Posted on 04/26/2014 2:32:07 AM PDT by Rummyfan
Amid the howls of "racism" and miscellaneous kerfuffle, the salient point is being missed completely. The entire Democrat Plantation is the result of extra-constitutional and Unconstitutional programs which constitute the largest and most pervasive abuse of Federal power yet. It is slavery, a bondage many voluntarily entered into, but which one can only rarely escape, down unto the third and fourth generation.
I realize, as I hope do you and other posters here, that the problem is endemic and culturally pervasive--so much so that when someone speaks out against the Welfare State by giving examples of those most seriously affected by it ("African-Americans"), that that isn't racism, rather an example of the effects of Federal overreach that touches millions of lives.
Mr Bundy has the temerity to point this out, an opportunity to call for freeing millions of people enslaved by their government and takes that risk, and all he gets is called a racist for doing so.
Apparently he can see beyond the cattle, but the sheep can't.
“From 1976 to 2000 grazing units fell from 10.1 million to 9.8 million “
The BLM says you are wrong:
“Over time there has been a gradual decrease in the amount of grazing that takes place on BLM-managed land, and that trend continues today. Grazing use on public lands has declined from 18.2 million AUMs in 1954 to 7.9 million AUMs in 2013.” (That is 2.3:1, BTW)
http://www.blm.gov/wo/st/en/prog/grazing.html
Nevada AUMs Authorized 1971-2010
1971: 2,198,371
1981: 1,651,936
1991: 1,693,508
2001: 1,304,781
2010: 1,138,171
http://www.blm.gov/nv/st/en/prog/grazing/animal_unit_months.html
It is multi use. Not grazers only. If you want to you can read the entire FLPMA, its online.
Congress(legislative branch) writes the legislation(FLPMA). The BLM(executive branch) administers and enforces. The courts(judicial branch) arbitrates the conflicts.
But the Posse Comitatus people like you, Bundy, and many others don't recognize the govt(3 branches) so you want to say what the level of grazing will be, or what will or will not be national monuments, or what the endangered species will be, etc, etc. Even though Congress has enacted legislation to deal with all these issues. Congress passed the Antiquities Act, the Endangered Species Act, and FLPMA.
The reality is that disputes between grazers and BLM are few and mostly minor. But there are a very small number like Bundy or Hage who are Posse Comitatus itching for a fight. Consequently, you don't see any other grazers in the trench with Bundy, only militia and oathkeepers.
“The reality is that disputes between grazers and BLM are few and mostly minor.”
You don’t know any ranchers, do you...
“Because it is multi-use, grazing will and has diminished...”
Nope. There is no logical reason why grazing must diminish, unless it it being restricted by people who hate ranchers. It is entirely possible to graze on national mnuments & parks, or should be. The national monument north of me has thousands of sq miles of land that no tourist ever sees. It could be used.
Wilderness areas are a myth. They do not exist except as an artificial construct. They are biologically meaningless. The Wilderness area closest to me had to have paved roads removed so they could pretend it was wilderness. The wilderness area that the USFS is using as an excuse to deny Tombstone AZ water was created a hundred years after the water lines were set.
Many endangered species need to go extinct. It is what happens to species. Those that cannot adapt, go extinct. But in many cases, environmentalists are using the law to try to restrict any human activity. It has no basis in science, but is a useful tool for extremists to stop humans from using land - public land.
“Consequently, you don’t see any other grazers in the trench with Bundy, only militia and oathkeepers.”
If you had met the folks there, you might understand your error. The ranchers in the west are being squeezed out of public land by environmental extremists who lie and twist the law in an attempt to prevent ‘evil man’ from ‘wounding Mother Gaia’.
I agree that Congress is the one who needs to be held accountable. However, I also agree that the land should be turned over to the states, because Arizona, Utah & Nevada can manage their land better than Washington DC!
I got mine from Angelo State, in west Texas, in ranch country, where I grew up.
But I also had 31 hours of college chemistry and a career in industrial chemicals, so my field is the Clean Air Act and the Clean Water Act, both enacted by Congress.
I suspect you are on the same side of the coin regarding pollution that you are on regarding conservation.
Would you happen to know where a quail and many other animals/creatures that reside in the desert and arid lands get their water.
A week ago, I posted that I was concerned Reid was going to have him and his family killed.
I was wondering something or other about that, since Reid and BLM have essentially attempted to kill off Bundy’s cattle.
I asked a question regarding that, as in what would happen next.
Someone answered me, saying that Reid was going to call Bundy a racist.
I distinctly remembered thinking, “what does that have to do with cattle and ranch land?” In addition to what has been going on with the Bundy story now, I am still asking, “What does that have to do with cattle and ranch land?”
Carrying capacity.
For animals now.
Next up: humans.
He only pays around $13.50 per month per unit.
***************
How much has he paid since 1998? Seems his little ranch don’t support his herd
thus he runs them on the gov’t land and doesn’t pay.
Do you know any of the fact?
Previously, on the thread, I was talking about grazers in general, not just Bundy.
I understand and what you say is true with regard to the fees being much
cheaper than if you own the land for grazing. But he’s not paying or hasn’t
in the last few years from what I’ve read.
Take care.
My biology degree was from Utah State, many years ago. My first job was with the Forest Service, back when it believed in multiple use. I later worked for the Utah DWR before entering the military.
Cutting out grazing hasn’t help the wildlife much. A friend had his sheep allotment stopped years ago to protect the desert bighorn, and now the bighorn have died off in that area - 15 years later.
Cutting grazing has helped wildlife. We have hunting ranches to prove that. And we have lots of land in the west Texas oilfields that haven’t been grazed since oil was discovered.
Mark Steyn ping.
Freepmail me, if you want on or off the Mark Steyn ping list.
Thanks for the ping Slings and Arrows.
BTTT
Well, if the ONLY goal is to maximize wildlife, then cutting all grazing makes some sense. However, I don’t believe in maximizing wildlife at all costs. The countryside I worked in around 1980, when grazing was higher, was still lush with wildlife.
Almost no humans besides ranchers and hunters ever go into many of these areas. Stock ponds, built to host cattle, provide steady water for other animals as well. Roads greatly improve access...good luck hiking very far into many large chunks of land in Arizona and Utah and Nevada. Without water - at 8lbs/gallon - you won’t last long.
I reject the idea that humans are evil, and using the land for forage and timber means we are abusing it. I will never be a preservationist.
In other words, the purpose of the federal bureaucracy's "grazing fee" was never to provide a fair-market value for the cost to taxpayers of permitting grazing on public land but simply to drive those cattle off the land, and their owners out of the ranching business. As a form of coercion, it worked. But it is not a "law" that should command any respect.
I think it's absurd and obnoxious that an obscure and unaccountable government agency should rule an area the size of France, Germany and Italy combined. What for? Why should the 26th largest country on earth (which the Bureau of Land Management is) be maintained in perpetuity as the world's biggest nature preserve for the desert tortoise? The seven-eighths of the United States that isn't under the iron rod of the BLM is the Brokest Nation in History: it wouldn't hurt to have a little more productive land.
I'm sooooo happy Steyn's on our side. Would not want to have a mind like that on the other side...
Have you read this book, Bob?
No, but I will when it arrives...
;>)
Actually, the tortoise is NOT endangered by the cattle. Quite the opposite - the available tortoise habitat is enhanced and expanded by the cows. Here’s how it works:
Any animal must stay within range of water. The available habitat for any given species is that which is within range of water.
Cattle can range much farther than a tortoise, therefore cattle have more available habitat than a tortoise,
EXCEPT
A cow periodically drops a big green tortoise cafeteria, with food and water for the tortoises, on her habitat. This allows the tortoise to establish habitat beyond its normal range (without cows present) by using the convenient food and drink deposits so generously left by the cows. Evidently, cows enjoy the company of tortoises (or is that “tortoi”?)
So it is clearly not about the tortoise!
Steyn is not saying Bundy is racist - he is “stipulating” to say “racism is not the point”. He is saying, racist or not, the acts of the government are unjustified.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.