Posted on 02/05/2011 5:21:45 PM PST by Reagan69
On February 9, the Let’s Move! anniversary, the First Lady will deliver a major address focused specifically on the campaign’s efforts to meet the needs of parents. Mrs. Obama will reach out to parents to commend them for the impact they have had on fundamentally shifting the conversation on childhood obesity this year. In a speech hosted by North Point Community Church and Ray of Hope Christian Church at North Point’s congregation in Alpharetta, Georgia, Mrs. Obama will share personal reflections about how she came to this issue, discuss the issues parents deal with, and what has been achieved together.
“You have stated repeatedly that you know that the statement you have made is true. “
No. I have stated repeatedly that I HEARD exactly what I have posted here. I have now way of knowing how North Point voted - except by the words of that person. I have stated that I know that person to be a reliable source - but that is my opinion.
Let me remind you of what I said:
“They had a majority of their members vote for Obama.”
(Clarified by...)
“Top level staff person told me - and that’s all I can say.”
“I stand by my statement 100%.”
“Suite yourself. It’s 100% true.” (The fact that I heard what I reported).
“Why? Because I am telling the truth. What I said happened did happen.”
“It is true and I will say it again... According to a person at North Point who absolutely would be in the position to know, a majority of the North Point congregation voted for Obama in the 2008 election.”
“I will not retract ONE THING. I HEARD what I HEARD!”
“I heard what I heard what I heard and I will affirm it till the day I die.”
“I DO know it. I know what was said and have reported it accurately. Period!”
++++++++++++++
“You have been shown correspondence from a church representative that they do not have access this information at North Point, and you refuse to source your claim in order refute this correspondence.”
Wrong. I was clear from the outset - no source. You knew I was clear about that before you contacted NP.
++++++++++++++
“To continue to claim that you know this for a fact is to lie. You should stop now.”
Nice! Try to reframe the argument so as to save face. The fact I claim - as you can clearly tell from the above collection of statement - is that I HEARD a person say what I said they did.
I KNOW FOR A FACT that I HEARD it.
Baloney...it is you who are attempting to save face and credibility here. You not only stated that
“They had a majority of their members vote for Obama,” you followed that statement with
"I can’t say who told me, but the person would FOR SURE know" and
"They might not have exact numbers, but they can know which way the church is leaning."
You didn't just claim that you heard something...you claimed that what you heard was true and you even offered a rationale:
I am relating this because I know it to be true and it partially explains why they would sponsor Michelle.
--------------------------------------------
You are continuing to post unsourced hearsay, which you will not document, and you are now attempting to cover your tracks. It isn't working and the kind of claims you're making don't belong on this board. You are smearing this church by attempting to tie in what you claim are the majority of its members' politics with the church leaders' decision to allow Michelle Obama to speak there. That kind of rank defamation doesn't belong on this board.
You should stop now.
I am a long time member of NPCC, as I mentioned in my original posting, and will be able to attend this afternoon. As I stated, I am surprised by the invitation, but the response posted in 93 seems to be the church response. I want to be sure what is said off the camera is not political. Make no mistake, the fact the FLOTUS is coming to the church is political - yes it is a convenient venue but as the 104 post stated it is huge coup for her to be there, and I don’t see the upside for the church, but I do trust the church leadership and am going to go today with an open-mind, and listen Sunday for an explanation, if there is one in the sermon, and I will let you know.
And thanks haircutter, I see your point already about the postings. Several of Andy’s sermon lines cited (I recognize them all) are cited out of context, but that is for another discussion. Let me assure those interested in this that I will try to give feedback to the church about all these concerns. They are very open to member feedback. I will also let you know what I think of her visit and the church explanation.
Haircutter, thanks for the welcome. This is the first time I’ve heard of FR and only found it because of the topic Reagan69 started. It’s been interesting so far.
Reagan69... Want to protest, do you? I was doing some of that myself on Sunday when I found out about this!
I’ve worked with pastors nearly all my life and have never seen one handle Scripture and life as well as Andy. I have also never had an occasion when I disagreed with NPCC leadership before Sunday. I know some have problems with the music and setup, but this church has a heart for the unchurched and have programs set up specifically for them, figuring perhaps there are already many churches where the churched are already made to feel welcome. Most of the unchurched in America, from what I understand, fall in the age bracket of about 18-28 and/or they are people who were formally churched. Andy is rather unassuming in the pulpit — he does not assume all who are there are committed Christians. He does assume there are those in the audience who have nearly given up on church, who are just testing the waters, or who were dragged there. You would feel comfortable inviting an atheist. Not because Andy doesn’t preach Christ or from the Bible — every Sunday Scripture is on the screens and the purpose of the church is stated exactly as Chunga and justsaynomore quoted. And not because he doesn’t tackle tough topics, like personal responsibility, fidelity, appetites, verbal abuse, tempers, Biblical times, Christ being THE way, etc. He does. But mostly because he says statements like... “Maybe you’re not even a Christian, maybe you’re just checking this out, but...” or “Hey, I’m telling you, you should read your Bible. There’s some really interesting stuff in here.” The number of people listening to Andy every Sunday isn’t due to mob mentality—it’s because he handles Scripture accurately and without arrogance.
BUT, Obama’s program on the front page of our website? Obama’s name linked with NPCC in numerous news stories? Obama’s program validated by the hard-earned reputation of NPCC’s volunteers, staff, and pastors? NPCC a “validator” church, in true Axelrod context? NPCC conveying by association and promotion a focus on leading others into a growing relationship with the Obamas? NPCC not staying above reproach with regards to politics? Saying a program featuring a politician won’t be political in tone makes it not so? Saying Grace was extended makes gracing a politician’s ambitions right? Saying it’s an outreach program for the unchurched when the nation is so horribly polarized that you can’t help but offend half the nation, unchurched or churched?
This is just so out of character for North Point. Some have a problem with prayer at the inauguration, but that is definitely Biblical like justsaynomore said. I made a resolution to pray every day for our leaders but didn’t pull it off. I’m glad for anyone who is more diligent. Andy prayed for civil leaders and ended with “through Jesus Christ our Lord.” He, as usual, lived his faith well and above reproach and better than I ever will.
I don’t have to wait until the service today, though, to decide on how I feel about Obama’s program being featured at NPCC. I feel horrible about it.
I really did think it was out of character for NPCC.
I saw this morning they scrubbed their facebook site of all the negative posts about this event, but left up the 1 positive comment. This is a shame, some of the people there were making very sound, Biblical arguments against this event.
One guy said he’d been at NPCC for many years, but Sunday was the first time he felt like he was being sold a bill of goods.
Welcome aboard. FR is a great forum for news discussion, and often draws subject matter experts and local people familiar with the topic being discussed for “behind the news” insights, as you are seeing in this thread. Which is also great for cutting through the BS in most news items from the MSM. The user interface here takes a little time to fully understand, but it is quite powerful once learned and is worth the learning curve. And FReepers are generally helpful if asked.
Back to this topic, I’m local (a bit to the south of A-retta, but OTP), and while I’m not familiar with NPCC, it struck me as an odd venue for a program like this as well.
You can see my commentary on this event in #112. You, being a member, might well have a good reason to protest. Though from the looks of this thread, no one has really put one together, at least here.
And again, welcome to FR.
“You should stop now.”
You can continue to post till you are blue in the face, but I confirm my statements on this thread 100%.
You are attempting to mischaracterize my statements on this thread. I have set you straight once - yet you persist. I have no time for posters who use your tactics. Arguing with you is pointless because you will, doubtless, continue to attempt change the terms of the argument.
I will not reply to your post from here on except to reaffirm that I stand by what I have posted 100%.
So mark it down, Chunga: I stand by what I have posted 100%.
Sesamesticks-
glad to hear from a fellow NPCCer. You have stated Andy and the church’s teaching approach much better than I and I thank you for your clarity. This whole event was quite a shock for me and I happened on to this discussion while googling for info about FLOTUS visit. I, like you, am planning to discuss more with the church and debate the wisdom of this invite, even though this visit is a done deal. I am hopeful this will not happen again. I will be in attendance today and watching with a discerning eye.
I completely agree with you. I have attended NPCC on and off for 15 years and I have not seen Andy take any direct conservative side to his sermons. In fact He has an increasingly “one world” message that really botheres me so much I started attending his father’s church instead. I think that Andy is falling down a path of wanting to be “cool” and “politically correct”. He is really leading a large group of Atlanta’s youth in the wrong direction! If you really listen to his sermons with a clear conservative view, then it becomes obvious he is walking a fine line not to offend his liberal members and in fact favors that view. I think Andy’s church tries to be “attractive” to the general community just like Randy Pope’s church- Perimeter Church. It is all just “too cool for school” if you know what I mean.
“It is all just “too cool for school” if you know what I mean.”
Your post is spot on.
I would love to see some first-hand reports afterward.
will watch at the gov. web site but hate to give them a ‘hit’
will look forward to your notes on what you thought of the event.
carole
haircutter
I read that he will be participating in Rick Warren’s Radicalis Pastor’s conference. Warren’s already gone off the deep end if you ask me. He will have a mysticist as one of the participants there. I’m not saying Andy has gone that far but it sounds like he’s headed that direction.
That is one of the scary things about being a “seeker-friendly” church, some get very close to that “line”, and it doesn’t take much to push them over.
I go to a contemporary, caring and upbeat church, but they are doctrinally sound. The environment is seeker-friendly, but only to a point. They don’t tiptoe around sin, they preach it is sin and are not afraid to offend.
Wow, justsaynomore. Wow. I am not on facebook so I didn’t see any of comments, but wow. :(
Freedomposter, thanks for the info. I am not a member of NPCC (no membership drives/invitations thankfully); I just attend. But I am one of the “20,000” people that this politician now keeps advertising an association with as she leverages “one of the largest churches of the world” for her own purposes. Also, just to clarify, I was never looking for a protest. I was just looking for someone who felt the revolt I felt. Reagan69’s topic came the closest and I appreciate the forum she started. Thanks for the welcome.
I am Not, nice screen name. One of my favorite songs. :)
Don’t go there with an “open” mind, go there with a “discerning” mind. An open mind is just what Obama is looking for!
"They had a majority of their members vote for Obama...they might not have exact numbers, but they can know which way the church is leaning...I am relating this because I know it to be true and it partially explains why they would sponsor Michelle."
You have read a response from a church representative:
"THAT is totally false information. We have no way of knowing how people voted and we don't want to know. We have never spoken in political tones, and never will. We strategically stay neutral and focused on our Mission, "To Lead people into a growing relationship with Jesus Christ.
Anyone that says that is wrong and doesn't even know us.
Thanks for checking the facts."
Then you mused that perhaps the representative isn't privy to all the information the church has...but you are privy to information you can't source about a majority of the church members voting for Obama. LOL!
You have smeared this church with unsourced information and hearsay. You are rumormongering. You have passed along hearsay that would cause people to connect its members' politics with its ministry, and you've done it on purpose. It's absolutely despicable.
You've defending yourself here, PetroniusMaximus? Have you been worried that PetroniusMinimus and apx67QBush might read this and think less of your screen name? You've defamed an entire congregation of believers with your posts! Good riddance. Liar!
“You’ve” = “You’re”
RE: “You’ve defamed an entire congregation of believers with your posts! Good riddance. Liar!”
“Please: ... NO personal attacks,”
“You stand by these statements 100%:”
I STAND BY what I have posted 100%!
In your case, “Liar” isn’t a personal attack.
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