Posted on 11/23/2021 9:18:55 AM PST by ChicagoConservative27
Jurors in the Ahmaud Arbery slay case started deliberating Tuesday over the fate of the three white men accused of killing the black unarmed jogger in Georgia last year.
Gregory McMichael, 65, his son Travis McMichael, 35, and their neighbor William “Roddie” Bryan, 52, are charged with murder, aggravated assault and other crimes in the shooting death of Arbery, 25, who they suspected was fleeing a burglary as he ran through their neighborhood near Brunswick.
Superior Court Judge Timothy Walmsley told the jurors Tuesday, “It is your duty to consider the facts objectively without favor, affection, or sympathy to anyone.”
Walmsley directed them to retire to the jury room, where they began officially deliberating the case at 11:53 a.m..
(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...
“You said I don’t know, you jackass.”
Now, there’s no cause for names calling. Actually, I explained it in my first comment to you:
“According to reports I’ve heard, they did call the cops. Over and over and over. They would come, the bad guy would be gone, they would move on. The neighborhood had gone from completely safe to parents not letting kids out of their sight, having to worry about putting everything away so it wouldn’t get stolen, etc. What would you do?”
Then you said something about a hammer. But the question remains, if you’re neighborhood was being taken over by criminals, would you hide or try to do something about it when calling the police has failed? You can answer or not. I’ve kind of lost interest in this thread.
I take care of my property and family, you do the same for yours.
“I’ve read the articles on Legal Insurrection. Haven’t seen anything on the media. They had very little justification for believing he had stolen anything, and I have NO USE FOR BUTTHEADS who decide to chase down and threaten to kill someone - “Stop...I’ll blow your fucking head off” - if they don’t have first hand knowledge of a violent crime like rape or murder.”
I don’t know if I agree about the believing he had stolen anything. I believe they thought he did. I also believe that there was a lot of theft going on in this neighborhood that had previously not had a problem, and people were pushed over the edge by the police not doing anything about it. Put yourself in that situation; what would you do? Hide and hope for the best, or confront who you truly believe to be the thief?
He tried to take the gun away from them
“I take care of my property and family, you do the same for yours.”
I can respect that.
Three random guys chase you down and say stop or we’ll blow your head off while aiming at least 1 gun at you do you automatically assume these are upright people who won’t just blow you away anyway? They had no badges. No symbols of authority. No reason to think they were good guys. No reason to think complying would end the situation well.
No, your demeanor was just fine and even if it weren't, hopefully I've grown a thick skin after being on FR for 23 years.
I am confused about this case, but extremely intrigued by it.
There’s that bit about citizen’s arrest.
There’s that thing about Arbery not having a gun. Further, Arbery never stole anything, at least not that day.
There’s the theory that Arbery had been seen “jogging” around the neighborhood quite a few times.
Why did three of these neighbors get all involved in this?
I am paying attention but at the same time I’ve been watching the Rittenhouse trial.
Frankly, I don’t know if they will be, or even SHOULD be, found guilty. I don’t believe any of these people meant to go out and shoot and kill the guy but I don’t think this qualifies as self-defense.
But maybe not. I watched some of the testimony when McMichael said Arbery charged at him and tried to grab his gun.
Interesting True Crime.
Well, burglary is a felony, regardless of the value of anything stolen, or even if nothing is stolen at all. As I understand it, that’s really at the legal crux of the matter: did they have legal standing to attempt to effect an arrest at all.
The reasonableness of the use of force has to be seen in light of the legality of the attempted arrest, at least as I understand the matter.
I would not confront and threaten to kill someone if I did not have first hand, my own eyes KNOWLEDGE that he had committed a crime that carries a death penalty.
I wouldn’t shoot and kill someone I saw stealing my car. Why? BECAUSE IT IS ILLEGAL TO DO SO IN ARIZONA. So why would I pursue and threaten to kill someone for possibly stealing a hammer?
And if you believe something that is false, and then use your belief to threaten to kill someone, then that someone has the right to defend themselves. You may be making an innocent mistake, but that mistake has resulted in your being the aggressor, and thus you lose the right to claim self-defense.
If you grab a gun and start chasing someone down and making threats, you DARN well better be right!
Who had allegedly stolen a hammer. Doesn't seem like a crime deserving of death IMO. Even if they had managed to detain him over the theft of a hammer, nothing would have come of it. Ahmaud was not going to jail for stealing a hammer. This whole thing was a big "Doh!" for the defendants.
What made me change my mind?
+++++++++
The testimony about the neighborhood and the way the increased burglaries and thefts had affected everyone. The fact that they were wary about even letting their children play outside. That the neighbors had gotten to the point they had formed a neighborhood watch. The fact that the deceased had been seen several times in the houses under construction. That he had been known to pretend to be a “jogger” in order to explain he presence in other locations and even the store owners knew he was a thief. The fact that he grabbed for the gun and initiated the final confrontation was what pushed me to change my mind from “guilty” to “not guilty”.
Three random white guys, I would comply and hope for the best. I would judge that complying would be more survivable than trying to make a grab for a shotgun.
I was trained in disarming techniques, and the FIRST thing taught was to not try it unless you are CERTAIN that you will otherwise be killed.
I’m not that trusting. Don’t care about the race. 3 guys whose method of saying hello is “stop or we’ll blow your head off” don’t mean me well.
It’s not a question of “not meaning me well”, it is a question of the probability of my surviving a disarming attempt on a guy with a shotgun being rather low. As the guy demonstrated. Your mileage may vary.
And you know how exactly?
No.
No, they are not guilty. Stupid thug attacks a man and gets shot, it’s the stupid thug’s fault he got killed.
however, there's no proof the victim did anything criminal and three guys followed him for no legal reason....
probably guilty....
I agree with everything you said.
We’re not in Road Warrior times just yet...
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