Posted on 10/30/2011 4:05:59 PM PDT by Kaslin
A number of years ago, I was on Larry King Live and was asked point-blank if I had a problem with the appointments of Justices Roberts and Alito (both are Roman Catholics). My answer was very clear that I did not, as long as they shared my own conviction of upholding the Constitution — not trying to rewrite it — and as long as they were committed to the Biblical values of the Founding Fathers. I was certain that both men were.
Many people today are quoting a statement reputedly made by Martin Luther, the great reformer, that he “would rather be ruled by a competent Turk (a Muslim) than an incompetent Christian.” First of all, there is no evidence whatsoever that Martin Luther ever said these words. But even if he did say them, it would have been a gross exaggeration used to make a point. He never lived under a Muslim ruler and did not know what that would be like. But I did. And I can tell you, there is no such thing as choosing between Muslim and non-Muslim leaders under Islam.
pastedGraphic.pdf In America, we have the great privilege of choosing candidates based on our core values, rather than how they identify with our theological point of view.
In looking at some of the candidates for the 2012 election, one cannot help but notice the controversies that have arisen regarding the Mormon religion. As I considered Luther’s quote and the concerns regarding electing a Mormon president, I noticed some peculiar similarities between the Mormon faith and Islam as they relate to orthodox Christianity.
It's hard to believe that two religions that are worlds apart geographically have so many things in common. Here are some examples:
1. Both believe that Christianity was corrupt and incomplete until their respective founders came on the scene. For Islam, it was Muhammad; for Mormons, it was Joseph Smith.
2. They both have their own book of “sacred scripture.” While both tip their hats to the Bible, each see God’s Word as insufficient by itself. Both Islam and Mormonism use many biblical themes, narratives and personalities. But the Qur’an draws heavily from the apocryphal books rather than the authoritative cannon of the Bible.
3. In both cases, Islam and Mormonism see their religion as complete within itself. Above all, both repudiate Biblical Christianity and identify orthodox Christianity as a false faith.
4. Both religions reject the doctrine of the Trinity. The Mormon’s concept of god includes many gods, not just one. Muslims view god as one, but as an aloof, remote god who could never become a man or relate to humanity. Allah can have mercy if he wants to, but he is also a cunning god.
5. Both religions reject the Bible as the sole and sufficient authority of faith. For Mormons, the Book of Mormon and other writings of the Latter Day Saints represent God’s final revelation. For Muslims, the Qur’an and the Sunna (traditions of Muhammad) constitute God’s final authoritative word.
6. They both reject the Biblical teaching of original sin. Muslims believe Adam did not become completely depraved after disobeying God; he merely slipped but quickly recovered. Therefore to Muslims, humanity does not need redemption. Salvation in Islam is very uncertain, even when keeping the Five Tenants of Islam; although some teach that jihad will help in that quest for salvation. Mormons believe that they are not condemned by what many call “original sin.” In other words, they are not accountable for Adam’s transgression in the Garden of Eden.
Here are two questions Christians must ask when considering political candidates:
First, has the candidate been consistent in his/her political and moral values, or is he/she pandering? Second, has the candidate upheld their philosophical convictions throughout their public and private life, or did they change their political convictions to suit their audience?
All believers need to be good stewards and spend time in deep prayer before exercising their right to vote. God will give us wisdom so that we will not be persuaded by the slickest and the cleverest. We can trust Him to help us choose those who have proven core values.
There are a myriad of reasons to not support Romney but the ones you stated are silly. You’re statements are completely idiotic.
Good Grief..
I am not supporting Romney because he is a wishy washy flip flopper..and not a conservative.
Religions founded by unsuccessful flaky males always go for polygamy, because that’s the only way they can get any. Joseph Smith was a fruitloop who got his start looking for gold through a “magic crystal” in his hat, and Brigham Young was sort of an entrepreneur who knew a good thing when he saw it.
The religion was an aggressive, vicious theocracy, exactly like Islam, and only backed down because of the US Cavalry...Utah could not become a state until it renounced some of the precepts of Mormonism.
It’s exactly like Islam. But maybe we could have Dueling Prophets, where Mad Mo and Joseph Smith face off wearing Mexican wrestling masks?
My cousin is married to a Mormon and they both worked in a power plant with all Mormons except him, he retired the first day he was eligible and moved to Hawaii and told his wife she could join him when she retired.
Protestantism had no problem burning people at the stake, either, and in its brief existence, even shorter than that of Islam, probably offed about as many people (including those among rival Protestant groups). Religious wars are awful, but they are the function of human error, and the difference is that Christianity is not founded on warfare and killing. Islam is.
My statements are the truth. Maybe a shade over your head, but truthful. Mitt Romney is at the same as the 33rd degree of Freemasonry. I think that means he is a Bishop in the MOrmon Church. Knowing as little as you apparently do about the Mormon Church, if you think Romney would be president all by himself I have a bridge to sell you. Read Trisha Erickson’s “Can Mitt Serve Two Masters?”. She is a daughter of another Mormon Bishop, and she is no longer a member of the Mormon Church.
My "theological point of view", is the basis for my "core values".
yeah you are sooo smart, smarter than everyone else on the internet
I think the proof is readily available that the Black Plague of the Middle Ages was merely a Vatican ruse to cover the millions of Europeans the Catholoc Church killed in its Inquisition. The Papists were notorious for wiping out whole villages just to take over the property for Church ownership. I think I read that the final body count over 50 years of Inquisition (1380-1430a.d) was 25 million true Christians. In comparison, Islam can only be credited with the inadvertent death of two to three thousand pagans and heretics since the end of the Crusades.
Look it up...
Most of my family are Mormons. Everything you said is true. But you forgot this part. I was just down visiting this weekend and told mom and dad I couldn't stay all weekend. Mom told that me was ok and served those dead babies they had sacrificed the night before and were saving for Halloween dinner. IT WAS GREAT! MY MOM SURE CAN COOK!!!
“I Will Be a Second Mohammed”
In the heat of the Missouri “Mormon War” of 1838, Joseph Smith made the following claim, “I will be to this generation a second Mohammed, whose motto in treating for peace was ‘the Alcoran [Koran] or the Sword.’ So shall it eventually be with us—‘Joseph Smith or the Sword!’ ”[1]
It is most interesting that a self-proclaimed Christian prophet would liken himself to Mohammed, the founder of Islam. His own comparison invites us to take a closer look as well. And when we do, we find some striking—and troubling—parallels. Consider the following.
Mohammed and Joseph Smith both had humble beginnings. Neither had formal religious connections or upbringing, and both were relatively uneducated. Both founded new religions by creating their own scriptures. In fact, followers of both prophets claim these scriptures are miracles since their authors were the most simple and uneducated of men.[2]
Both prophets claim of having angel visitations, and of receiving divine revelation to restore pure religion to the earth again. Mohammed was told that both Jews and Christians had long since corrupted their scriptures and religion. In like manner, Joseph Smith was told that all of Christianity had become corrupt, and that consequently the Bible itself was no longer reliable. In both cases, this corruption required a complete restoration of both scripture and religion. Nothing which preceded either prophet could be relied upon any longer. Both prophets claim they were used of God to restore eternal truths which once existed on earth, but had been lost due to human corruption.
Both prophets created new scripture which borrowed heavily from the Bible, but with a substantially new “spin.” In his Koran, Mohammed appropriates a number of Biblical themes and characters—but he changes the complete sense of many passages, claiming to “correct” the Bible. In so doing he changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place. In like manner, Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, much of which is plagiarized directly from the King James Bible. Interestingly, the Book of Mormon claims that this same Bible has been substantially corrupted and is therefore unreliable. In addition, Joseph Smith went so far as to actually create his own version of the Bible itself, the “Inspired Version,” in which he both adds and deletes significant portions of text, claiming he is “correcting” it. In so doing he also changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place.
As a part of their new scriptural “spin,” both prophets saw themselves as prophesied in scripture, and both saw themselves as a continuation of a long line of Biblical prophets. Mohammed saw himself as a continuation of the ministry of Moses and Jesus. Joseph Smith saw himself as a successor to Enoch, Melchizedek, Joseph and Moses. Joseph Smith actually wrote himself into his own version of the Bible—by name.
Both prophets held up their own scripture as superior to the Bible. Mohammed claimed that the Koran was a perfect copy of the original which was in heaven. The Koran is therefore held to be absolutely perfect, far superior to the Bible and superceding it. In like manner, Joseph Smith also made the following claim. “I told the Brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding its precepts, than by any other book.”[3]
Despite their claim that the Bible was corrupt, both prophets admonished their followers to adhere to its teachings. An obvious contradiction, this led to selective acceptance of some portions and wholesale rejection of others. As a result, the Bible is accepted by both groups of followers only to the extent that it agrees with their prophet’s own superior revelation.
Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith taught that true salvation was to be found only in their respective religions. Those who would not accept their message were considered “infidels,” pagans or Gentiles. In so doing, both prophets became the enemy of genuine Christianity, and have led many people away from the Christ of the Bible.
Both prophets encountered fierce opposition to their new religions and had to flee from town to town because of threats on their lives. Both retaliated to this opposition by forming their own militias. Both ultimately set up their own towns as model societies.
Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith left unclear instructions about their successors. The majority of Mohammed’s followers, Sunni Muslims, believe they were to elect their new leader, whereas the minority, Shiite Muslims, believe Mohammed’s son was to be their next leader. Similarly, the majority of Joseph Smith’s followers, Mormons, believed their next prophet should have been the existing leader of their quorum of twelve apostles, whereas the minority, RLDS, believed Joseph Smith’s own son should have been their next prophet. Differences on this issue, and many others, have created substantial tension between these rival groups of each prophet.
Mohammed taught that Jesus was just another of a long line of human prophets, of which he was the last. He taught that he was superior to Christ and superceded Him. In comparison, Joseph Smith also made the following claim.
“I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet.”[4] In light of these parallels, perhaps Joseph Smith’s claim to be a second Mohammed unwittingly became his most genuine prophecy of all.
________________________________________
[1] Joseph Smith made this statement at the conclusion of a speech in the public square at Far West, Missouri on October 14, 1838. This particular quote is documented in Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History, second edition, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1971), p. 230–231. Fawn Brodie’s footnote regarding this speech contains valuable information, and follows. “Except where noted, all the details of this chapter [16] are taken from the History of the [Mormon] Church. This speech, however, was not recorded there, and the report given here is based upon the accounts of seven men. See the affidavits of T.B. Marsh, Orson Hyde, George M. Hinkle, John Corrill, W.W. Phelps, Samson Avard, and Reed Peck in Correspondence, Orders, etc., pp. 57–9, 97–129. The Marsh and Hyde account, which was made on October 24, is particularly important. Part of it was reproduced in History of the [Mormon] Church, Vol. III, p. 167. See also the Peck manuscript, p. 80. Joseph himself barely mentioned the speech in his history; see Vol. III, p. 162.”
[2] John Ankerberg & John Weldon, The Facts on Islam, (Eugene, OR: Harvest House Publishers, 1998), pp.8–9. Eric Johnson, Joseph Smith & Muhammed, (El Cajon, CA: Mormonism Research Ministry, 1998), pp. 6–7.
[3] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.4, pp.461.
[4] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.6, pp.408–409.
(Decker, Ed, My Kingdom Come: The Mormon Quest for Godhood, Xulon Press, 2007)
I'm not aware that Martin Luther ever had anyone beheaded or burned at the stake for disagreeing with his theological perspective.
John Calvin, however, did.
Very accurate! Thanks for posting this factual analysis.
The only thing that kept Mormonism from being a scourge like Islam is that the US was powerful enough to knock it back. Mohammed had his “visions” well after the fall of the Roman Empire, during a time when the Eastern and Western Church were alienated and there was no major secular power. That was what enabled him to sweep through and subjugate a number of unwary civilizations around him.
Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, fortunately, arrived at the wrong time and were not able to do that here in the US. But I do believe the Mormons are still trying, and I read recently that they are thinking of bringing back polygamy now that the US government has adopted “gay marriage.”
The only question in my mind is whether the Mormons and the Muslims will have to duke it out somewhere, or whether the Muslims will make some way of accepting the Mormons as perhaps a lost tribe of Muslims with their own incarnation of their prophet. Or something. I don’t know, but the two groups are so similar that something is going to have to give.
And I sure don’t want somebody from either group as President.
:o) If nothing else, you are colorful.
Even being raised in Salt Lake City area. I wasn't ready for the “business-mormon” structure of the power company.
Soooooo he created a religion to counter the "man-made" religion.
coginitive-dissonance alert.
I jumped to the conclusion that you are funny.
Funny-haha.
Not funny strange.
Like some mormons.
Comparing Luther to Popes is like comparing Barack Obama to Abraham Lincoln.
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