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How to Lie with P-values
Data Science Central ^ | 6-11-19 | Vincent Granville

Posted on 02/07/2020 3:15:54 PM PST by spintreebob

click here to read article


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the fact that the features are highly correlated, when they are not

Careful what we believe.

1 posted on 02/07/2020 3:15:54 PM PST by spintreebob
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To: spintreebob

Long before computers there were lies,dam’lies and statistics.


2 posted on 02/07/2020 3:22:07 PM PST by SanchoP (Yippy,the next generation search engine.)
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To: spintreebob

My next-door-neighbor and I were discussing this very thing
a few nights ago at my fire-pit with some good bourbon.


3 posted on 02/07/2020 3:22:48 PM PST by Repeal The 17th (Get out of the matrix and get a real life)
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To: spintreebob

I contend that if the climate ‘researchers’ had to testify as to their grant money and their findings under oath the entire hoax would collapse


4 posted on 02/07/2020 3:25:23 PM PST by IncPen ("Inside of every progressive is a Totalitarian screaming to get out" ~ David Horowitz)
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To: spintreebob

Since I don’t know what a p-value is, I cannot appreciate the depth of wisdom shown in the article.


5 posted on 02/07/2020 3:28:06 PM PST by I want the USA back (The media is acting full-on as the Democratic Party's press agency now: Robert Spencer)
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To: SanchoP

And yet with computers the charade continues vis-a-vis corrupt code. 8>)


6 posted on 02/07/2020 3:28:40 PM PST by Robert DeLong
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To: spintreebob

Statistics done Lie, but Liars use Statistics.


7 posted on 02/07/2020 3:31:14 PM PST by Paradox (Don't call them mainstream, there is nothing mainstream about the MSM.)
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To: spintreebob

the trans community has been lying about p values for years...


8 posted on 02/07/2020 3:34:51 PM PST by heavy metal (truth trumps lies...)
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To: spintreebob

“Recently, p-values have been criticized and even banned by some journals, because they are used by researchers, who cherry-pick observations and repeat experiments until they obtain a p-value worth publishing to obtain grant money, get tenure, or for political reasons”

There is nothing wrong with P Values. If you cherry pick the data all the results are crap. It is no longer valid data.


9 posted on 02/07/2020 3:36:47 PM PST by cpdiii ( canecutter, deckhand, roughneck, geologist, pilot, pharmacist THE CONSTITUTION IS WORTH DYING FOR)
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To: spintreebob

95% of an unknown number of scientists agree with me./s


10 posted on 02/07/2020 3:37:00 PM PST by rhombus10
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To: SanchoP

>>Long before computers there were lies,dam’lies and statistics.<<

Computers have the ability to make many errors very quickly.


11 posted on 02/07/2020 3:39:16 PM PST by freedumb2003 ("DonÂ’t mistake activity for achievement." - John Wooden)
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To: spintreebob

And here I thought this was going to be helpful when I met with my parole officer. Aaaarrgghh!


12 posted on 02/07/2020 3:40:30 PM PST by BipolarBob (Joe Biden: "We can't let Trump keep on making America great".)
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To: Repeal The 17th

Since we are talking about p-values, it would have been a lot more believable if you had stated that you were drinking beer.


13 posted on 02/07/2020 3:50:02 PM PST by the_Watchman
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To: the_Watchman

You are right!


14 posted on 02/07/2020 3:56:41 PM PST by Repeal The 17th (Get out of the matrix and get a real life)
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To: SanchoP
Yep, looong before:


15 posted on 02/07/2020 4:15:24 PM PST by bigbob (Trust Trump. Trust the Plan.)
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To: spintreebob

There are liars, damn liars, and statisticians.


16 posted on 02/07/2020 4:18:09 PM PST by sauropod (If women are upset at TrumpÂ’s naughty words, who bought 80 million copies of 50 Shades of Grey?)
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To: spintreebob

This is the kernel of how Climate “Science” works.


17 posted on 02/07/2020 4:19:07 PM PST by Paladin2
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To: Repeal The 17th

Statistically speaking, people who drink bourbon near fire pits at night are happier than those who do not.

(-:


18 posted on 02/07/2020 4:24:56 PM PST by MeganC (There is nothing feminine about feminism.)
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To: MeganC

Will you marry me?


19 posted on 02/07/2020 4:28:39 PM PST by Repeal The 17th (Get out of the matrix and get a real life)
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To: spintreebob
Recently, p-values have been criticized and even banned by some journals, because they are used by researchers, who cherry-pick observations and repeat experiments until they obtain a p-value worth publishing to obtain grant money, get tenure, or for political reasons.

Also, journals often refuse to consider publishing results with negative findings, which makes the problem much worse.

For example, Researcher A repeats experiment X with slight (but insubstantial) modifications, and finds that his sugar water kills cancer cells better than chance with p<0.05. Researchers B, C and D repeat the experiment but find it does nothing, and their department chair tells them to move on to the next series of experiments, because he believes (rightly) that journals are looking to publish positive findings, and generally findings of no effect will not make it through the peer review process (which is long and time consuming). I don't believe these things are intentional though. When I did biomed research I saw this a lot; researchers had good intentions but did not understand statistics. It is not just ignorance, it is often lack of sufficient intellect to be a good scientist. It would be nice if every researcher were a genius who had a natural, confident grasp of all scientific disciplines related to their area of study, but i think we set a pretty low bar for entry into STEM careers.

20 posted on 02/07/2020 4:32:16 PM PST by LambSlave
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