Posted on 03/20/2015 4:44:58 PM PDT by ObamahatesPACoal
RUSH: Investors.com is the source for the story that Obamacare premiums are jumping 23% this year, even after subsidies. "President Obama has talked a lot in recent months about how health care inflation has moderated in recent years, and he always manages to credit Obamacare for the result.
(SNIP)
CALLER: I wanted to mention that it's amazing right now that tens of thousands of STEM educated Americans, Science, Technology, Engineering, and Math, computer science folks and all this are being laid off by Microsoft, by different companies, and are having to retrain their --
RUSH: Ho, ho, ho, ho, hold on just a minute here. I'm confused because I have been under the impression that people like Microsoft and Facebook and Google have been asking for more H-1B visas so they can get more people immigrated to the country who are highly educated in math and technology and so forth, the STEM types, and you're telling me that they're laying them off?
(Excerpt) Read more at rushlimbaugh.com ...
Probably paying 30 bucks an hour no benefits.
Oh, we pay well - plus bonus and RSUs. But you need to find people who are worth the salaries they are commanding. Many of them aren’t worth the amount they want.
It comes back to a minimum wage type argument: is McDonalds going to pay $20/hr for help, or will they turn to other solutions over the long haul?
In my world, that other solution is called the “offshore contractor.”
Salaries are skewed. Demands are high. I’ve got guys coming to me with 3 years experience and no effing clue asking for $120k! Good lord. Of course I’m not going to pay that.
Compensation is commensurate with the skills of the candidate and the specific responsibilities of the position they’ll be filling, of course. So senior architects will earn much more than a junior dev.
Also, if you are asking me to quote specific salaries, then bear in mind that I won’t do that. Salary is negotiated with the candidate at the time an offer is being made. If you don’t know that, you may not have ever been in a position to hire for the enterprise, but that’s the way it works. It’s why 90% of online job postings don’t list salary.
Finally, we have a recruiting department who teases out compensation requirements to determine a match. It would be a major faux pas to post salary information and spoil the bargaining position!
Not really, the money being throw at high level programmers right now is crazy. There are folks in CA writing code most of the day making over 250K a year right now.
Let bolobaby answer the question.
not posting salary is a way to screw over the candidates and keep the salaries over. Just be honest about it. I see this crap all the time, companies wanting major skills, but when you talk to them they have no money. At least post a range, so I don’t have to talk to nutjobs who think they can get techs for 10 bucks an hour.
No is one here F-ING negotiation with you right now. How much money did you pay the last C# hire? JUST ANSWER THE QUESTION.
Bolobaby, here are some questions you can answer, in general terms, without giving away secrets...
1. Where are these positions? Do you need people on-site, or can they do the work remotely?
2. What is the general salary range?
If you won’t answer these questions up front, the best people are not going to pay attention to anything else in your job description. There are lots of good engineers available in the USA.
If you’re having trouble getting good people, there is likely something wrong on your end. You may be paying below market. Your company may have a terrible reputation. You may be asking people to move to an expensive and/or terrible place, in return for absolutely no job security. Your recruiting and/or HR people may be repulsive. Your job descriptions may be insane.
There are certainly regions in the US with far more GOOD software engineers available than there are positions for them to fill. If you have a local shortage of people (which I understand is the case for a some specialities in a few places), then hire people and set them up to work remotely.
My former employer has laid off tens of thousands of very good engineers in the last few years, all over the country. They are still laying off. They are also lobbying for a big increase in H1-B slots. They justify this by actively posting repulsive ads for insulting salaries, with job requirements that exactly match the skills of the people who were just dumped. When no self-respecting, competent software engineers apply, they scream “shortage”. This has been deliberate policy from high up for years. The low-level managers who are desperate for more good people can’t do anything about it.
Sigh...
We’re paying very competitive salaries, not $10/hr.
Salary ranges are the dumbest things ever. I pay a candidate what they are worth, not what some arbitrary ranges says I should pay them. And besides, a range in the forum is meaningless because it’s not accompanied with the market in which the range is being offered!
Again, (and possibly last post on this thread before it gets stupid with all the “prove it” posers who would never qualify for a position anyway), if you have a *genuine* interest and are interested, Freepmail me. We are hiring and finding GOOD talent is not easy. Basic skill profile is C# in a .NET consumer-facing web environment.
Rush was being intentionally obtuse here, he did understand what this guy was saying, but didn’t want to truthfully address the statement. I am about done listening to him. He is becoming irrelevant as far as I am concerned, it is just blather blather for three hours.
I cannot reveal my corporation, but it is a fortune 500 tech company with close to 90 billion in revenue.
Over the last decade, particularly the last five years, they have laid off thousands of American workers all the while bringing in Indian/Chinese H1B visa workers and or contractors.
It’s pretty sad.
It is clear bolobaby is your typical jealous non technical HR a$$h0le.
I wouldn’t send you toilet paper cover in my sh!t.
15/hr? LOL. Loser.
I will not post salary info. Can you understand that? First of all, I’ve actually had someone Freepmail me. Posting salary information would be a breach of protocol with our recruiting department. They start the compensation dialogue. Second, if I posted “the last salary paid,” I’d actually be publicly revealing someone’s personal salary! Let’s say the person Freepmailing me gets hired and (easily) identifies the person that was hired before them. I would have revealed that person’s compensation in a public forum.
Now, if you are unable to understand that, I’m sorry. I probably should have never posted on this thread because there are too many people like you who ruin a perfectly good opportunity to *potentially help an interested Freeper find a job.*
I’m not here to prove anything to you. I *was* fishing for any candidates who I might help out *with a frickin’ job*. That’s why I mentioned twice that I had open positions. I’m sorry you have to ruin the attempt of one Freeper trying help other Freepers who might be reading this thread because they are looking.
Sigh.
FOAD
For the sake of argument let's say I don't have a job which makes me vulnerable because I KNOW you will ask. You now think I am desperate and will take any pay. Let's say I pass your stupid technical interview which you of course cannot conduct because you are a non technical dweeb. Now we get to the salary and you will ask me what range I would consider. In my opinion the job should have a set price associated with it but you HR assholes don't see it that way. What I do is lower my salary so you will hire me. Then I will use this job as a stepping stone and immediately look for another job. I will use you for a paycheck until I can get a reasonable salary. I will repeat as necessary until I feel properly compensated. This the system YOU GUYS want.
Sigh. Not even close.
You’re out of control. Please calm down.
You are the problem, not the solution.
That assumes facts not in evidence. I’m willing to give leeway for privacy-related caution and concern for dumb corporate secrecy policies.
I’ll reserve judgement about the gigs Bolobaby is trying to fill until I see the job postings.
In every large company I’ve dealt with, by the time a job opening is approved and posted, there’s a definite salary range approved, and it’s generally known to the hiring manager and the HR contact. If the salary is too low, and they have a great candidate they really want, someone has to joust with layers of higher management to get an exception approved. Sometimes that’s too much trouble to bother with.
Organizations that know their salary range and refuse to disclose it up front are doing themselves a disservice. They repel the best candidates. It’s a common practice, alas.
If you want to hire well-qualified, non-desperate people, every communication, starting with the job posting, needs to attract, not repel. Secret salary, hidden job location, impossible combinations of “required” skills — all of these repel. Letting candidates go more than a few days with no contact except from HR-bots — repels. Wasting a candidate’s time — repels. Reputation for treating your customers like dirt — repels. Expecting people to spend 4 hours/day in traffic, then work 10 hours for 8 hours of pay — repels.
Oh, one more thing. If your company has been laying off software engineers while supposedly wanting to hire other software engineers, the word is out. You’re blacklisted. You’ll attract the incompetent, the desperate, the inexperienced. Maybe the occasional retiree who realizes he doesn’t want to spend quite all his time at home. If you have good engineers with the “wrong” skills, you keep them and improve your training. If you can’t afford to do this, you’re going out of business and your cheap-labor strategy is just a delaying tactic. If you’ve been letting your skill mismatch get worse and worse over the course of a decade, you’re mismanaged. Fix it. You don’t have a shortage of good engineers, you have a shortage of good managers. The fish rots from the head. Unfortunately, these problems affect a lot of companies today.
Good companies with good management, good hiring policies, and good salaries don’t have a shortage of good people.
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