Posted on 09/28/2015 7:45:08 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
Last night, Donald Trump sat down with Scott Pelley on ’60 Minutes’ and made a gloriously confused barrage of promises and wishcasting about taxes, Social Security, ISIL, trade, and immigration. There’s a lot in there, but for my money his most laughable comments were about repealing Obamacare. Here’s the key section:
Scott Pelley: What’s your plan for Obamacare?
Donald Trump: Obamacare’s going to be repealed and replaced. Obamacare is a disaster if you look at what’s going on with premiums where they’re up 40, 50, 55 percent.
Scott Pelley: How do you fix it?
Donald Trump: There’s many different ways, by the way. Everybody’s got to be covered. This is an un-Republican thing for me to say because a lot of times they say, “No, no, the lower 25 percent that can’t afford private. But–”
Scott Pelley: Universal health care.
Donald Trump: I am going to take care of everybody. I don’t care if it costs me votes or not. Everybody’s going to be taken care of much better than they’re taken care of now.
Scott Pelley: The uninsured person is going to be taken care of. How? How?
Donald Trump: They’re going to be taken care of. I would make a deal with existing hospitals to take care of people. And, you know what, if this is probably–
Scott Pelley: Make a deal? Who pays for it?
Donald Trump: –the government’s gonna pay for it. But we’re going to save so much money on the other side. But for the most it’s going to be a private plan and people are going to be able to go out and negotiate great plans with lots of different competition with lots of competitors with great companies and they can have their doctors, they can have plans, they can have everything.
Okay, he’s going to repeal Obamacare, but replace it with a system where “everybody’s got to be covered.” Very Obamacare-ish.
According to Trump, uninsured people are going to get coverage because he’s going to “make a deal with existing hospitals” and “the government’s gonna pay for it.” There’s a word for this exact proposal: Medicaid. Trump probably doesn’t know this, but Medicaid expansion was a huge part of Obamacare. The “deal with existing hospitals” is so unfavorable for doctors and hospitals that many of them do not accept Medicaid patients because it would put them out of business. Does Trump know this? Meh, he doesn’t care.
But that’s just the uninsured. Trump goes on to say that “for the most part,” his plan will be “a private plan and people are going to be able to go out and negotiate great plans with lots of different competition.” If this idea also sounds strangely familiar, it is because this too is already part of our healthcare framework. Trump described the Obamacare exchanges just like Obama did, as increasing competition in the private insurance markets by providing lots of options.
And what would a health reform proposal be like without transparently false promises? Remember, “if you like your plan, you can keep it”? Trump thinks it’s a great idea, and not only can you keep your doctor, keep your plan, you “can have everything!”
Summing Up: Pelley didn’t push hard on any of Trump’s stream-of-conscious proposals, so we don’t know in what way his plan would differ from expansion of Medicaid and Obamacare or how he would avoid the “if you like it, you can keep it” trap. Does anyone think Trump even knows?
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Illogical you!
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Sorry, but waiting to see what the plan says, vs going off on hyperbole tangents isn’t engaging in wishful thinking.
But please, do go on telling everyone what exactly he is planning to do before he offers it... Since you are apparently clairvoyant.
I’ve been working in Health Care for a while now, both on the provider and the payer side of things, and the sheer stupidity and waste I witness on a daily bases largely to meet some regulation or another is staggering, and that was before Obamacare came into the picture, and compared to pre obamacare, those staggering amounts look like nothing compared to it today.
I have no doubt that you can improve care and reduce costs in health care, and do so on a scale that literally could make sure that everyone can get insurance and still spend less overall at the federal level for it.
We’ll see what his plan actually says, and then we can talk about it... until then engaging in hyperbole is just idiotic.
We are 5 months away from the first primary, let alone the election, so anyone investing massive amounts of energy into just spewing garbage with no facts shows exactly why we wind up with the kind of government we do.
Most of those on Obamacare don't do physicals either, even if it is covered. Obamacare is not solving or even attempting to solve that problem, except in meaningless rhetoric.
By all means, lets get behind a person who has no chance to win the general election. Then we can keep Obamacare and have more years of bitchin’ and moaning.
I will continue to support Trump and wait to see what his plan might be.
I have yet to see any other candidate present any plan either. At least Trump speaks honestly.
Finny,
When you start offering up some truth, and not some invented hyperbole venom, then we can discuss about who is refusing to accept the truth.
All I have said is, his plan is not out there yet (TRUTH) The existing system is a costly wasteful mess (TRUTH) Its riddled with waste (TRUTH) and we could today buy private insurance for folks who got coverage through obamacare and done it far cheaper than what Obamacare has cost (TRUTH) And based on all of those TRUTH’s there is certainly no reason do doubt that it should be possible to accomplish the same state goal of Obamacare, (coverage availability for all) without the insane overhead an cost that this monstrosity has put on the industry.
So, keep up the venom, propagandists need their useful idiots, keep shouting loud and proud.
One doesn't have to be clairvoyant, on only has to actually pay attention to what Trump is saying.
You are way, way deep in denial, my FRiend.
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Thanks for identifying yourself as a socialist.
I don’t want “health insurance” to exist.
It drives up the costs for those addicted to doctors, without offering them anything at all.
I stay healthy by staying away from doctors and their poisons.
After almost 35 years of voting "against," I finally recognized that the tactic was failing (you have yet to perceive that fact). Now, I only vote FOR.
You only vote FOR as well, and you are perfectly willing and happy to vote FOR Obamacare done Trump-style.
I am ONLY willing to vote for someone who upholds the Constitution of the United States of America. By definition, that means voting FOR someone who rejects the very premise of Obamacare in ANY style, Trump/Romney/Hillary etc. That person's name is Ted Cruz.
The fundamental problem is that health insurance is paid for with pretax dollars, while medical care is paid for with after-tax dollars. This gives us an incentive to overinsure, which gives us an incentive to overuse the insurance we already paid for, which makes insurance more expensive since overuse is an expectation. Also, since the consumer and the payer are separated, there is no incentive to price shop for most medical treatments.
If I could buy any insurance I wanted, without that perverse incentive, I'd buy major medical coverage only. I'd be covered for cancer, hospitalization, maternity care, and other big medical issues, just like I'm covered for a car accident or a fire in my home. I would not be covered for routine checkups or birth control pills any more than I am covered for gasoline, oil changes, or maid service (which I don't have, but if Obamacare covered our homeowners' insurance, FedGov would probably mandate maid service as part of all plans).
You're right, just as Reagan was right. The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, "I'm from the government and I'm here to help."
Well, here’s the problem... it’s not hyperpole to recognize the undeniable fact Trump has been an enthusiastic supporter of single-payer “health care.” Having lived in Europe for a few years I saw up close the ramifications of that type of approach... it’s not geared toward seeing to the needs of the patient, but to the fiscal needs of the state... Therein lies the main failure. The most affected party in the whole transaction — the recipient of that care — is shunted aside for the cause of saving a few dollars (or Euros) for the state.
Because of Trump’s “bouncing around” style of speaking, the listener is left with attempting to divine his intentions and meanings from a few phrases that emerge, thus my responding to you earlier with the highlighted text. Combining “I’m going to take care of everybody,” with the “Government is going to pay for it,” what other conclusions can one draw, than a favoring of the single-payer approach?
And nowhere did I insinuate those showing up at clinics and ERs are getting free care... the government’s hand has already been in this process for decades. However, the words used by Trump lend credence to the notion he has plans of extending that governmental hand. I’m not implying he’s lying about anything here. In fact, I’m noting a consistency in Trump’s personal philosophy about the government’s role in health care delivery. Some may like and feel secure with the idea of government-run health care, and some may decide to like it because Trump advocates it. I don’t.
Trump’s goal appears to be to eliminate waste in EVERY level of government. (IRS, Military, Healthcare/Medicare/Medicaid, Business/Trade regulations, etc.) That, essentially, will significantly shrink government...in so many areas.
Brilliant!
(BTW, THIS ^^ is why he’s taking flak from EVERY direction. Everyone in DC is on some sort of government gravy train....the bigger the govt, the bigger their *dividends*.)
The tipping point was when the insurance companies succeeded in getting the patient decoupled from the compensation process.
His vote for Corker and TPA are also not acceptable.
He has no exec experience, he is in the Senate and his polling isn't all that promising.
His personality doesn't seem to draw anyone in but some of the conservative base. That will not win a general election alone.
I am not into losing again. This is the chance to squash the GOPe, so we need a real outsider.
How then do you reconcile his comment "The government's gonna pay for it" with respect to health care? The government standard treatment to EVERY program is to waste $$.
You answered your own question, with my quote you posted.
Do you suppose part of navigating the crap in order to be "successful" included donating $25,000 to Clinton pal Terry McAuliffe, an odious leftist toadie of the first water, in his bid for Virginia governor, which he won? Why ELSE would a "conservative Republican" like Trump donate so significantly to such a significant leftist Democrat's campaign?
I do not think he is in favor of single payer for this country; he is smart enough to know those countries he has cited before (as having well-run single payer) are much smaller by a ton. He is also smart enough to know that what you pay for a broken leg in Manhattan is not the same you pay in Nebraska. Just because one says that single payer works in XYZ country doesn’t automatically mean you think it will work in the US. Good grief, didn’t Vermont decide last year that even it cannot afford single payer?
Trump has often mentioned that he likes HSAs. And this is where I think he is going with this “universal coverage” thing: Employers will dump some into the HSA, as will employees. Those who are unemployed will have their employer portion contributed by some kind of gov’t funds. Once they resume work, they will resume adding to their HSA. Under this sort of plan, there would be a form of universal coverage, although not equal coverage. This is a powerful incentive for people to FIND A JOB, btw.
I have often thought that if Trump wins the nom, he should announce the Doc as his VP, announcing that, under this administration, the VP is no longer a ceremonial job. No more christening ships, etc, but real responsibility. He should/would charge Dr. Carson with fixing both Obamacare and the VA.
Just my two cents...
If you want to follow the reasons why health care is so expensive in the US, follow this website. He literally has hundreds of posts of what is going on. Yes, of course it includes the politicians and it would be a mighty heavy lift to get them to give up the cash they are being paid. But the reward would be almost instant entitlement reform without raising a cent in taxes: http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=230710
You don't see the difference between an individual and an auto?
Scott,
I guess we just disagree on what we have heard Trump say, I have never heard him advocate as part of his campaign that he wants insurance to be single payer. He has spoken of breaking the state barriers so plans can exist across state lines etc etc. I don’t take “every has health insurance” to equate to a single payer system.
We will see what his plan says when it is published what exactly it is until then, I think concluding he’s advocating single payer is a incorrect conclusion.
I do agree that Trumps speaking style is not the cleanest, but I am hard pressed to believe based on statements he’s made on this topic on the campaign trail that I have see, unedited and live, that he is going that route.
Personally I conclude, something along the lines of what I admittedly conjectured, that being, its cheaper to actually buy private health insurance than to administer government programs to attempt to do it. I have no doubt that any plan from anyone is going to include government subsidizing of health insurance for some of the population, which shouldn’t be surprising as it has been since Medicare passed, and expanded under medicaid. Obamacare’s failures are many, and I could go on for a long long time about ones I’ve witness or had to deal with working for a provider and payer in the health care world.
However the key thing that should be universally understood by any thinking person is that Health Care as a percentage of our GDP cannot continue to grow unchecked, at 17% of the GDP and growing something is going to give sooner or later, and it will not be pretty. Getting this under control and trying to move a bloated complacent heavily regulated industry to move away from a pay to play model, where even the worst doctor in the world can make millions because he gets to bill even if he never actually helps cure anyone of any problem, into an outcomes based model where you only get paid if you actually helped someone... isn’t a bad goal... Obamacare fails miserably on how it tries to deal with this sort of shift, but its a shift that MUST happen.. so I think anyone who thinks that whatever replaces OBamacare, assuming of course Republicans will ever seriously repeal it.... is going to not be some step back to the 1950s or even 1990s in the industry and insurance.
We will see what his plan says, and make my conclusions from there, but I am not going to conclude he’s advocating single payer, in light of the reforms he has advocated on the trail do not remotely sound like that. Breaking down barriers between states so companies can offer insurance across state lines, which he has cited again and gain on the trail don’t sound like single payer to me.
Only a liberal would have done so, and this Virginian will never support Trump based on that alone (although there's plenty more reasons).
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