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To: reaganaut
Mormons have a persona of honesty but there is a lot of dishonesty. They are very Machiavellian, esp when dealing with ‘gentiles’ (all non Mormons even Jews).

They have a name for it ... Lying for the Lord. The Saints consider it both necessary and commendable for both maintaining their Church's image and proselytizing potential converts.

78 posted on 03/22/2016 11:50:57 PM PDT by Zakeet (Make Chelsea Clinton the new ambassador to Lybia. What difference does it make?)
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To: Zakeet

Yes that there Lying for the Lord by the Mormons is equivalent to taqiyya by the Moslems...


85 posted on 03/23/2016 12:02:22 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: Zakeet

Trump was wrong about the Mormons - he said they didn’t vote for liars - I guess they really do. How blinded are these people? Oh, wait....never mind.


86 posted on 03/23/2016 12:02:41 AM PDT by Catsrus (I callz 'em as I seez 'em)
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To: Zakeet; Scoutmaster
The Saints consider it both necessary and commendable for both maintaining their Church's image and proselytizing potential converts.


There are articles by LDS 'non-faithful' historians on difficulties they face, where one footnote linking other journal articles on the difficulties caused by Packer and 'faith-promoting' history look like this:

"For other (sometimes academic, sometimes personal) statements by historians of Mormon background concerning the writing of Mormon history, see notes 4 and 5 above, and also Leonard J. Arrington, "Preface," Great Basin Kingdom: An Economic History of the Latter-day Saints, 1830-1900 (Cambridge, MA: Harvard University Press, 1958), esp. viii-ix;
 
Marvin S. Hill, "The Historiography of Mormonism," Church History 28 (Dec. 1959): 418-26;
Klaus J.Hansen, "Reflections on the Writing of Mormon History," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 1 (Spring 1966): 158-60;
Richard L. Bushman, "Taking Mormonism Seriously," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 1 (Summer 1966): 81-84;
Bushman, "The Future of Mormon History," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought (Autumn 1966): 23-26;
Arrington, "The Search for Truth and Meaning in Mormon History," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 3 (Summer 1968): 56-66;
Bushman, "Faithful History," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 4 (Winter 1969): 11-25;
Fawn M. Brodie, Can We Manipulate the Past? (Salt Lake City: Center for the Study of the American West, University of Utah, 1970);
Richard D. Poll, "God and Man in History," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 7 (Spring 1972): 101-09;
Hill, "Brodie Revisited: A Reappraisal," Dialogue: A [p.100]Journal of Mormon Thought 7 (Winter 1972): 85;
Hill, "Secular or Sectarian History? A Critique of No Man Knows My History," Church History 43 (Mar. 1974): 78-96;
William Mulder, "Fatherly Advice," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 9 (Winter 1974): 77-80;
Mulder, "History Is Then and Now: A Conversation with Leonard J. Arrington, Church Historian," Ensign 5 (July 1975): 8-13;
Mulder, "The Mormon Angle of Historical Vision: Some Maverick Reflections," and Marvin S. Hill, "The 'Prophet Puzzle' Assembled: Or, How to Treat Our Historical Diplopia toward Joseph Smith,: Journal of Mormon History 3 (1976): 13-22, 101-05;
Poll, "Nauvoo and the New Mormon History: A Bibliographical Survey," Journal of Mormon History 5 (1978): 105-123;
James B. Allen, "Line Upon Line," Ensign 9 (July 1979): 32-39;
Charles S. Peterson, "Mormon History: Some Problems and Prospects," Encyclia: Journal of the Utah Academy of Sciences, Arts and Letters 56 (1979): 114-26;
Charles S. Peterson, "Mormon History: A Dialogue with Jan Shipps, Richard Bushman, and Leonard Arrington," Century 2 [BYU] 4 (Spring-Summer 1980): 27-39;
Richard Sherlock, "The Gospel beyond Time: Thoughts on the Relation of Faith and Historical Knowledge," Sunstone 5, (July-Aug. 1980): 20-23;
James L. Clayton, "History and Theology: The Mormon Connections: A Response," Sunstone 5 (Nov.-Dec. 1980): 51-53;
Roger Elvin Borg, "Theological Marionettes': Historicism in Mormon History," Thetean: A Student Journal of History (Provo, UT: Beta Iota Chapter of Phi Alpha Theta, Brigham Young University, 1981): 5-20;
 
Arrington, "The Writing of Latter-day Saint History: Problems, Accomplishments, and Admonitions," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 14 (Fall 1981): 119-29;
Davis Bitton, "Mormon Biography," Biography: An Interdisciplinary Quarterly 4 (Winter 1981): 1-16;
Clayton, "Does History Undermine Faith?" Sunstone 7 (Mar.-Apr. 1982): 33-40;
Ronald K. Esplin, "How Then Should We Write History? Another View," Sunstone 7 (Mar.-Apr. 1982): 41-45;
Jay Fox, "Clio and Calliope: Writing Imaginative Histories of the Pacific," Proceedings of the Mormon Pacific Historical Society, Third Annual Conference, April 10, 1982, 12-19;
Ronald W. Walker, "The Nature and Craft of Mormon Biography," Brigham Young University Studies 22 (Spring 1982); 179-92;
Bitton, "Like the Tigers of Old Time," Sunstone 7 (Sept.-Oct. 1982): 44-48;
Melvin T. Smith, "Faithful History: Hazards and Limitations," Journal of Mormon History 9 (1982): 61-69;
Arrington, "Personal Reflections on Mormon History," Sunstone 8 (July - Aug. 1983): 41-45;
Smith, Faithful History/Secular Faith," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 16 (Winter 1983): 65-71;
Thomas G. Alexander, "Toward the New Mormon History: An Examination of the Literature on the Latter-day Saints in the Far West," in Michael P. Malone, ed., Historians and the American West (Lincoln: University of Nebraska Press, 1983), 344-68;
Smith, "Faithful History/Secular Religion," John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 3 (1983): 51-58;
Hill, "Richard L. Bushman: Scholar and Apologist," Journal of Mormon History 11 [p.101](1984): 125-33;
Lavina Fielding Anderson, "The Assimilation of Mormon History: Modern Mormon Historical Novels," Mormon Letters Annual, 1983 (Salt Lake City: Association for Mormon Letters, 1984), 1-9;
 
Arrington, "Why I Am a Believer," and Walker, "A Way Station," Sunstone 10 (Apr. 1985): 36-38, 58-59;
Grant Underwood, "Re-visioning Mormon History," Pacific Historical Review 55 (Aug. 1986): 403-26;
Alexander, "No Way to Build Bridges," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 22 (Spring 1989): 5;
Hill, "The New Mormon History Reassessed in Light of Recent Books on Joseph Smith and Mormon Origins," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 21 (Autumn 1988): 115-27;
Poll, History and Faith: Reflections of a Mormon Historian (Salt Lake City: Signature Books, 1989);
 
Hansen, "Arrington's Historians," Sunstone 13 (Aug. 1989: 41-43; "Coming to Terms with Mormon History: An Interview with Leonard Arrington," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 22 (Winter 1989): 39-54;
 
Hill, "Afterword," Brigham Young University Studies 30 (Fall1990): 117-24;
David B. Honey and Daniel C. Peterson, "Advocacy and Inquiry in Mormon Historiography," Brigham Young University Studies 31 (Spring 1991): 139-79;
Gary James Bergera, "The New Mormon Anti-Intellectualism," Sunstone 15 (June 1991): 53-55;
D. Michael Quinn, "Editor's Introduction," The New Mormon History: Revisionist Essays on the Mormon Past (Salt Lake City: Signature Books, 1991);
Malcolm R. Thorp, "Some Reflections on New Mormon History and the Possibilities of a 'New' Traditional History," Sunstone 15 (Nov. 1991): 39-46;
Douglas F. Tobler and S. George Ellsworth, "History: Significance to Latter-day Saints," in Ludlow, Encyclopedia of Mormonism, 3:595-98;
Richard P. Howard, Restoration Scriptures: A Study of Their Textual Development (Independence, MO: Herald House, 1969);
Richard P. Howard, "Latter Day Saint Scriptures and the Doctrine of Propositional Revelation," and Paul M. Edwards, "Why Am I Afraid to Tell You Who I Am?" in Courage: A Journal of History, Thought and Action 1 (June 1971): 209-25, 241-46;
Richard P. Howard, "The Effect of Time and Changing Conditions on Our Knowledge of History," Saints' Herald 120 (June 1973): 54;
Paul M. Edwards, "The Irony of Mormon History," Utah Historical Quarterly 41 (Autumn 1973): 393-409;
Robert B. Flanders, "Some Reflections on the New Mormon History," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 9 (Spring 1974): 34-41;
Richard P. Howard, "The Historical Method as the Key to Understanding Our Heritage," Saints' Herald 121 (Nov. 1974): 53;
Paul M. Edwards, "The Secular Smiths," Journal of Mormon History 4 (1977): 3-17;
F. Henry Edwards, "Engagement with Church History," John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 1 (1981): 30-33;
Richard P. Howard, "Adjusting Theological Perspectives to Historical Reality," Saints' Herald 129 (Sept. 1982): 28;
C. Robert Mesle, "History, Faith, and Myth," Sunstone 7 (Nov.-Dec. 1982): 10-13;
Richard P. Howard, "Themes in Latter Day Saint History," John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 2 (1982): 23-29;
Richard P. Howard, "The Changing RLDS Response to Mormon Polygamy: A Preliminary Analysis," John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 3 (1983): 14-28;
Richard P. Howard, "The Problem of History and Revelation," Saints' Herald 131 (Oct. 1984): 24;
Paul M. Edwards, "Our Own Story," Sunstone 10 (Jan.-Feb. 1985): 40-41;
Alma R. Blair, "RLDS Views of Polygamy: Some Historiographical Notes," John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 5 (1985): 16-28;
Paul M. Edwards, "The New Mormon History," Saints' Herald 133 (Nov. 1986): 12-14, 20;
W. Grant McMurray, "'As Historians and Not as Partisans': The Writing of Official History in the RLDS Church," and Roger D. Launius, "A New Historiographical Frontier: The Reorganization in the Twentieth Century," John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 6 (1986): 43-52, 53-63;
 
Don H. Compier, "History and the Problem of Evil: Reflections on the Philosophical and Theological Implications of the 'New Mormon History,'" and Flanders, "Review," John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 8 (1988): 45-53, 91-93;
Roger D. Launius, "Whither Reorganization Historiography?"; Paul M. Edwards, "A Time and a Season: History as History," John Whitmer Historical Association Journal 10 (1990): 24-50, 85-90; and Paul M. Edwards, "A Community of Heart," Journal of Mormon History 17 (1991): 28-34;
 
Leonard J. Arrington, "Historian as Entrepreneur: A Personal Essay," Brigham Young University Studies 17 (Winter 1977): 193-209;
Arrington, "The Writing of Latter-day Saint History: Problems, Accomplishments and Admonitions," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 14 (Fall 1981): 119-29;
Davis Bitton, "Ten Years in Camelot: A Personal Memoir," Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought 16 (Autumn 1983): 9-35;
Howard C. [p.97]Searle, "Historians, Church," in Ludlow, Encyclopedia of Mormonism, 2:591."

So it may not be doctrine, but it makes a big difference if you're writing or researching LDS history, this 'faith-promoting' deal.

We even have faithful reviews of non-faithful books about writing faithful history published by faithful history journals: Gary F. Novak, "Review of Faithful History: Essays on Writing Mormon History by George D. Smith," FARMS Review of Books 5/1 (1993).

 

 

BIG thanks be to Scoutmaster; for his work in compiling all of this data!      http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2831597/replies?c=102

192 posted on 03/23/2016 6:26:33 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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