JAMES TARANTO: It's certifiable: the last word on Obama's place of birth

The Wall Street Journal ^ | July 30, 2009 | JAMES TARANTO

[curiosity]

Several readers have written over the past few days taking us to task for dismissing so-called birthers as lunatics without bothering to refute their claims. We reluctantly concede their point. The birthers have managed to sow confusion in the minds of some who are not lunatics, and for the latter group’s benefit it is worth clarifying matters.

[Star Traveler]

Not at all..., because the judgment of God, with people, is carried out in a final judgment at the Great White Throne Judgment and the Judgment Seat of Christ (for two different classes of people). Those judgments happen after a person has died. And there is no cycle of life repeating in which a long string and sequence of Karma events happen

There’s about the same amount of connection between what the Bible says and what Karma is about — in the same way that I can say that you think the same as Obama, because you both eat and sleep and walk on two legs... LOL..

---

Karma

Karma (Sanskrit: kárma, kárman- “act, action, performance”[1]; Pali: kamma) is the concept of “action” or “deed” in Indian religions understood as that which causes the entire cycle of cause and effect (i.e., the cycle called samsara) originating in ancient India and treated in Hindu, Jain, Sikh and Buddhist philosophies.[2].

In these systems, the effects of all deeds are viewed as actively shaping past, present, and future experiences. The results or ‘fruits’ of actions are called karma-phala.[3]

Origins

A concept of karma (along with reincarnation, samsara, and moksha) may originate in the shramana tradition of which Buddhism and Jainism are continuations. This tradition influenced the Brahmanic religion in the early Vedantic (Upanishadic) movement of the 1st millennium BC. Reincarnation was adopted from this religious culture by Brahmin orthodoxy, and Brahmins wrote the earliest recorded scriptures containing these ideas in the early Upanishads.

---

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma

—

This bears not the *least* relation to the Bible and what God says. The origins have no relation to the Bible. It’s only the *most uninformed* in the world, who could ever think that anything related to Karma ever came from anything in the Bible.

[editor-surveyor]

Now you’ve joined startrek in making smoke!

Slaves, illegitimate marriages? - None of that helps O; his family in Africa were slavers though!

[editor-surveyor]

So now you’re a wikipedophile?

Wiki is a non-authority. Its 90% subjective opinion.

[curiosity]

Campaign expenditure reports (required by law) say he has spent well over $900,000 on this issue.

No they don't.

[Star Traveler]

You said — All things do not balance out during our lives. Some things do and some get balanced out after we die. It is ongoing and eternal

—

Now I know you’re into Karma for sure... LOL...

And no.., this has absolutely nothing to do with the Bible, or the God of Abaraham, Isaac and Jacob and anything that is taught from the doctrines of Christianity.

It’s *not ongoing*, either, as the Bible says it’s *final* in terms of judgment and that happens in two instances (Great White Throne Judgment and the Judgment Seat of Christ). After those two — there is *no more judgment* and nothing further to atone for or to ever judge again. All judgments are done and over with at that point of time and all associated with “judgment” is “over with” too in that all death and sin is dispensed with in the lake of fire.

That means, no cycle exists, no more atoning for sin, no more sin exists, no more death as a result of sin, and no such thing as an ongoing balance to be considered [doesn’t exist in the first place...]. That’s what the Bible says.

Now, if you want to teach Karma on its own, that’s another matter. Feel free to teach all the Karma you want, but I won’t be going into the “Karma” in regards to the “birth certificate issue”...

[Star Traveler]

Feel free to present your information source on Karma, and post whatever relevant quotes you want...

[editor-surveyor]

Love yopur replies:
“Nyah, Nyah, Nyah, Nyah, Nyah, Nyah!”

[curiosity]

A birth computer printout like the one already shown could have been obtained just by filling out a form after the birth had taken place elsewhere.

That is simply not true.

[curiosity]

You made an assertion that is not true. What else am I supposed to do, except say it is not true?

When you make an assertion, the burden is on you to back it up with evidence. The burden is not on me to disprove it.

[editor-surveyor]

You’re racking up quite an account here! (you might even beat O)

[editor-surveyor]

There you go again:

“Nyah, Nyah, Nyah, Nyah, Nyah, Nyah!”

[Star Traveler]

Okay, in that scenario, it’s possible, but I don’t think it’s probable that it was a pre-conceived plan to do that. My suspicion is that there is something on the birth certificate that is embarrassing and he did not want it shown (something like a possible [only a guess on my part...] “Father Unknown”).

And that would have thrown the election into some chaos to have it revealed, and might have swung a few voters the other way. And so, not wanting something that was personal to get out, and not wanting negative information to sway voters, he opted to keep it quiet.

BUT, after he saw that this issue was convenient for “marginalizing” some conservatives, Obama and his advisors now want to “use the issue” to their benefit. So, if there is some sort of “plan” I would guess for a plan that they “stumbled into” — compliments of those who have been “rabid” about the issue... :-)

[curiosity]

Campaign funds expenditure reports are not "thin air."

There is nothing in the expenditure reports on birther lawsuits.

[Star Traveler]

But, I would still be interested in your “Karma” quotes and sources that you go by, which explain it for you...

[editor-surveyor]

they’re not available in Liberal Braille.

[curiosity]

Were there any validity to that, the clause would not be in the constitution. The fact that the framers had to give themselves a special elligibility in the document fully disproves the contention you posted.

The framers had to give themselves a special eligibility because they were not citizens of the United States at birth. They could not have been since they were born before the United States existed!

Duh.

Knocking down birther arguments is like shooting fish in a barrel.

Vattel definately was their intent!

Right. They treated the tome of some obscure Swiss philosopher as if it were the Bible./sarcasm

[Kells]

A birth computer printout like the one already shown could have been obtained just by filling out a form after the birth had taken place elsewhere.

That is simply not true.

Oh yes it is:

http://www.westernjournalism.com/?page_id=2697

[curiosity]

Sorry, but nothing in that links proves your assertion.

[Kells]

There is already a body trail for the Obama ID mystery:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/apr/19/key-witness-in-passport-fraud-case-fatally-shot

[Star Traveler]

Here’s a Biblical Ministry source for the question about Karma, and in relation to the Bible...
http://www.gotquestions.org/karma.html

---

Question: “What does the Bible say about karma?”

Answer: Karma is a theological concept found in the Buddhist and Hindu religions. It is the idea that how you live your life will determine the quality of life you will have after reincarnation. If you are unselfish, kind, and holy during this lifetime, you will be rewarded by being reincarnated (reborn into a new earthly body) into a pleasant life. However, if you live a life of selfishness and evil, you will be reincarnated into a less-than-pleasant lifestyle. In other words, you reap in the next life what you sow in this one. Karma is based on the theological belief in reincarnation. The Bible rejects the idea of reincarnation; therefore, it does not support the idea of karma.

Hebrews 9:27 states, “Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment…” This Bible verse makes clear two important points which, for Christians, negate the possibility of reincarnation and karma. First, it states that we are “destined to die once,” meaning that humans are only born once and only die once. There is no endless cycle of life and death and rebirth, an idea inherent in the reincarnation theory. Second, it states that after death we face judgment, meaning that there is no second chance, like there is in reincarnation and karma, to live a better life. You get one shot at life and living it according to God’s plan, and that is it.

The Bible talks a lot about reaping and sowing. Job 4:8 says, “As I have observed, those who plow evil and those who sow trouble reap it.” Psalm 126:5 says, “Those who sow in tears will reap with songs of joy.” Luke 12:24 says, “Consider the ravens: They do not sow or reap, they have no storeroom or barn; yet God feeds them. And how much more valuable you are than birds!” In each of these instances, as well as all the other references to reaping and sowing, the act of receiving the rewards of your actions takes place in this life, not in some future life. It is a present-day activity, and the references make it clear that the fruit you reap will be commensurate with the actions you have performed. In addition, the sowing you perform in this life will affect your reward or punishment in the afterlife.

This afterlife is not a rebirth or a reincarnation into another body here on earth. It is either eternal suffering in hell (Matthew 25:46) or eternal life in heaven with Jesus, who died so that we might live eternally with Him. This should be the focus of our life on earth. The apostle Paul wrote in Galatians 6:8-9, “The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.”

Finally, we must always remember that it was Jesus whose death on the cross resulted in the reaping of eternal life for us, and that it is faith in Jesus that gives us this eternal life. Ephesians 2:8-9 tells us, “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast.” Therefore, we see that the concept of reincarnation and karma is incompatible with what the Bible teaches about life, death, and the sowing and reaping of eternal life.

---

And here is their Statement of Faith to verify their Biblical position and doctrines.

Statement of Faith
http://www.gotquestions.org/faith.html

About GotQuestions.org
http://www.gotquestions.org/about.html

Mission Statement of Got Questions Ministries:

“Got Questions Ministries seeks to glorify the Lord Jesus Christ by providing biblical, applicable, and timely answers to spiritually-related questions through an internet presence.”

GotQuestions.org is a volunteer ministry of dedicated and trained servants who have a desire to assist others in their understanding of God, Scripture, salvation, and other spiritual topics. We are Christian, Protestant, conservative, evangelical, fundamental, and non-denominational. We view ourselves as a para-church ministry, coming alongside the church to help people find answers to their spiritually related questions.

—

There are *ample* other Christian ministry articles about Karma and how it does not relate at all to the Bible. I can get several other well-known and very credible information sources, in the Christian world, which won’t at all be related to anything from Wikipedia, if that’s what you want...