Posted on 05/14/2018 6:13:29 PM PDT by Eddie01
STATESBORO, GA (WTOC) - Pilots who have flown massive aircraft like the C-130 know all too well the challenges and dangers that come along with it.
We spoke with a veteran pilot Thursday who is heartbroken for the airmen killed in the crash in Port Wentworth Wednesday. He says problems arise from the size, the weight, and the age of these aircraft.
Derek Duke flew transport planes like the C-130 in his 30-year career as an Air Force pilot. He watched his television Wednesday through the coverage of the crash - heartbroken - but also trying to analyze what went wrong.
"Looking at the video of the crash site, the flame pattern, wondering if there were any survivors," he said.
The crash killed all those on board. Duke says many crashes for these planes happen on takeoff, especially as the large planes loaded with fuel climb steeply then begin to level off.
"There is change, not only in the power the engine is producing and the thrust of the propeller but also the airflow," he said.
He said he watched WTOC David Klugh's report Wednesday night and studied the crash video over and over. He believes the pilot did all he could first to take the plane back to the airport, then put it down wherever he could.
"You could see the plane being directed, even though it was out of control. You could tell he was trying to direct it, from the video I saw."
Duke believes the pilot put the plane down in the median of Highway 21 to try and minimize anyone else getting hurt. To him, mechanical problems can come, in spite of maintenance, after decades in the air with turbulence and other stressors. The problems come from age, not design.
"There's no replacement for the C-130 right now, other than other C-130," Duke said.
On take off, climb you are at a pretty low airspeed.
Loss of an engine and torque compensation with rudder further reduces air speed. It looked to me like the left wing simply stalled. Some would ask how only one wing could stall but there are many situations where that can happen. The engine that failed would reduce air flow over the wing on the same side. Once the wing drops at low altitude your done.
The proper course would have been to stop climb and lower the nose to get speed and then at least you go into the ground wheels down instead of burying the nose. It looked like he may have tried that and then tried to correct course with too much rudder, rudder can really kill airspeed.
See post #16.
I was a crew chief on C-5A’s and C-5B’s... maintenance nightmares, whereas C-130’s were possibly one of the best 2 or 3 aircraft designs ever developed.
...I got familiar with the 130 on my first “ milk run” out of Bangkok in 69
and later with the 16th SOS sqd @Ubon..
Thanks, PAR35.
I’m curious which you would call the other two?
If below Vmc or minimal control speed with loss of engine#1, you are in big trouble on take off losing an engine. You cannot compensate for the directional tug by the dead engine.
I have seen a Beech Dutchess lose an engine on take off and flip on its back and crash steep nose down on its back like this.
I practiced loss of engine control at altitude below Vmc with a Seneca and it was a slow steady tug I could recover from, but this was in thinner air with less power available on the good engine.
Something about these takeoffs that can be real problematic
C-47/DC-3 is one I bet...
In the video the C-130 is yawing and not centered on the ball. Pilot is applying more power on starbord side and also losing airspeed. He pitches down but torque rolls to the port side. It could have been a port engine reverse pitch runaway prop failure and with his weight and trim could not control the roll. More nose down would have helped, but he may have been looking for a place to set it down before pitching his nose down and waited to long trying to keep it in the air. Sad to watch.
And perhaps B-52 for 3rd place?
Hell, they’re still building them.
Still the aircraft of choice for the Hurricane Hunters, I believe.
That would be a good choice.
I’m inclined to the SR-71.
Only two WC-130s have been lost during operational missions, H-model 65-0965, on 12 October 1974, and another H-model, 65-0968, on 2 May 2018.
AWS was ordered to retain three of the Bs and could give up the other 13 in return for 11 HC-130Hs. $4.5 million was budgeted for WRAMA to transfer the Seek Cloud equipment from the Bs to the newer Hs, and the changeover occurred between June 1973 and July 1974.[6] Four additional HC-130Hs were converted in 1975.
A total of 15 HC-130H rescue Hercules were eventually modified with Seek Cloud equipment and designated WC-130H,[n 12] replacing all 16 WC-130Bs in the weather reconnaissance squadrons. The WC-130H was equipped with the more powerful Allison T56-A-15 turboprop engines rated at 4,910 horsepower and had wing-mounted fuel tanks that provided an additional 2,720 gallons (10,300 L) of fuel, extending the WC-130H's radius of action at maximum cruise speed (230 KIAS, 350 KTAS) to 2,250 nautical miles.
I don’t think there’s one country in the world that doesn’t have at least one C-130 or the Russian knock off.
Those engines sounded fine in that second video.
that makes sense.
Here is an example of reverse pitch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3M6AZel0hk
I thought they sounded fine but I don’t have a trained ear. I was a grunt. My ear was trained for other sounds.
Even 2 engines should have been OK if it wan’t heavily loaded - the plane is generally considered to be “overpowered” and almost impossible to overload due to the limited cargo space for the “oomph” the engines put out. Their strength and power are one of the reasons they make good “hurricane hunters”...probably maintenance issues....
There is audio without visual of the C-130 flying overhead seconds before the impact. The props don’t sound uniform. If the crew did not catch the reverse pitch soon enough the VMC roll was inevitable unless he could get the nose down to maintain control before the port side wing stall. More than one older C-130 has gone down do to reverse pitch inflight after takeoff. Most of the time if the throttle cable goes bad or the engine bell housing control valve fails they catch it on the ground during engine run up.
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