andrea Yates who has them only to drown them ....

225 posted on 01/02/2002 2:05:41 PM PST by Utopia
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To: joathome
That's why I speak with hesitancy. There is not a shred of doubt that the Lord's plan includes faithful, loving parents like yourself, however. Yours in the Faith,
226 posted on 01/02/2002 2:06:15 PM PST by Pistias
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To: Phantom Lord
Yeah I think you got it right. The "look at us we're so much more enlightened" condescending arrogant attitude prevalent among the spoiled children of liberalism.
227 posted on 01/02/2002 2:08:45 PM PST by a_federalist
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To: dead
Too bad her mother didn't choose to be child-free.
228 posted on 01/02/2002 2:09:49 PM PST by zonealarm
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To: ArrogantBustard
You don't know what is really going on. You are making general remarks about a child, and you don't know what is really going on in the home.

Even the best of kids misbehave. I'm sure you did as a child, and I'm sure that I did. It's part of childhood.

I just think that there are a lot of unsympathetic people around that don't understand that there really could be a problem with the child. I'm not talking about ADHD or ADD. I think those are almost made up disorders for normal children.

I'm talking about kids with real problems like brain damage, genetic disorders that affect their development, etc. You can't always tell by looking at a kid if they have a problem. My daughter looks perfectly normal, but she has brain damage.

I think we need to focus on how to help these children (and their parents) that don't know how to control themselves. I've been told that I could put my daughter on medication. Well, I'd rather have a child that has tantrums occasionally then put her on medication all the time.

I also know that sometimes you have to take your children out when you really don't want to. You may have a sick child, and you have to drag them to the doctor, then the grocery store, and then the drug store. Even a well-behaved child could have a melt-down from something like that.

229 posted on 01/02/2002 2:10:10 PM PST by luckystarmom
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To: discostu
I'm not -- and couldn't possibly -- negate the very real aspect that is the interpersonal penetration of two souls. It doesn't get much closer than that.

"Love" and "Life" are the two essential aspects of conjugal love. <>P With the exception of strictly casual, animal copulation enabled and encouraged by our secular society and federal government (as a means to pre-empt the bonds and sovereignty that are a marriage and family's due), sex is a magnificent and most pleasurable means of expressing love for another.

But the purely objective and natural result of sex is procreation. Contraception not only degrades the act by removing its essential potency, it precludes the conjugal act from fulfilling its essential nature of total self-giving and receiving.

Stripped of their natural dignity and potency -- and, most of all, their sovereignty that is Self-Mastery -- men and women dumb themselves down.

By the use of contraceptives, they not only reject Life loud and clear -- seeking to plan it and partake of it only on their own terms -- they transfer the natural dominion of man over things and animals to Themselves. They manipulate themselves by negating their essential potency as co-creators.

Take a look around you ... the evidence of our degradation (particularly that of women) abounds.

This concerted and constant abuse of the will to degrade and manipulate the Self conditions us to further manipulation by the same State who imposed contraception on us ... by first seeking to eradicate Undesirables.

"Freedom" does not consist in rendering one's choices moot of consequence. The greater part of freedom is sometimes restraint. We are no longer a free people. We were doomed the moment we caved to the Sexual Revolution which rendered us little more than prize pigs at the State Fair only too happy to rut at will and call it "liberation" because our sexual relations no longer entailed real Obligations to each other or threatened the introduction of a New Life which was not expressly wanted, Genetically Perfect and -- by all means -- Economically Feasible.

230 posted on 01/02/2002 2:13:47 PM PST by Askel5
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To: discostu
Every time you have sex and there isn't a pregnancy it's non-procreative.

It's still got the potential to be potent.

As a bonus, it's absolutely free from reliance on third parties, plastics, pills, drugs, needles, suppositories, foams, creams, jellies, sponges and whatever else "liberated" sex needs to be "free".

231 posted on 01/02/2002 2:18:52 PM PST by Askel5
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Thank you for clearing this matter up for me. I had no idea that I was such a horrible person!

My wife and I don't want kids either. And the bigotry she is faced with at work -- and that's what it is, bigotry -- is so severe that the last time she changed jobs she decided to LIE about the kid issue when asked. Now, instead of saying, "we aren't planning on having kids," she has chosen to say, "yeah, someday," because if she doesn't lie the Mommy Mafia will make life hard on her. Her supervisors are part of the Mommy Mafia; if they look down on her for any arbitrary personal reason it will have (HAS had) an impact on her career path.

(Meanwhile the woman with 3 kids by 3 different ex-husbands, well, everyone coos over her and her brood. That's a better lifestyle choice? I don't think so.)

At the earlier workplace she wasn't Making a Big Deal out of her views, by the way, she was just giving an honest and answer when asked... but the intolerance of her coworkers was remarkably unpleasant nonetheless.

So please, all of you who are down on the no-kids crowd, just stuff it! Don't make guesses about the sham that our non-kid relationships must be, or about how "selfish" and "empty" we are. Don't become embittered and hateful because we have made a lifestyle decision that you don't like. *It doesn't concern you.* How can you get so worked up over an "injustice" to someone who isn't even conceived yet?

Frankly, the hostility we see makes us think that many people with kids must feel like they have made a terrible mistake... The loudest of you often sound like you are jealous. You go on about how those 3AM feedings are the best thing in the world and it sounds just a little nutty!

In the end isn't it better to be honest with yourself about what you want from life? We have been, and we have chosen no kids. You can say it's our loss and we'll be sorry and that's fine, that's fair. Maybe you are right. But you are NOT right to say that we are flawed, horrible people.
232 posted on 01/02/2002 2:19:14 PM PST by MattS
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To: Pistias
No. But look at it this way--somebody's blind; should they go to an art museum, or be a painter or racecar driver? No. But my point is that it's a fallacy to say "well, that's just as good." It's not. It's the best the blind man can hope for, but people with sight shouldn't pluck out their eyes, nor should they say, "well, I guess seeing isn't for everybody!"
What if my taste runs to raping and murdering virgins? It's my choice, and what's best for you has little if any bearing on what's best for me.

At these junctures you're just taking it to a rediculous position errecting strawmen for your own pleasure. That's more reply than those paragraphs deserve.

You and I both know at bottom that position is ridiculous. Is there a human nature? Yes. Does it involve children? Absolutlely, or there wouldn't be "humans" to have a "nature."

Right on one wrong on two. Children (reproduction) are wrapped up in the survival instinct which, to various degrees, is shared by all living things. Strictly speaking not part of human nature just a part of nature in the big picture. One of the big parts of human nature is our desire to override nature in the big picture. We've done it since the first cave painting, we strive for ways other than reproduction to achieve some level of immortality. We leave our mark on the world in other ways, when in doubt we come up with languages so we can record our thoughts and instruct people, nurturing without breeding.

Your argument only applies in matters of taste.

Everything is a matter of taste to some degree. Eventually everyone makes a decision on children based on "taste", that's how we make decisions. The most basic being how many to have. If you can't accept 0 as a valid answer that's not my problem. But any arguement you come up with to assault that answer can be equally applied as to why your answer should be increased.

Children are not a matter of taste, but some are not suited to raising children, just as some have not the vision to become pilots or the wits to become mathematicians. But those people have a defect when viewed against the best human soul; even people who give up childbearing to pursue holier paths have souls that love children. Not liking kids is a flaw in your soul.

Ahh and here we finally get to the real crux. The actual reason why people get such a bent biscuit when they encounter those that don't want kids. You think there's something wrong with my soul. Fortunately that's not for you to decide. You can go ahead and think that. Luckily I know you're full of it. My soul is AOK. I've found other ways to achieve my immortality, one that allows me to maintain a quiet life sans diapers and all the other accoutrements of child rearing. Maybe the real thing is that you're jealous. Annoyed that people have found ways to be happy and whole that you're missing. You shouldn't be, I'm not. Everybody has to make their own path, yours has kids mine doesn't. I don't consider either superior to the other. Mine is better for me, but just me I make no claims to its value for anyone else.

233 posted on 01/02/2002 2:19:23 PM PST by discostu
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To: dead
I am a guy. This is not an interesting topic. It is used to fill in on a slow news day. How about something of wider interest. Like....best tires or what waxes one has had good luck with (I like both Mothers & Mcquiars(sp)). Now THERE are 2 of many interesting topics.
234 posted on 01/02/2002 2:24:18 PM PST by Khurkris
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To: discostu
No disrespect again, but I'm getting a chuckle because I don't care for other people's children very much and am relieved when they go home, however I adore my own. I don't think the childfree are the only ones who get tense or feel overwhelmed around other folks children. I think part of this is actually not about disliking children now that I'm think about it, but about being paralized by parents nowadays who don't want anyone but them disciplining thier children even when thier children are absolutel unruly. It makes it difficult to be around running and screaming children when you can't interceed and tell them to stop something they are doing wrong.
235 posted on 01/02/2002 2:25:59 PM PST by glory
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To: Pistias
What that I fear pregnancy? Damn straight I do. To me a pregnant wife would be the ultimate catch 22, I literally have no options. No way in hell I'd opt for an abortion. The adoption system in this country is so FUBAR I'd never dump a living thinking creature into it. And I absolutely will not live with a child. Home is a place for relaxation, having had child visitors (and even a couple of unfortunate overnight stays) I know there is no relaxation for me if there is a child in house (notice how with a child home becomes a house). If I were a member of some royal family I could give the kid over to a nanny and only see them on holidays. But I'm not a royal, I would have no escape (other than the one my father took, which simply will not do).

Knowing I'm one fertilization away from a completely untenable situation makes the thought of pregnancy absolutely terrifying. So I married a woman that's almost garaunteed infertile. I ain't no dumby.

236 posted on 01/02/2002 2:27:18 PM PST by discostu
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To: MattS
Where the heck do you live? In all the years I've worked I've never had coworkers ask about whether or not I have kids.
I have plenty of friends who don't have kids. I could care less. This article irritates because of the condescending attitude, not because of the choice not to have kids.
237 posted on 01/02/2002 2:29:23 PM PST by a_federalist
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To: dead
Yes, she doesn't need to be multiplying, and unless the dork she married is as bitter as she is, their marriage will last under five years, isn't that the national average?
238 posted on 01/02/2002 2:31:53 PM PST by MissAmericanPie
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To: Askel5
Interesting. I've never seen anyone lay it out that way (both lucid and not insulting, usually it's the later part that people fail at). I can't say that I agree, but I can understand.

As for our society our views are a little different. While certainly things are troubled, especially in the areas of sex and sexuality, there has been a rather natural cycle of society in history. The pendulum swings back and forth every couple hundred years between emotionless animal lust and absolute prudishness on all levels. The round trip is usually about 300 years give or take. We never seem to be able to stop at the happy medium (which we were in for the WWII years and those surounding, where sex is fun and all but everybody knows it's at its best in a relationship built to last), momentum in one direction or the other always pushes us too far. This cycle has been going on for a long time (at least back to Pompeii) and I've learned not to sweat it.

239 posted on 01/02/2002 2:37:47 PM PST by discostu
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To: dead
,,, the inherent social advantage with Rachel's line of thought is that her self centered interest precludes her from reproducing herself - the ultimate birth control tool for zero value feminists.
240 posted on 01/02/2002 2:40:03 PM PST by shaggy eel
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