Posted on 08/30/2010 6:33:31 AM PDT by Jenny Hatch
Visalia, Calif. • A Mormon church official was shot dead between services on Sunday, and less than an hour later, the man suspected of the crime also died after a shootout with police.
Clay Sannar, 42, a lay bishop with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Visalia, southeast of Fresno, died after being shot in his office, said Visalia police chief Colleen Mestas.
Soon after the first shooting, a caller identified himself to police as the shooter. Police responded, and there was a confrontation with several shots exchanged, said Mestas.
The suspect was hit multiple times. He was taken to nearby Kaweah Delta Medical Center, where he was pronounced dead. He has not been identified yet. No officers were injured, Mestas said.
Tulare County sheriff’s deputies are taking over the investigation of the shootout involving the police officers. The sheriff’s department did not immediately return calls for comment.
Visalia police continue to investigate Sannar’s shooting, but have not identified a motive.
(Excerpt) Read more at sltrib.com ...
I am still waiting for Dell to help with the restore in the mean time...
AMPU are you so lonely you have to stretch things to have a conversation?
I was thinking of scab as in a sore that needs to heal but instead one keeps picking at it!
I thought you were a women what really are you SS?
They will? You mean to tell me the Lds church has a list of everybody's who's ever lived? Birth records?
C'mon, Normandy, the Lds church can't even tell you everybody who's alive on the planet now -- even 100 years from now, they won't be able to name even close to all those who lived in the year 2010 on Planet Earth.
Yet, you say proxy baptism is universal (or will be).
Have you done the math, Normandy? Let's go with a young earth math theory for the moment -- that the earth is only 6,000 years old.
#1 A few experts have concluded that if this is the case, we may have had still 30-60 billion people who have ever lived on the earth.
#2, Now, if the Earth suffers few major catastrophes over the next almost 1,000 years, how many people could the earth have by the year 3,000? (One estimate from WikiAnswers suggests 80-110 billion). http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_many_people_will_there_be_in_the_year_3000
#3 Now, toss in perhaps another 400-450 billion people who will have lived and died in the year 2000, 2100, 2200, etc. before the year 3,000 comes upon us.
My point? By the year 3,000 Mormons may have to smoke their computer genealogical war machine room to accommodate 500-600 billion plus people who lived from 4,000 B.C. to 3,000 A.D.
So give us the math breakdown, Normandy. Tell us. How many proxy baptisms will the average Mormon teen-ager have to perform in the temple over the next 13 generations (keep in mind the exact % of Mormon teens even involved in this process) to crank up the Mormon necro-baptism number to an eventual 500-600 billion?
You see, this is what happens when you let incredulity rule even basic logic. Mormons are "sold" on the "fairness" & "Justness" & "equality" argument that the door is (or eventually will be) "open" to "all."
But when you start asking them to define "all," they slouch away.
By "all," do you mean the pre-Gutenberg billions? (Uh...)
By "all," do you mean the "no records exist" for those who lived in the teen A.D. centuries? (Uh...)
By "all," do you mean the lack of worldwide temples & manpower mandated to even meet the current Lds fastfood Necro baptism machine need? (Never mind that no matter how many volunteers they grind up in their computer appetite clamoring for "More food...More food," it'll never ever catch up)
So, tell us Normandy your "math formula" for necro-baptizing the billions and billions and billions of known people ... never even mind the 30-60 billion who have already lived & whom you can't find any extant records for!
Good post, thanks~
I been reading your stuff recently and you really are wondering off into tinfoil land!
“It wasn’t until others had started their smear campaign against the ‘anti’s’ that this thread took on a life of its own “
You just lost all credibility.
It’s mind-boggling amazing eh?
This is like watching a political mudslinging. The anti-Mormons are trying to actually pretend that all of the history of their almost daily attacks doesn’t exist. Oh so innocent and picked on by the Mormons. /eyeroll
I am sticking with the term anti-Mormons. Our religion is an integral part of us. You know exactly what we mean. Playing Bill Clinton word games is merely a distraction. Yet another non-issue being flag waved and pointed at.
The killer had a long history of hating Mormons and threatening to do what he finally did. It is just so sad.
We are still in shock around here.
Isn’t it amazing, though, that the anti’s on FR just could not resist the temptation to trash our faith during this time?
And they pretend to not understand why I jumped to a conclusion about their motives. /head shake
“Mourn with those who mourn . . .” This is what true Christians are supposed to do.
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WOW look at you ...telling the Christians what we believe...
No kid we Christians are suppose to let the dead bury the dead and follow Jesus...
The LORD Jesus Christ of the Christian Bible told a man not to go and “mourn” for his father but to come with Him..
Those who don’t get the chance to hear the gospel in this life will hear it in the next world and will have the opportunity for baptism through baptisms for the dead.
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Norm how does that work ???
I’ve asked several times but never have got amn answerr...
Have any of your mormon friends ever been on a mission to the afterlife to knock on the doors there ???
Wow, finally something honest from you...
So he was still a mormon ???
I am sticking with the term anti-Mormons
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and we will stick with anti-Christians when referring to mormons...
After all Mormonism is not Christianity...
YOO HOO Els...
Got me a half
:)
I love the Scriptures:
Romans 12:14-18
“Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.
“Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.
“Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.
“Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
“If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.”
Proverbs 3:5-6
“Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
“In all thy ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct thy paths.”
Well, Bible-wise, that's good...but tell us, Sandy...when you read Isaiah, chapters 43, 44, 45, and 46, and consistent references come up saying God knows of no other gods, no other gods are beside Him, He's the only true God, etc...which of your gods therefore is this only true God...and which are the ones your God doesn't know about or recognize?
You know, before reading this, I actually just addressed this on another thread...with a poster who assumed all of us "religious folk" were "united" and some nasty FReepers were trying to "divide & conquer." So, since it addresses what you just said, I'll quote an excerpt from that post:
*********************
...let's just pretend for a moment that not a single FR poster has ever said one single thing "negative" about any Mormon belief. Would that somehow muster your fantasy that we're "united???" Really?
Have you ever read Mormon "scriptures" and what they specifically said about all Christian sects?
Do the Mormons portray a "show of unity" with the Christian church?
* Is it a "peace offering" by the Mormon church for them to cite the Book of Mormon, 1 Nephi 14:9-10, which claims that only 2 churches exist -- the church of the Lamb (the Mormon church) -- and the church of Satan (the Christian church)?
* Is it Kum-ba-yahville for Mormons to claim that every single Christian professing believer is "corrupt" (Joseph Smith used the word "all" [applying to "all" such believers]?
* Is it "Unity Central" for Mormons to claim that 100% of Christian creeds are "an abomination" to their god?
[Note: These statements weren't just from 'overpassionate' sermons given by Smith; they were claims from the original vision of Mormonism, which a later generation of Mormons decided was worth counting as 'scripture'...look it up on Google for yourselves...just put in Joseph Smith - History + "Pearl of Great Price" ... read verses 18-20]
I mean, how ludicrous...to somehow claim somebody is trying to "divide" us when you don't utter a single phrase about what Mormons have called us Christians for 180 years -- and to boot, claimed this is what "God" thinks of us!
Do you think...that Beck, a disciple of Joseph Smith, is "honoring" the Christian church when Beck believes what Smith said in Doctrines & Covenant 1:30 -- that the Mormon church "is the ONLY true and living church on the face of the earth"???
How is that "unifying" for two-faced Mormons to say wonderful things to our face, and then turn the other way, pull out their wallets, and pay for these above comments to published as written slander in over 100 languages spread around the world?
...and disseminated online 24/7?
...and by person-to-person (52,000 Lds missionaries & Lds teachers using curricula as ALL of them call ALL Christians "apostates")?
So when Muslims call all Christians "infidels," we're just supposed to say, "Why, how flattering! You know our loving Mormon brothers and sisters say the same thing of us only they use the 'loving' byword of 'apostates.' Isn't that just precious? Come. Let's all join in the Kum-ba-yah refrain, lest those nasty FReepers come & try to 'divide & conquer us.'"
Which doctrine to believe. BOM states very clearly otherwise
ALMA 34:32: “For behold, this life is the time for men to prepare to meet God; yea, behold the day of this life is the day for men to perform their labors.”
Is the god of mormonism having trouble making up his mind? Could be problems with all the wives and their input.
I love the Scriptures:
____________________________________
Big WHOOP
The devil loves the scriptures...
The ones in the Bible that is...
He just doesnt like them when theyre used against him...
He plays chicken with the Bible until he meets up with a man or woman full of the power of God who knows how to speak in the Name of Jesus and get rid of him...
other than that ...the devil loves to go to church...
GO TO CHURCH NANA ???
Oh noez...
Oh yes...
now on the other hand...
The words in Joey Smith’s book of mormon amuses the devil but bores him...
Theres nothing in there for him to get excited about...
None of the words in the bom have any power against the devil...
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