Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


1 posted on 06/04/2009 3:40:53 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies ]


To: Tailgunner Joe

I love how he has to reach all the way back to the Inquisition to find an example of Muslims being tolerant.


2 posted on 06/04/2009 3:49:32 PM PDT by Julia H. (Remember when dissent was patriotic?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe

The author may be unaware there was a Papal Inquisition that preceded the Spanish Inquisition by several hundred years.

It was established in the 1230s, about the time Cordoba was reconquered. It had absolutely nothing to do with the Jews, as it was aimed exclusively at Christian heretics such as the Cathars.

The writer of Obama’s speech probably thinks of all “medieval” events as happening roughly simultaneously. He therefore lumps the golden age of Cordoba, which ended well before 1100, in with the Papal Inquisition, starting in the 1230s and the Spanish Inquisition, starting in the 1470s.


3 posted on 06/04/2009 3:55:03 PM PDT by Sherman Logan (Perception wins all the battles, reality wins all the wars)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe

May be a reflection of his education as a child growing up in Indonesia?


4 posted on 06/04/2009 3:55:53 PM PDT by sonofagun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe
If GWB ever mangled and confused history as much as this little twerp, we would never have heard the end of it.

More garbled, anti-Christian blather for his Moslem audience. Just like his anti-American blather for his tour of Europe. And his anti-business blather for his tour of NBC. His speech writers must get high before they start work. Everything he says has the air of an improvised, tall story told by a seven-year-old—even though these are all prepared, scripted speeches.

5 posted on 06/04/2009 3:56:31 PM PDT by SamuraiScot
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe

Maybe Barry borrowed back LAWRENCE OF ARABIA from the boxed set of videos he gave Gordon Brown and dug the part where Alec Guiness lectures Peter O’Toole about “the lost street lamps of Cordoba.”

Or maybe he was just channeling Ricardo Montalban.


7 posted on 06/04/2009 4:06:46 PM PDT by Argus (We've gone downtown to Clown Town, and that's where we'll be living from now on..)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe

It sounds like a teleprompter hiccup. I think an ingenious prankster could get some incredible things out of Zero’s mouth if he got his hands on the wordfeed.


8 posted on 06/04/2009 4:07:26 PM PDT by eclecticEel (The Most High rules in the kingdom of men ... and sets over it the basest of men.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe
Is this the tolerance Zero is talking about?

First a little history of why the muslims conquered Spain:

By 710AD, Jews and Christians had been in the Iberian peninsula for a few hundred years and the Visigoth king Rodrigo ruled from the capital Toledo.

Emir Musa ruled North Africa from Kairouan in Tunisia. He saw that Spain was ripe for plunder with great financial wealth, and beautiful girls aplenty for the Harems in Kairouan and Damascus. Musa then received permission from the Caliph Walid who ruled from Damascus, and then chose Tariq, a Berber, who was a former Algerian slave, but now a fierce warrior and a recent convert to Islam, to lead his army. They sent a small force of a few hundred men on a raid, and when they returned loaded with riches and pretty girls, Musa was much impressed. So the invasion of Al-Andalus (valley of Vandals) was not so much about converting the infidel to Islam, but the focus was on booty, women and slaves to be delivered back to Damascus.

The first major battle was against the Visigoth king Rodrigo, and took place near the river Rio Barbate, which is in the Xeres district, now famous for its sherry.

Rodrigo and his army was no match for the fierce Berbers and were easily defeated, with casualties in the tens of thousands. Rodrigo himself is believed to have drowned in the river attempting to escape. His horse, robes and diadem were found on the river bank.

On the way Cordoba was captured, and Toledo was easily taken. The booty was fabulous and included a gold and emerald table from the Temple of Solomon.

Musa returned to Damascus with tons of booty, Visigoth dignitaries as prisoners and 3,000 Spanish virgins.

From 756AD to 1031AD, there was a series of Islamic leaders of Cordoba (Umayyads of Cordoba). Some of their highlights include:

Hisham I (788-796) called for Holy War against Asturias and France, and assembled 100,000 warriors from even Syria, Arabia and Algeria, and attacked Narbonne and Carcassone and won enough booty to fund a new mosque in Cordoba.

Al-Hakam (796-822) became known for the “Day of the Ditch” where he beheaded 5,000 converts to Islam in Toledo on suspicion of treachery.

Almanzor (967-1002) He beheaded 4,000 Christians after taking Zamora. He won the battle near Simancus and again beheaded about 4,000 Christians. Almanzor also razed the Christian shrine city of Santiago de Compostela which was to the Christians like the Kaaba was to the Muslims.

Conversion to Islam was encouraged by the Ummayad caliphs and Emirs of Córdoba. Many Christians converted to Islam to avoid the Jizya tax which they were subjected to as Dhimmis. Apostasy, however, for one who had been raised as a Muslim or had embraced Islam, was a crime punishable by death.

From the point of view of the Muslim rulers, jizya was a material proof of the non-Muslims' acceptance of subjection to the state and its laws. Non-Muslims were also not allowed to build any new places of worship.

In Al-Andalus, the large numbers of Christians adopting Islam to escape the Jizya tax and treatment of Dhimmitude prompted concern among the authorities about the weakening of the tax base and further inflamed resentment towards the Muwallads.

The Muwallads were in almost constant revolts against the Arab and Berber immigrants who had carved out large estates for themselves, farmed by Christian serfs or slaves.

The Berbers, who held strictly to Islamic teachings, terrorised and looted Cordoba until the city fell and the Umayyad dynasty came to an end in 1031AD.

When Toledo was recaptured in 1085AD, and Seville had become the centre of Moorish culture, they sought help from North Africa. However the Almoravids were horrified when they entered Seville and noticed Jews and Christians trading freely in the markets, selling musical instruments and wine. A Fatwa was obtained and the Almoravids gained control of all Muslim lands and even taking back Valencia from the Christians.

This was followed by the even stricter Almohads who in turn fought and defeated the Almoravids in bloody Jihad.

But the Reconquista proved unstoppable and soon only the southern Taifa of Granada was left in Muslim hands.

Eventually Ferdinand and Isabella forced Mohammed XII (Boabdil) to surrender and he even gave them the keys to the palace before fleeing to Fez in Africa. Islam no longer controlled any part of Spain.

Was there a Golden Age of tolerance that Obama is talking about?

What can be concluded is that under the Umayyads of Abdul Rahman III, civilization flourished for only about 100 years because true Islam was not practised, and indeed :

■Jews and Christians Dhimmitude was not as severe, and they mixed with Muslim scholars ■Literature, Medicine, Science and Astronomy advanced ■Poetry and Music flourished (not banned) ■ Wine was drunk for pleasure (not banned) Indeed, it could be said that:

“the Golden Age happened in spite of Islam, NOT because of Islam”.

When Cordoba was sacked, the scholars moved base to Toledo after 1085AD where science and literature flourished under Christian rule, NOT Islam. Scholars came from Europe to embrace new ideas then spread this throughout Europe.

12 posted on 06/04/2009 5:01:39 PM PDT by Proud_USA_Republican
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe
But why Cordoba? What happened there?

They invented rich, Corinthian leather?

14 posted on 06/05/2009 9:14:58 AM PDT by dfwgator (USM is Gator Bait! (Congrats to U-Dub!))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe

Every school kid in Spain knows this sentence makes no sense. Almoravids were the most fanatic sect in Islam. In the year 1212, they gathered an army of 300,000 soldiers to convert Europe by force, but they were repelled by a Christian army of 50,000 at the Battle of Navas de Tolosa (Spain). That was the largest battle in Europe until D-Day.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8uVevYY88M

Another little point that Mr. Obama seems to forget, is that Muslims were big in the black slaves trade. In fact, at the above referred battle Caliph Al-Nasir chained thousands of black slaves around his tent to fight for him till their death.

Call that tolerance, Mr. Obama? I call it ignorance, if not worse.


15 posted on 06/05/2009 9:52:41 AM PDT by trecedelemos (Tolerant Al-Andalus???)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Tailgunner Joe

Is this Obama’s way of bashing the Christian faith/RC Church and Christians/Catholics?


21 posted on 06/08/2009 3:50:26 AM PDT by Biggirl ("Live Long And Prosper!"-Mr. Spock:)=^..^==^..^==^..^==^..^=)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: All

Note: Video clip included here:

http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/2472.htm

#

http://www.memri.org/report/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/4365.htm

June 11, 2010
Special Dispatch No.3027

“Egyptian Clerics Reminisce about the Victories of Early Islam and Lament the Loss of Andalusia”

SNIPPET: “The following excerpts are from an interview with Egyptian cleric Hamdan Badr of the International Union of Muslim Scholars, which aired on Al-Shabab TV on December 8, 2009.”


22 posted on 06/12/2010 7:06:25 PM PDT by Cindy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson