Posted on 11/29/2011 7:24:16 AM PST by Kaslin
The governor of Oregon, John Kitzhaber, announced last week that he would not allow any more executions in his state during his time in office.
Kitzhaber, a Democrat, gave five reasons for his decision. My response follows each one.
1. "I refuse to be part of this compromised and inequitable system any longer."
This has become one of the most frequently offered reasons for objecting to capital punishment -- that because the system is not equitable, no murderer should be put to death.
This is a reason that is devoid of reason. If a system is not equitable, you don't end the system, you try to end what is not equitable. This is classic left-wing thinking -- destroy what is good if it is imperfect. Documentary-maker Michael Moore was recently on CNN with Anderson Cooper and provided a perfect example of this way of thinking.
Moore: "2011 capitalism is an evil system set up to benefit the few at the expense of the many."
Cooper: "So, what system do you want?"
Moore: "Well, there's no system right now that exists. We're going to create that system."
The utopian streak that is an essential part of the left-wing mind is puerile and destructive: "If it isn't perfect, eliminate it."
2. "I do not believe that those executions (the two that the governor allowed) made us safer."
We all acknowledge that two executions do not make us safer (though they do make it safer for prison guards and for other inmates). Who ever said two executions would make us safer? Overwhelmingly, the reason people give for supporting the death penalty is justice. It is indescribably unjust to allow everyone who deliberately takes a human life to keep his own.
But if you want to talk safety, then yes, we who support the death penalty are certain that, applied with any consistency, it is a deterrent. The late sociologist Ernest van den Haag had an interesting thought experiment. Suppose that murders committed on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays carried a death sentence, while those committed on the other days were punishable by a prison sentence. On which days do you suppose more murders would be committed?
The notion that parking tickets deter illegal parking but that death does not deter murder is truly irrational. It shows what happens when people put ideology over common sense.
3. "Certainly I don't believe (the executions of murderers) made us more noble as a society."
Why is it noble to keep all murderers alive? Was Israel less noble for executing Adolf Eichmann, the architect of the Holocaust? When two men enter the home of a family of four; rape the wife and two young daughters; beat all four nearly to death, leaving them in the agony of crushed bones and skulls; and then tie them up and burn the three females to death, why is it "noble" to keep the men who did that alive?
4. Oregon has an "unworkable system that fails to meet basic standards of justice."
Opponents of the death penalty make it virtually impossible to execute murderers. They then lament how long and laborious the effort is to execute a murderer.
5. "... And I simply cannot participate in something I believe morally wrong."
Opponents of the death penalty simply assert the death penalty is immoral. That is their prerogative. But "morally wrong" in this context means nothing more than "I don't like it." Indeed, as reported in the The New York Times, "Asked with whom (Kitzhaber) had consulted, he said, 'Mostly myself.'"
Kitzhaber's moratorium delays the execution of a murderer who had raped and brutally beaten to death a woman named Mary Archer. Needless to say, the family and friends of Mary Archer disagree with the governor's action.
"We are just plain devastated," said the man who had been Mary Archer's husband. "This is such a miscarriage of justice."
Indeed it is. And worse. Societies that allow all murderers to live have lost some of their hunger for justice and certainly lost their hatred of evil. They also cheapen the crime of murder. Punishment is society's way of communicating how serious it views a crime, and there is all the difference in the world between the death penalty and life (not to mention less time) in prison.
When all murderers are allowed to live, the evil exult while the victims weep. Why is that noble?
and there is of course the oldest conundrum..that some 95% of those who oppose the death penalty are in favor of abortion..
You know what? Look, just stop the killing. Yeah, it’s expensive IN DOLLARS to keep the criminal alive, But think what it costs in emotional damage to the executioners, judges, jurors and so forth to execute the criminal. NOT WORTH IT. Especially if you are wrong........there is no redo if the guy is six feet under.
Economics is NOT a good reason to execute someone. God won’t buy that reasoning.
I used to support the death penalty, saying things like “Well, at least that particular criminal won’t murder anyone else.” now, I see that the whole of our civilization really depends on not killing...no abortion, no euthanasia, no death penalty.
Money has no business in this debate.
I can see the emotional damage it has already caused in this thread.
He who is merciful to the cruel will become cruel to the merciful.
well, you mean it damaged me?
No, I’m damaged, but not by this thread.
The Oregon “governor” clearly made his dopey announcement for publicity, since they haven’t executed anyone in years, but still, all the appeals, the years and years of expensive appeals, you aren’t part of the legal system, I take it, which is close to being overwhelmed as it is, and mistakes are likely to be more common not less. There are other things to spend ourselves on.
You are the only one who has mentioned it.
consequently, I think the fix for the death penalty is prudence. It needs to be carried out soon and publicly to truly be an effective deterrent.
The idea that a death sentence is punishment at the end is wrong. The person being executed doesn't suffer. They just die. The suffering is the part leading up to your known death. How would you like to know the exact hour of your death, 15 years in advance. That is the punishment part.
There is no sense in punishing a person that will never again be integrated back into normal society.
Ask me how guilty I feel about putting a .22 slug through the forehead of a woodchuck who was merely threatening to flood my home by digging holes in a dike.
If he cannot force himself to abide by the laws he took an oath to enforce, he should step down and let a real Governor have a chance.
He has every chance to look at the court records of every convicted killer before their exeution, if he has any doubts of their guilt he should give them a pardon, If he feels they are guilty he should have the balls to order their execution.
- Jesus Christ
6but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea.
Sounds like capitol punishment to me.
What do I win?
Yeah, real cute answer.
However a woodchuck doesn’t have to go through a trial and a bunch of appeals. So go ahead, do what you h ave to do to the woodchuck tough guy. A woodchuck is not a human. And you caught him in the act. Some murderers will die when caught i the act. But most murderers don’t murder out in the open., They sneak. You have a mind, you can tell these things too.
His answers cover the whole legal system. I guess the answer is.....no more lawyers.
“... And I simply cannot participate in something I believe morally wrong.”
So it’s okay for the Guv, but not for doctors, nurses, pharmacists, etc., when it comes to abortion? At least the convicted murderers on Death Row had due process (and then some)...
Actually, money does have a business in this debate.
When New York passed its last capital sentencing statute, some of the upstate DAs opposed implementing it. Why? Because a death penalty case runs upward of $4 million to prosecute [including the inevitable and protracted appeals], and many rural counties didn’t have the budgets to do that. And cost and protraction of the process is a major weapon used by the opponents of capital punishment.
And not having a death penalty, IMHO, demeans every victim killed, because, somehow, that person’s life is worth less than the slimeball who killed him/ her/ them.
I’m a former prosecutor. I saw lefty judges on appeal] pull the death penalty off a perp who had murdered three women we IDed, and at least five we couldn’t. And as for emotional damage to the executioners, I’d have been glad to kill him myself.
Not sure I understand your comment...I was pointing out what is, for me the obvious ethical fallacy that most people who say they are morally opposed to the death penalty are also for the most part in favor of abortion..
You are crazy.
Executing demons of death IS support of life and the determination to support a environment for life-leaving them around, releasing them, and creating a “you can do anything and get away with your life society” is pro-death. If you can’t get that, then I’m baffled how you came to your other stated, and absolutely correct assertions (no abortion, no euthanasia)
Castle Law and a well-armed citizenry is a better deterrent. The end of the criminal is immediate, at the scene of the crime, publicized to all his friends as an educational moment, versus execution 20 years later when all his friends have forgotten him.
So this ELECTED official will not execute CONVICTED CRIMINALS.
Fine. As long as he puts a stop to the execution of innocent babies..
Yeah like a Democrat will do that!!
This should convince you
Kitzhaber wins backing of abortion rights groups
Is the sarcasm tag necessary?
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