Posted on 02/13/2015 8:36:34 AM PST by Oliviaforever
A Montana homeowner was sentenced to 70 years in prison for the “stand your ground” killing of German exchange student.
Markus Kaarma, 30, was convicted in December of deliberate homicide after he gunned down 17-year-old Diren Dede in his garage. He’ll have to serve 20 years before he’s eligible for parole.
(Excerpt) Read more at m.nydailynews.com ...
Then you’ve endorsed every liberal turn of the “law” that the liberals have forced on us. These are specifically worded to protect criminals, remember.
“I guess that was just too GD simple.”
I’m sure he will think about that for the next 20 to 70 years.
Was that 6 pack really worth it?
True enough, but I was responding to the absurdity that hunting over a baited trap
somehow negated the right to defend one's own property, as guaranteed by the State Constitution.
Montana too, IIRC.
In most places you can’t hunt over a baited trap.”
Funny, the Police hunt over baited traps every single day, hell in New York they leave wallets on the sidewalk and when a good citizen picks it up to turn it in to the authorities, they arrest and charge them with theft.
Our 2nd Amendment rights have been greatly subdued and limited; as with all our rights comes great responsibility for care; I have no compassion for anyone who would limit our rights nor anyone who would disrespect, neglect and abuse our rights.
He should pay for his bad judgment some other way.
(Cops lure criminals all the time.)
Yes, if he had simply stumbled on the kid in the act of burglary, then he may well have been justified in firing to stop him from. However, in this case, he no longer can claim that the use of force was necessary to prevent the crime, since he set up the conditions which facilitated the crime in the first place.
I’m not endorsing the law (as far as I’m concerned, you should be allowed to shoot vandals and petty thieves on your property), I’m repeating what the law states. There are a lot of laws on the books that I don’t agree with, but I’d be a fool to break them and go to prison for them.
Fourth Amendment, too. Used to be that the Castle Doctrine was not violable by any body of law. Now the liberals want us to be insecure in our own homes.
Here’s the Montana state statute:
45-3-103. Use of force in defense of occupied structure. (1) A person is justified in the use of force or threat to use force against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that the use of force is necessary to prevent or terminate the other person’s unlawful entry into or attack upon an occupied structure.
(2) A person justified in the use of force pursuant to subsection (1) is justified in the use of force likely to cause death or serious bodily harm only if:
(a) the entry is made or attempted and the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent an assault upon the person or another then in the occupied structure; or
(b) the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent the commission of a forcible felony in the occupied structure.
The state’s definition of forcible felony:
(2) “Forcible felony” means any felony which involves the use or threat of physical force or violence against any individual.
“An open garage at 1:00 in the morning is not “bait”.”
If there is a man in the garage, hiding in the shadows with a loaded shotgun pointed at the door, then yes, it is.
Kaarma didn’t break any of them; that’s the thing.
If you want to protect your garage, you close and lock the door. You don’t leave it open and lay in wait with a gun. This guy is got a fair verdict and sentence.
Yep, this has nothing to do with stand your ground, more like Castle Doctrine.
Here is what Montana law says:
Montana has a castle law with a “stand-your-ground” clause. Under the law, the use of deadly force is permissible to prevent felonies from being committed in one’s home or to protect against assault within one’s home.
The statute reads:
45-3-103. Use of force in defense of occupied structure. (1) A person is justified in the use of force or threat to use force against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that the use of force is necessary to prevent or terminate the other person’s unlawful entry into or attack upon an occupied structure.
(2) A person justified in the use of force pursuant to subsection (1) is justified in the use of force likely to cause death or serious bodily harm only if:
(a) the entry is made or attempted and the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent an assault upon the person or another then in the occupied structure; or
(b) the person reasonably believes that the force is necessary to prevent the commission of a forcible felony in the occupied structure.
The homeowner was clearly in the wrong in Montana.
"Self-defense" applies to cases where your life is at risk. "Stand Your Ground" is not a synonym for "self-defense". It only refers to whether there is a duty to retreat from a threat.
That’s not what happened.
And he should be allowed to shoot notwithstanding, because someone who enters a stranger’s open garage at 1 am is up to no good. (Unless you don’t believe in the Castle Doctrine, that is.) The police “bait” criminals in this fashion all the time, albeit not necessarily with deadly force in each instance.
The shooter wounded the kid first, incapacitating him and the coldly shot him in the head. The shooters girlfriend said as much. That’s where this went sideways. I know bluster is fun but a 17 year-old kid is needlessly dead,
“That’s not what happened.”
Says who?
“And he should be allowed to shoot notwithstanding, because someone who enters a stranger’s open garage at 1 am is up to no good.”
Then campaign to change Montana’s laws, because that is not what they say currently.
“The police “bait” criminals in this fashion all the time, albeit not necessarily with deadly force in each instance.”
What the police do or don’t do is immaterial and just a distraction from the issues here.
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