Posted on 11/30/2021 7:56:45 PM PST by karpov
A woman who says she was sexually abused by Jeffrey Epstein testified on Tuesday that Ghislaine Maxwell helped lure her into his orbit when she was just 14 and described how the depraved duo were “giggling” when they first molested her together.
The alleged victim, an actress identified by the pseudonym “Jane” in court, said she was at Epstein’s Palm Beach, Florida, mansion in 1994 when the pedophile and his accused madam led her upstairs to his bedroom, moved her over to the bed and “took their clothes off.”
“They started to sort of like fondle each other,” she said, adding that they were “casually giggling” as she stood there.
“He asked me to take my top off,” the witness continued. “Then there were hands everywhere and Jeffrey proceeded to masturbate again. And Ghislaine was like rubbing on him, kissing on him.”
Other times, Jane said the sick pair would lead her to a massage table inside a room at the house and show her how Epstein liked to be rubbed down.
“During these incidents did Maxwell ever touch your body?” Assistant US Attorney Alison Moe asked.
...
The witness — one of four alleged victims mentioned in the indictment against the British socialite — was the first accuser to take the stand at the Manhattan trial, telling jurors how Maxwell was there when she was abused by Epstein, at least through the age of 16.
“I don’t know, but more than twice,” the woman said when asked how many times Maxwell was present when Epstein abused her.
“It’s hard to remember because I was abused pretty much every time I would go over to his house and it all started to seem the same after a while.”
(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...
I told no lie and did no slander. What lie or slander did I do?
Yes she kept going back. There are lots of ways minors, immature persons, keep going back to do things they aren’t sure about. They think they might be wrong. Those pushing them are way more cunning and forceful. They fear being found out for previous exploitation, feeling guilty for having been a victim. They question their judgement. They are scared of consequences. There is peer pressure. There is other pressure, even from other adults. There is a desire to conform. There is a need to be loved and accepted. OK?
We deal with these pressures as adults too. But as adults we are mature enough to find our spine most of the time.
That is a major difference between an ADULT and a MINOR.
Agreed. Maybe she felt pressured into engaging in these acts, but so far I haven’t heard any testimony that indicates she was physically forced to take part or threatened with force. Maybe that will come out eventually, but so far - no. I’m not saying that Epstein and Maxwell aren’t sleazebags, and their actions in this instance may have been illegal, but to call it rape seems to be a stretch. Statutory rape? Yes. But statutory rape is a far cry from non-statutory rape. I don’t even know why the term statutory rape is used. Maybe “Sex With a Minor”, would be a better term. It’s less misleading than “Statutory Rape” because it accurately and clearly describes the offense. And even “Sex With a Minor” can be misleading. Minor is a legal term covering people under a certain age. In most states anyone under 18 years is considered a minor, but who in their right mind would lump sex with a willing 17 year old together with sex with an 8 year old? And even most 14 year olds are a far cry from an 8 ear old.
There are rumors that Epstein and Maxwell were engaged in much worse behavior on “Epstein Island” than what’s currently being discussed in court. If any of those stories are true, then their both guilty of the most horrendous acts imaginable, and deserve to be punished to the fullest extent of the law. But that’s a separate issue.
yup, i agree
minor is a legal term, which is often an arbitrary number and changes on jurisdiction and country
minor really doesnt reflect individual maturity of the person
there are more mature 14 year olds than some 18 year olds
further these same people who say 14 year olds don’t know anything and are only able to be manipulared and don’t manipulate others themselves, are the exact same people that will say in another conversation, kids today grow up so fast, they know so much more than we ever did at their age
so lets not look at the world through candyland glasses
think about Traci Lords and what she deliberately chose to do
she made a career out of what she did, she knew exactly what she wanted to do, deliberately fooled people and lied about her real information, and did it, and then when the secret came out she cried victim and people bought it
imdont mention this to equate this girl who was used by these two pervs, but i bring it up to the fact that “minor” doesn’t mean immature or not worldly enough to understand what they are doing
plenty of adults don’t fully understand every aspect of what they do or are considering doing
they are legally adults, sure, and that puts the responsibility on them
but that adult may also be less mature than that 14 year old minor who comprehends what they are doing and keeps going back again and again
the bottom line is that what was going on with the two adults, really didn’t bother her that much. minors have a tendency to blab about stuff they really don’t like, or act weird to the point mom and dad grill them because they’re tired of the mopey kid for weeks, or better yet, tell police or some adult in authority they more or less trust
she never did any of this, kept going back, it wasn’t that bad to her
but that makes her look bad socially, so now that it all comes out, she has to now position herself so that she’s on the other side of it, otherwise she’s someone who appeared to not be bothered about it
So, you are admitting that your original statement was flawed.
In contrast to your original statement, a young girl CAN engage in sexual activity repeatedly and then years later say it was wrong, it was assault and she was victimized.
You are just saying that 14 year olds can’t do it.
I am asking where your line is.
Can 13 year olds?
Can 12 year olds?
Can 11 year olds?
I happen to think that the age of consent laws SHOULD NOT be lowered to allow older predators to prey on young girls as you seem to be advocating.
Agreed. Those are all good points. It’s good to see some common sense on the subject rather than the usual reflexive outrage one sees so often around here.
Our laws define various types of murder based on the circumstances (e.g. first degree, second degree, etc.). In the same way, laws regarding sex with minors should also be defined to reflect the wide range of individual circumstances currently covered by the term “Statutory Rape” - a loaded phrase if ever I’ve seen one.
I’m not “advocating” anything. Nothing in my posts says that. Thats disengenuous and just incorrect.
I have just made statements on observations and people who don’t like them, put forth theirmown words and motives and conclusions i didn’t say, and then attack those straw arguments.
People here should watch the documentary about Epstein, although full disclosure it is sickening. They prayed on the poor neighborhoods inland from Palm Beach.
One detail. This girl could have avoided the abuse by becoming a groomer herself. Gizzy and Epstein would pay a bounty for new girls and even relieve the old girl from having to service him.
"if you keep going back to a situation you later on decide you don’t like, you are ok with it. you don’t get to change your mind later
after multiple times of doing the same stuff over and over again"
You are saying this about the 14 year old girl in question.
Again, my question is...If 14 year old girls don't get do it (in your opinion).....CAN 12 YEAR OLD GIRLS DO IT???
Why is this so hard to answer?
It seems you think that 14 year old girls are mature enough to consent to sex. I think that is sick.
I never said All 14 year old girls are. I think someare, and some aren’t. Not everyone is at the same maturity level because they are merely the same age.
I am only talking about this one particular girl.
You dont seem to comprehend that.
Ghislaine Maxwell declines to testify as defense rests case
https://apnews.com/article/ghislaine-maxwell-trial-defense-rests-b126c3a57e66d9003757eda956a756b9
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.