Posted on 01/20/2011 7:13:44 AM PST by Red Badger
Rest In Peace, old friend, your work is finished.....
If you want ON or OFF the DIESEL KnOcK LIST just FReepmail me.....
This is a fairly HIGH VOLUME ping list on some days.....
So how much subsidy is required? What about hydrogen stations? Who pays for that? Who pays for the conversion costs? Who pays for the increased cost of production? Who pays for the production of significant amounts of hydrogen? Who pays to store it? Who pays to transport it?
Probably the taxpayers. Again. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
How much energy is expended in obtaining the hydrogen?
Yard tractors are a long way from over the road trucking, let alone over the mountain trucking.
Fuel cell tech sounds like it might be fine for cars and local fleet vehicles.
But a fuel cell combined with regenerative braking may be cheaper overall than a natural gas or diesel powered bus.
“Indias leading automaker, Tata Motors”
(hee hee hee hee?)
—
http://www.oregonlive.com/business/index.ssf/2010/03/car_fire_raises_safety_concern.html
“Car fire raises safety concerns for Tata Motors”
Published: Thursday, March 25, 2010, 6:42 PM Updated: Thursday, March 25, 2010, 6:50 PM
Pic: http://media.oregonlive.com/business_impact/photo/car-in-flamesjpg-ed2808c6cd581e58_large.jpg
I expect to see Apple jump to the forefront on Fuel Cells. The Liquid Metal patent they now own, sounds almost ideal for use in Fuel Cells. The metal has to be very corrosion resistant, capable of handling high temperatures, and very conductive (Liquid Metal is ideal).
I expect Apple to release a Fuel Cell powered product in the next year. Imagine an iPod that can run for a day or two off a tablespoon of water.
I was in Japan last year and all the Tokyo city busses and maintence vehicles were hydrogen powered. Honda has an Accord that is hydrogen powered, with a home power station,and 55 mpg, but the U.S. will not let them import it
Just moved from my home in CA. It was on a street served by the transit bus system. Would have been greatful if those busses had been quiet electric!
The answer is FAR more than you get from burning (oxidizing) the hydrogen in the fuel cell! More than half the electricity in the US comes from burning coal. A hydrogen fuel cell vehicle simply is an inefficient coal powered vehicle.
two questions:
1) how long before the truck needs to be refeuled?
2) doesn’t it take more energy to put the hydrogen INTO a cell than you get out of it?
Intel has bought a company with a fuel cell product ready to go to market which will use butane to power the fuel cell recharging device. Hopefully, one of those will soon be replacing the rats nest of cables I lug around!
Instead of:
gas -> combustion-> mechanical motion -> electrical current
We have:
gas-> electrochemical reaction -> electrical current
No moving parts, no energy lost to friction and wear. Hence, almost 2x as efficient as internal combustion engines.
“So how much subsidy is required? What about hydrogen stations? Who pays for that? Who pays for the conversion costs? Who pays for the increased cost of production? Who pays for the production of significant amounts of hydrogen? Who pays to store it? Who pays to transport it?
Probably the taxpayers. Again. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.”
Yeah but it gives the enviro Nazi’s a nice warm fuzzy feeling all over so it is worth it at any price.
The most sensible solution is to co-generate hydrogen from water with the huge amount of unused electricity generated by nuclear power plants.
Per norwaypinesavage, more efficient if the hydrogen were free.
So if the fuel cell is gas> electro-chemical reaction> electrical energy, what type of gas is used to charge into the cell?
Granted, the 'easiest' is using Hydrogen gas - but that does not leverage the built-in infrastructure we already have with these other fuels.
The hyperlink above is to Wikipedia - which lists 22 types of Fuel Cells. What may be practical for a RV or truck, may not be practical for your laptop, or your cell phone. Cost, output power, size ane efficiency vary. But generally, they are all much more efficient than what we have now.
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