Posted on 03/13/2009 11:57:12 AM PDT by AJ in NYC
Rep. Bill Posey, a freshman Republican from Florida, introduced a bill yesterday mirroring proposed state legislation in Missouri and elsewhere that stems from fringe doubts about Obama's eligibility for office.
The full bill text isn't yet available, and Posey's spokesman didn't immediately respond to a request for comment, but here's a summary:
H.R. 1503. A bill to amend the Federal Election Campaign Act of 1971 to require the principal campaign committee of a candidate for election to the office of President to include with the committee's statement of organization a copy of the candidate's birth certificate, together with such other documentation as may be necessary to establish that the candidate meets the qualifications for eligibility to the Office of President under the Constitution; to the Committee on House Administration.
Though Posey's spokesman wasn't available, a Feb. 13 letter from Posey to a constituent on the subject appears on a website pushing the story in which Posey noted that courts and Hawaii officials had rejected the claims, but didn't state his own view on the subject.
(Excerpt) Read more at politico.com ...
Conflating seems to be the Axelrod talking point of the day. You have made an assertion which you cannot prove/substantiate beyond your opinion and I cannot refute beyond my opinion. THAT is why we used to have a functioning supreme court, to clarify such ridiculous disagreements over what the founders intended and what they used as their definitions of words and phrases.
Actually, I agree that McCain is a Natural Born Citizen, but for a different reason:
At the time of McCain’s birth, McCain WAS born a U.S. Citizen.
Congress can NOT make “natural born citizen” status “retroactive” -— However Congress CAN make citizenship, SIMPLE citizenship, retroactive.
McCain’s parents, at the time of McCain’s birth, had qualified, by age and residency, to pass full Citizenship to John McCain, at birth.
To be a “Natural Born Citizen” you must show that the law in place, at the time of your birth, made you a citizen, from the moment of birth. It is just that simple.
McCain never had to get “naturalized” -— McCain never needed any court or administrative judge or other government authority to “grant” John McCain his citizenship.
John McCain was a complete, total, NATURAL BORN CITIZEN from the moment of birth!
Congress has the power to determine citizenship. The Constitution simply makes it more difficult, in that, under the Constitution, “Natural Born Citizenship” is required for POTUS.
Under BOTH the Constitution and Congressional, approved Legislation, McCain met all of the requirements for POTUS.
McCain was NEVER “naturalized”.
McCain was a Citizen from the moment of birth.
Therefore, McCain is a Natural Born Citizen.
McRoach was born in the City of Colon, Republic of Panama, and not in the Canal Zone much less a military installation.
Colon is a Panamanian civilian city within the country of the Republic of Panama.
Websters Dictionary and a class in logic is all that is required.
You are either Naturalized or Natural Born.
If you are recognized as a US Citizen, and there is no question of that point, and you were a US Citizen from the moment of birth, you are a NATURAL BORN CITIZEN!
It’s retro-active right? If not, why not. If it seems like a good idea, why not satisfy the people with the last election?
McRoach was born in the City of Colon, Republic of Panama, and not in the Canal Zone much less a military installation.
Colon is a Panamanian civilian city within the country of the Republic of Panama.
McCain could have been born on the MOON, McCain would STILL be a Natural Born Citizen.
His parents met the requirements to pass citizenship to John McCain, at birth.
“Are you seriously suggesting that it was the intention of the Founding Fathers to exclude from the Presidency the children of those who were overseas defending America?”
Don’t think like a person living in 2008. Think like someone living at the time of the Revolution.
The founders were downright paranoid about someone with foriegn ties becomming president. They wanted someone with 100% American ties. If you put yourself in their place at the time, it makes sense.
The country was young and vunerable. Despite the fact we had won the Revolution, there was still strong support in the country for remaining part of the British empire. They were PARANOID about the idea that someone with British loyalties could become president and lead us back into the British empire.
John McCain was not born on a military base.
That said, if your parents were US citizens; your father fought for my freedom; you fought for my freedom; and you spent five years of your life being tortured as a POW in an enemy prison camp ... you’ve proved your loyalty to America and should be able to serve as POTUS.
Anyone ever think that we’d be better off if he (McCain) HADN’T qualified for POTUS?
____________
HELL YES!
You’re not the Supreme Court.
I just want to smack that little brat in the face every time I see that pic.
It does not matter.
McCain’s parents met all of the qualifications to pass along citizenship, to McCain, at birth.
Geography makes absolutely NO difference, where John McCain is concerned.
Again,
Yes, McCain is a Natural Born Citizen,
However, to be “Natural Born” you must be a Citizen from the moment of birth.
Congress can not do that “retroactively” -— you must look to the law that was in effect, at the moment of birth.
When did this happen? This is the first I've heard of it. Where is this law?
No, I am not the Supreme Court.
However, I am correct in everything I have said, in this thread.
You will be hard pressed to find a single Constitutional Scholar who would disagree with me.
I have posted the State Department Pass Port Instructions, on this thread. Those instructions clearly show that the date of birth matters, if born outside the United States.
Natural Born Citizen means that you MET the Citizenship requirements, at the moment of birth.
In truth, I think about the only way this can, or will ever be addressed, is with the creation of a federal “candidate identification” law.
In essence, I suspect that the SCOTUS is rejecting challenges to Obama’s status for a very simple, and embarrassing, reason.
The Constitution of the United States is a framework for law, it is not itself “law”.
This is a pretty extraordinary thing to say, until you think about it. The US constitution establishes how government is ordered, it says very little about what is to be done if the rules are broken.
For example, when the 18th Amendment, alcohol prohibition, was passed, nothing happened. This is because congress *then* had to create federal law that “enabled” that Amendment to be enforced. Only when that had happened did prohibition actually begin.
And the congress, from the days of the founding fathers, never got around to creating enabling legislation to require the verification of a presidential candidates qualifications.
So in other words, though it says so clearly in the US constitution, *nobody* currently has the authority or responsibility to determine candidate credentials. Nobody in the government, not the president, the congress, or the courts, is authorized to do this.
Obama becomes president because of a loophole. A lack of federal law.
However, while this is frustrating, it is also very, very important that this law be carefully crafted. The implications are enormous.
To start with, this law could determine if Obama is permitted to stand for re-election. But it reaches beyond that.
“No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.”
A federal enabling law must then take into account that “*someone*” has the authority and is responsible to:
1) Determine a candidate is a natural born citizen, and what “natural born” means. What records are valid to assert this, and since they are preserved by the individual States, who is authorized access to those records. This “someone” must be able to get those records even if the State government does not wish to provide them.
2) Determine that a candidate is at least 35 years old. This requires a medical determination and a sworn statement from a physician.
3) Has been a 14-year resident of the United States. Does this mean the *last* 14 years, *consecutive* 14 years, *concurrent* 14 years? Again written into the federal law. (Actually, this one makes sense, since a lot of our candidates are likely “military brats”.)
Until this is put into federal law, the US has a constitutional dilemma.
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