(Obama) Born in the U.S.A. (says National Review)

National Review ^ | July 28, 2009 | The Editors

[panthermom]

Here is another doosey for you. You can go to the State Dept. website for verification.

While a parent cannot renounce a minor’s citizenship per say, once the minor is 18, he has 6 months from his birthday to reclaim his full citizenship. If Obama, after the age of 18, traveled or used his Indonesian citizenship for a passport or to obtain scholarships and financial aid as a foreigner, then if you ask me he’s toast.

[combat_boots]

“Instead he lets an officer not go on deployment.”

And gets the guy fired.

[1951Boomer]

“Why did he issue an executive order his first day in office sealing all his records, college, birth, everything! You brown nose clowns over there aren’t curious about any of this?”

I agree. I’m even MORE interested in the lockdown on all documents and paper trail than I am on the BC at this point. You’d think this guy would be PROUD of his glowing past that the SRM keeps telling us about.

[rock_lobsta]

Either way, he’s no American.

[HighlyOpinionated]

Okay, fine, then show us the long form birth certificate. Show us his college transcripts. Show us his 1981 Passport.

If what you "say" is true, then . . . prove it with hard copy. Is that so much to ask?

Mark Twain:
If you don't read the newspaper, you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper, you are misinformed.
Paraphrased: If you don't read news from your computer, you are uninformed; if you do, you're misinformed.
In religion and politics people's beliefs and convictions are in almost every case gotten at second-hand, and without examination, from authorities who have not themselves examined the questions at issue but have taken them at second-hand from other non-examiners, whose opinions about them were not worth a brass farthing. Autobiography, 1959

Thomas Jefferson:
Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong.
The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus by the Supreme Being in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.

[bgill]

If that is done, Obama will have to prove to all the states that he is a natural born citizen before the 2012 election.

Please explain how some proposed state bill that may or may not ever become law before or after 2012 has any significance on the 2008 election and current presidency? That, my FRiend, is smoke and mirrors and a major distraction. Better yet, how about we just abide by the laws already on the books, i.e. the Constitution of the United States?

[SeattleBruce]

Tell that to all the military families of today and to everyone for the past 200 years who has fought for the consitutuion and to keep America free. Sure, let's just ignore this little part of the consitution. Heck, let's just ignore the entire constitution since it seems to be causing such an uncomfortable situtation for you.
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Exactly. How will we deal with this Constitutional provision in the future? Candidates for POTUS should be immediately required to show a valid Birth Certificate (in my mind that the Long Form for the state of Hawaii in particular, because of their weird laws) and other records, as you would have to for any responsible job in the land.

Those of you who think this is a kook issue, disregard the Constitution. That is reason enough to pursue it, at least persistently (not obsessively.)

[dools007]

What else in the Constitution do you not care about?

[Houghton M.]

“The one that I recently got from Tennessee, to apply for social security, is a copy of my original CERTIFICATE, photocopied onto a CERTIFICATION form”

Then you have a photocopy of the certificate which certifies, provides certification.

All certificates certify, are certifications.

The bureaucrats that invented a distinction between “certificate” and “certification” are illiterate.

If a certain piece of paper is a copy of an original certificate, call it that: a “copy of the certificate.” (I’m speaking to the bureaucrats here, not to you.)

If it does not certify because it is a copy, say so, but then don’t call it a certification.

There is absolutely no linguistic difference between certificate and certification.

That bureaucrats have invented such a distinction is not surprising. It contributes to the confusion.

No genuine certificate that does not certify (that does not provide certification) is imaginable. No certification that does not involve some kind of certificate is imaginable.

Now, “certificates” or “certification-providing documents” are usually hard copy, paper (but formerly were on vellum and today can be “virtualized” in digital form, capable of transfer to paper).

“Document” for most people means a hard copy on paper. But the word itself merely means “something that shows proof.” (My guess, without looking it up, is that document ultimately has Greek roots and certificate only Latin roots but both are used in Latin and mean roughly the same thing.)

So bureacrats, stuck on the idea that “certificate” and “document” mean paper, invent the idea that “certification” is different from “certificate”—sort of like certification is the act of certifying (which merely means “making certain, putting doubts to rest”). But how does one go about certifying? By issuing certificates. The photocopy of an original certificate is also a certificate. How much legal authority (how much “certificatory power” or how much “certificationnness”) it possesses may vary depending on circumstances.

I don’t doubt that bureaucrats make these distinctions, but they would help themselves a lot if they just added modifiers to “certificate” (”copy of the original certificate” “legally valid copy of the original certificate” or “non-legally valid copy . . . “ or “secondary certificate” or “derived certification”) or used an entirely different word to show that the copy is not of equal certificational value to the original, if indeed it is not. But some copies of some documents are of equal documentary value as the original, that is, they are equal certifications, equally certificates, certify certificationally equally.

[1951Boomer]

Yes, the desire to apply the “kook” label is the only reason the MSM would touch this topic. However, I have to wonder if Dems and even MSM secretly wonder and even skulk onto the Internet when no one’s looking. Oh, they’d never admit it, but people HAVE to be scratching their heads and at least wondering, “Wow, could there by some validity to this lockdown of our messiah’s past?”

[steve0]

Great quotes. Anyway let the court decide. Alan has standing, just let him have his discovery and let a jury decide. BTW many liberals claimed McCain wasn’t and still isn’t eligible to be president. We have his long form birth certificate.

[woops]

http://www.westernjournalism.com/?page_id=2697

You MUST read this document to understand the issues! It outlines the 4 ways to get a birth certificate in hawaii. And it indicates to me it is ridiculously easy to falsely get one in one way or another.

The above document MUST go viral.

I was directed to this document by http://rovingpatrol.wordpress.com.

It was written by a retired CIA agent in December ‘08 and revised in July 21, ‘09. The conclusion: He must show his original birth certificate to understand what any of the current hawaiin documents mean.

Read ALL the above, and from it i quote:

But whether it is called (as it was last year) a Certification or (as it is now) a Certificate of Live Birth this abbreviated document provides none of the probative information that was or wasn’t on Barack Obama’s original Certificate of Live Birth. Unlike the Certificate of Live Birth of the time when Barack Obama was born, this new Certificate of Live Birth provides no real evidence of where a child was born or indication of where such evidence might be found. It provides no information that would demonstrate to the people of the United States whether there is convincing evidence that he was actually born here or whether a relative or two (OR POSSIBLY EVEN BARACK OBAMA HIMSELF) just made a statement to that effect to a low level bureaucrat. (As is permitted under Section 57-40 of the Territorial Public Health Statistics Act in the 1955 Revised Laws of Hawaii.)

Just as an aside, Hawaii recently announced “Barrack Obama” is a natural born citizen, etc. Read the name again. Is it lawyerish hedging, or just an error??? “Barrack” does not equal “Barack”

No, No, you CANNOT simply dismiss obama’s eligibility question as this national review article is trying to do. To much doesn’t jive. Way, way to much. If it did, the orginal birth certificate would have been presented. There would be no testimony he was born in Kenya, his sister would agree to the one hospital he was born in, etc. This is the most unknown, checkered past president we have ever had and we are getting SHIT for an answer from him. We shouldn’t have to go to hawaii and talk with them about this or get their carefully crafted press releases. the president alone should answer to the people!

[Smokeyblue]

“I’m even MORE interested in the lockdown on all documents and paper trail than I am on the BC at this point. You’d think this guy would be PROUD of his glowing past that the SRM keeps telling us about.”

Yep! And I want to know a whole lot more about the passport break-in that happened during the election. His people were trying to “cauterize” his records.

THESE WERE HIS PEOPLE WHO BROKE-IN!!! WHY?????

[CAluvdubya]

If one applies for a United States passport, the passport office will demand a birth certificate. It defines this as an official document bearing “your full name, the full name of your parent(s), date and place of birth, sex, date the birth record was filed, and the seal or other certification of the official custodian of such records.”

This is simply not true. My niece just received a passport in Seattle with her COLB. She was born in Indonesia when my sister and BIL were there for 18 months for his job.

Her COBL does not list any parents at all. We didn't think she'd be able to get a passport using this document but it was no problem....just sayin'

And riddle me this...no one yet has come up with an answer to the question, Why is Obama spending soooo much money on lawyers to stop people from asking questions and why rescend orders for the Major called to active duty then get him fired from his full time job instead of producing a document?

Things that make you go hmmmm....

[DJ MacWoW]

Excuse me? Maybe you should read my post again.

[NewEnglander]

See Post Number 39 for a copy of a real State of Hawaii “Certificate of Live Birth” produced in Feb 1962. Be sure to look at all of the data fields/boxes. This document was signed and State embossed sealed by the then Director of Health for the State of Hawaii.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2147794/posts

[andy58-in-nh]

According to the best evidence we have, the guy was born in Hawaii. A lack of perfect "proof" for a proposition does not prove its opposite. But here is the most important thing and you need to accept it: the American people have already made the issue moot - dwelling on the matter will not change the outcome, no matter how much we may wish it were so.

The Constitution is far more threatened by Obama's policies than by the vague circumstances of his life and birth. That is where we must expend our energies, rather than on chasing after elusive documentation that the Left and their news media accomplices are using to distract us and make us look foolish.

[SeattleBruce]

I read this and that the birth was listed in two newspapers
seems to end the argument.
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What? Hawaii allowed a COLB to be issued under broad circumstances.
http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscurrent/vol06_ch0321-0344/HRS0338/HRS_0338-0017_0008.HTM

The newspaper announcements:
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=83851
“Baro’s investigators were unable to locate any current or past resident of Kalanianaole Highway who could recall Obama or his family living at the address listed in the Sunday Advertiser announcement.

Baro also sent investigators to the newspaper offices to examine files, but the Advertiser could not confirm who actually placed the ad.”

Easily, the grandparents could have issued the birth announcements (they happened 9 days after the reported birth date). Once the COLB was achieved, the birth announcements could easily have followed.

Why? The benefits of US citizenship. This is not rocket science, and it wouldn’t have taken some silly foresight into the knowledge that ‘someday little Barack will run for POTUS.’

Nope, they just wanted him to the have the advantages of US citizenship - like millions of other people would love to have...

[bgill]

All the birthers want is a copy of the hospital issued form that list the hospital and signed by the mother and doctor. THAT, and that only would be proof.

I'm way past the cute baby footprint and the little blue ribboned seal and the doctor's signature. He and his minions have already proven they are not above forging documents. He's already admitted his father was Kenyan, so that in itself throws out any eligibility. No, I want a heck of a lot more proof of who he really is and who he's played himself off to be.

[webschooner]

Conservatives are intelligent enough to multi-task