Significant Distributed Silver Short Attack in Progress

APMEX ^ | 1/30/2021 | Technocrat

[Technocrat]

APMEX prices started rising by the minute two hours ago and they are now out of stock on all significant silver coins. Available rounds if you can find them are now priced at double to triple the spot price. A coordinated attack against JP Morgan and other silver market manipulators was proposed on Reddit on Friday. The link above goes to junk silver.

Bullion

US Mint

The action now appears to be spreading to Gold somewhat

[Craftmore]

roflmao

[glorgau]

Good

[Organic Panic]

When they say “manipulators” how so? Manipulating the prices high? or low.

BTW any one wanna buy silver coins at triple spot send a note.

[cherry]

hey my 100 sunshine 1troy ounce bullion coins are going to make me a millionaire!

[Salvavida]

These look to be numismatic coins. Only suckers buy numismatics, but this probably means a run on Monday.

[BipolarBob]

That means my WPM stock will rise in sympathy.

[monkeyshine]

There is a theory, I have only heard this theory I have no knowledge of it at all but the theory comes from the same types of people who were behind the WallStreetBets forum at put the squeeze on the GameStop shorts, that JP Morgan has essentially cornered the market in silver. It’s really just a whole lot of paper. They trade it on the commodities exchanges, and the options settle in cash not in physical delivery. AFAIK the only commodity that settles in physical delivery is oil (which is why oil price went negative last spring, when demand collapsed so low there was no storage capacity left for new production anywhere in the world, which forced the options traders to literally pay others to take the oil off their hands).

So theoretically, if you can sell paper and call it silver, and never have to deliver the silver to anyone, you could artificially depress the price simply by “naked shorting”, or really just selling the paper you print. It is not backed by any real physical anything. They make money just trading the contracts, never really expecting many people to call in the physical.

If this is true, and there is a coordinated attack/short squeeze on silver with people calling in their paper and demanding delivery that there is not enough silver in all the vaults in the world to make good. Potentially silver could be the next GameStop. If this theory is true.

[Hostage]

Please explain why numismatics is for suckers and how would one by stock on an exchange anticipating a run?

[Nathan _in_Arkansas]

I actually started buying physical silver last month.

For once in my life, I might have actually beat the rush and made a smart investment. Silver rounds are selling out as we speak.

[djf]

Hey Bitcoin is what, 32,000 each?
What do you expect.

[monkeyshine]

When they say “manipulators” how so? Manipulating the prices high? or low.

---

Well, both. See my post above. The working thesis is that the bankers have been trading paper (really, just electronic ledger entries) and calling it “silver” on the commodities exchanges. When the contracts expire, the banks settle the difference in cash. So if you bought contracts for $19 and silver jumps to $20, the banks don’t give you $20 worth of silver they give you $1 in cash. That would be “manipulating the price low”, because the banks and traders can theoretically sell as much paper as they want, it’s just a directional bet for them, but in so doing they depress the price. At options expiration date they collect profits from the losing trades and pay out the winning trades, and keep their middleman slice. Rinse and repeat every month.

But if there is a “distributed short attack” e.g. crowd-sourcing of a mob of investors who all jump into the silver market and demand physical delivery of their contracts (if they can even do this, I am not so sure you can in the commodities market like you can in the stock market), the price of physical silver (and the corresponding paper) could go through the roof the way GameStop and AMC and the others did last week. That would be “manipulation” to the high side.

[familyop]

"APMEX prices started rising"

Looks more like a short squeeze.

Good username, BTW. Technocrats rule--mechanics, machinists, builders, real engineers who design tangible things and all kind of DIY, lifelong learners! We are the backbone of MAGA country, when the need will arise. Then we will lead.

[monkeyshine]

You could buy stock in silver producers/mines.

But mostly the money trading in silver is in the commodities markets; mainly out of Chicago but with electronic trading and floors closed due to covid it can be traded from the basement of your parents’ house. Most people who trade stocks online probably do not yet have commodities trading capability but it can be done. You have to have the right brokerage and hopefully an understanding of how the market works.

The market for physical is mostly in industrial use, coin collectors, as a hedge against inflation, stashed for the zombie apocalypse to come, and as a means to store and transport wealth without having paper bills or banks to deal with. If Silver were to go to $300 an ounce, a 1 pound bar of silver would be worth close to $4,500.

[Organic Panic]

Thanks for the info. I remember my dad trading his paper cash for gold as instructed on the bills themselves. He still has a stack pf those useless notes because I seriously doubt Uncle Sam will keep that pledge. Those were the good ol’ days. If silver goes through the roof I am getting a scuba ourfit to get all those coins that fell out of my boat. I buy silver every month just a few here and there. I still havent seen any recovery really. Obama’s rein I saw it at 47 an ounce. All 2019 it was about 20. I just checked. It was up to 30 an ounce. I ought some more just for the heck of it. There goes that 600 ebt card I got.

[Organic Panic]

You and me both. I can finally afford a drink with a little umbrella.

[PGR88]

There’s a lot of suspicion among reddit readers that the major bank who trade silver, particularly JP Morgan have sold extremely short.

Like the recent GameStop situation - if true, they can be squeezed and forced to cover those shorts at prices much higher

time will tell if true.

[monkeyshine]

You might check the quality of those old bills (are they in good condition?) there is a market for them, value depending on condition, denomination, year printed, where it was printed etc. There is probably more value in that paper than you can get asking Uncle Sam to give you $5 worth of gold for a $5 old bank note.

[monkeyshine]

Indeed, we've heard the same theories. This particular JP Morgan theory has been out there a long time.

There may be significant differences though between commodities trading and stock trading. If the theory is true, and JP Morgan has just been selling paper backed by no real physical silver, then they can continue to just print more paper to depress the price. I know a great deal about the stock market mechanisms, and oddly quite little about commodities trading. I don't know if you can demand physical delivery when the options expire, as you can with stocks. Most is what I learned from Dan Aykroyd and Eddie Murphy and Duke & Duke.

[SteveH]

at the first link, smaller bags of junk silver are out of stock. at the same time bullion is a somewhat near-normal $27/oz. (about 8% above recent rolling average). hmmm... are there periodic runs on junk silver, depending on the crisis-of-the-month?