Posted on 07/26/2011 8:17:51 PM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
NATO warns Turkey against buying Chinese, Russian air defense systems
ÜMİT ENGİNSOY
ANKARA- Hürriyet Daily News
Monday, July 25, 2011
NATO may avoid sharing ballistic missiles intelligence with Turkey if the nation decides to buy Chinese or Russian systems for its missile defense program
Ankara would have to operate without NATO’s intelligence information on incoming ballistic missiles if it chooses to buy Chinese or Russian systems for its national air and missile defense program, officials of the Western alliance have warned Turkey.
Participating in the ongoing competition to win Turkey’s national air and missile contract are the U.S. partnership between Raytheon and Lockheed Martin, with their Patriot air defense systems; Russia’s Rosoboronexport, marketing the S300; China’s CPMIEC (China Precision Machinery Export-Import Corp.), offering its HQ-9; and the Italian-French Eurosam, maker of the SAMP/T Aster 30. Turkey is planning to make its selection late this year or early next year.
Many Western officials and experts say that since the Russian and the Chinese systems are not compatible with NATO systems, their potential eventual victory might provide them with access to classified NATO information, and as a result may compromise NATO’s procedures.
But despite this criticism, Turkey so far has ruled against expelling the Chinese and Russian options, saying there is no need to exclude them from the Turkish competition.
One Western expert countered that “if, say, the Chinese win the competition, their systems will be in interaction, directly or indirectly, with NATO’s intelligence systems, and this may lead to the leak of critical NATO information to the Chinese, albeit inadvertently. So this is dangerous.”
“NATO won’t let that happen,” another Western official told the Hürriyet Daily News on Monday. “If the Chinese or the Russians win the Turkish contest, their systems will have to work separately. They won’t be linked to NATO information systems.”
This was the first time NATO has strongly urged Turkey against choosing the non-Western systems.
“One explanation is that Turkey itself doesn’t plan to [ultimately] select the Chinese or Russian alternatives, but still is retaining them among their options to put pressure on the Americans and the Europeans to [lower] their prices,” the Western expert said.
Turkey’s long-range air and missile defense systems program (T-Loramids) has been designed to counter both enemy aircraft and missiles.
NATO missile shield
Turkey’s national program is totally separate and independent from NATO’s own plans to design, develop and build its own collective missile shield.
The Western alliance decided during a leaders’ summit meeting in Lisbon in November last year to create the collective missile shield against potential incoming ballistic missiles from rogue countries. Ankara agreed to the decision only after the alliance accepted a Turkish request that Iran or other countries would not be specifically mentioned as potential sources of threats.
NATO now is seeking to deploy a special X-band radar in Turkish territory for the early detection of missiles launched from the region.
Senior U.S. and Turkish officials discussed the matter in mid-July in Istanbul on the sidelines of a visit by U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, and both sides reported progress toward an eventual deployment of the X-band radar on Turkish soil.
Ideally, in the event of a launch of a ballistic missile from a rogue state, it would be detected by the X-band radar, and U.S.-made SM-3 interceptors – based on U.S. Aegis destroyers to be deployed in the eastern Mediterranean and later possibly in Romania – would then be fired to hit the incoming missile mid-flight.
Ping.
Why? Why? Because NATO fears the high quality of Russian and Chinese export defense systems?
Dear Turkey: buy all the Russian and Chinese junk you want. And good luck with that.
I suspect Turkey will be expected to pay cash up front.
Oh hell I’m thinking of Greece, nevermind.
It may actually make sense. Quality of the system and quality of operators are related. If Turkey doesn't expect top-notch operators for the best systems that NATO can deliver then perhaps it doesn't make much of a difference how good the hardware is. The best sub-MOA rifle will not help you if the best group you can make is 10" at 50 yards.
But since your lira can buy two or three systems from Russia and China compared to one from NATO countries, Turkey gets accordingly 2x or 3x more air defense systems in quantity. Since the quality of the intercept is the same (limited by poor training of operators) they in fact gain extra protection by having more systems. There is also the issue of coverage; even one great system can't protect more area than its radar can see. Also one expensive, good system is a vulnerability.
That is exactly the same reason why infantry is not armed with expensive sniper rifles but instead are given a very average - but cheap and sturdy - rifle. AK-47 conquered the world is not because it is accurate for a sniper; it is just accurate enough for a peasant. Most of engineering is also done on this principle - all parts of a larger system must be equally good (or equally bad) and ideally should fail at the same time.
The new Russian defense system, if it is as good as bill, it is a copy of out patriots, with longer range and phase radar, will take down anything we fly. And seeing the rouge status of NATO. And the illegal war on Libya, I would say Russia and china will sell the hell out of them. Daffy had some on order, but they had never been delivered.
Everything the Russians have fielded in the last 50 years has been in pairs or triplets, in the hopes at least one would work as advertised. Buying the initial system is one thing; getting technical assistance and spare parts is another they haven’t ever quite mastered.
I think NATO has slipped its leash.
“Who lost Turkey?”
Turkey is an extremely important strategic ally (they control the Bosporus). Today Turkey is tilting eastwards and the West is still busy issuing ultimatums.
You guys haven’t yet woken up to the strategic realities of the 21st Century.
***Why? Why? Because NATO fears the high quality of Russian and Chinese export defense systems?
Dear Turkey: buy all the Russian and Chinese junk you want. And good luck with that.***
Like Alphonse “Al” Capone, when losing turfs to the Russian Mafioso’s of Brooklyn or the Chinese triads of Canal Street, you do the most sensible thing available: you send in your Boy’s with the biggest baseball bat there ever was and you say to your clients pay your due dues or else (:)...
***I think NATO has slipped its leash.***
If you don’t put a cocked gun point blank at their foreheads, those Joseph Stalin kins just ain’t gonna listen (:)...
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