Ancient Bones Found At UCSD

Sign On San Diego ^ | 1-27-2008 | Tanya Sierra

[Coyoteman]

Here is the issue the article does not mention. Kennewick man was not native american genetically. White most likely, possibly japanese.

Last I heard the DNA had not been sequenced (but look at that gorgeous unworn lower 3rd molar!).

The "European" was Chatters' initial estimate based on the cranial shape. Further study showed that was not the case.

But if by Japanese you mean "Ainu" then that would make a lot of sense.

But I am still waiting for the DNA study. That should tell us a lot!

[Myrddin]

My wife is 1/4 Cherokee. Her paternal grandmother was named Mary Jane Pheasant. She was orphaned in the Trail of Tears. We live in Idaho next to the Shoshone/Bannock reservation. My wife has just returned to college to finish her degree. She's considering taking a couple semesters of Shoshone language as a minor to her communications degree. There's plenty of locals available to strike up a conversation. My wife has no interest in any "leverage" that her heritage might offer.

[Myrddin]

A good DNA study would be very enlightening. The cranial metrics are just a start in the right direction. Even DNA isn't totally definitive. The effects of epigenetics in the final working genome are shaped between conception and birth. Ratios of femur/tibia, leg length/torso length, comparative lengths of index/ring fingers, symmetry of legs and fingers, finger prints and jaw angle can all be impacted.

[Walkingfeather]

Okay that’s one we can count out....

next?

[SunkenCiv]

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[Beowulf9]

Lol!

[norton]

"The remains, which a UC consultant says have been dated between 9,590 and 9,920 years old, make them .. just about certain to be totally unlike any current or historic tribes vaguely near the area, their cousins, or puppy dogs...The Kumeyaay don't care how old the remains are. They simply want to put... the evidence of their race scam ...to rest." [A very deep, very silent, rest.]

Better.

PS: If you live in Kalifornia, as these self proclaimed 'tribes' do, they also want to hugely increase the number of slot machines and extension of non-state & non-federal laws that they're authorized by the state of Kalifornia in exchange for the fiscal cut they hand the politicians of said state. Dollars that the 'gaming tribes' determine for you and that will never reach the causes Ahnold tells us they will magically assist.

[blam]

9,400 Year Old Spirit Cave Man
(Oldest Mummy Found In The Americas)

[blam]

"There is an even older connection (10,300 years) between a southern Alaskan skeleton and living descendants stretching from southern California to the tip of South America."

Here:

Oldest Human DNA in the Americas
Teeth from an Alaskan Cave Provide Clues to Ancient Migration Patterns (On-Your-Knees-Cave)

[blam]

Old Bones Are Telling New Tales

[JustDoItAlways]

Whenever I see facial reconstructions of these ancient skulls, I always think “Well, he looks like a native american to me.”

[Squantos]

I have it on good authority that there have been lots of bones buried at UCSD !.........:o)

[Jessarah]

There is a group in the Ramapo Mountains who claim to be an Indian tribe who intermarried with Hessian Soldiers during the Revolution.

Seems like they could do some simple DNA testing to prove what they are. ???

[JimSEA]

“We no longer want them disrespected.”

In Southeast Asia, my in-laws take me to museums where in-site burials from the pre-Buddhist times of the iron age, bronze age and neolithic are displayed. By far, most of the tourists at these museums are Thai and they are interested in learning as much as is possible about the ancient people. The recent studies that have called into question the Tai People's massive invasion of their current home from Southern China eight hundred years ago (DNA studies link 3,500 YO burials to current populations), has excited additional interest in archeology rather than calls for increased PC. There is no doubt that some of their culture and ancient rulers came from China but much of their culture has been found to be indigenous, practiced for thousands of years. Spending on Archaeological sites and joint ventures with the Univ. of Penn and French schools have increased.

Tribal politics hurt rather than help Native Americans.

[dsc]

“Tribal politics hurt rather than help Native Americans.”

Look at Russell Means and tell me he isn’t consumed by hatred.

[JimSEA]

Yes, and nurturing that hatred in others has become his occupation.

[DavemeisterP]

My great-grandmother was a full blooded Cherokee. I remember her well in my childhood. I’m an archaeologist with a US based CRM company, and if, for some reason, it was necessary to dig her up to learn more about my family lineage, I would love to be the first to use my trowel. I pray that some day I may be deemed important enough for someone to dig me up to learn about themselves from me. Wow, I mean, what better way to have my fleeting time here be immortalized for all time. Shouldn't’t we all feel so blessed?

I saw the week before last the oldest act of love I’ve ever seen in a burial of a woman carefully placed with her hand under her chin, the other on her knee, in a burial dug to a depth of around 6 feet with whomever loved her’s bare hands. I also saw a couple buried together in an embrace, and someone buried with their arms around their best friend, their dog. These visions of love over 3000 yrs. old warmed my heart and reinforced the love I hold dear for my wife and kids. I WANT TO MAKE SOMEONE FEEL THAT SAME WAY IN 3000 years. These burials that archaeologists uncover aren’t just about digging up someones body that has moved on, they’re also about carefully viewing the snapshot in time of the interaction that others had with that person after they died. That kind of information can only be seen in these contexts. Many times it’s beautiful and heartwarming. Many times it’s brutal and more vicious than anything that we would EVER begin to do to OUR own relatives now days (Hell, if I buried my wife, set fire to her feet, set fire to her head, placed a big rock on her head so that she couldn’t go to heaven, and thereby premeditatedly sentenced her to hell on earth for all time, I think with today’s laws I would have to say someone might object to me doing that.). Irregardless, almost every burial can offer an amazing insight into the life and times of my own far distant relatives, and I don’t understand at all why ANYONE objects to us doing this. My personal opinion is that these tribes don’t want us to know about their far-distant past, as the knowledge of that might corrupt our ‘white man’s’ pretty little picture of the Native American being this victimized loving group of societies, which in fact is completely bogus. If that is the case, then they are trying to warp history for the benefit of modern individuals. Kinda like the movie Da Vinci’s Code. Remember the quote ‘Dead people tell no lies’? It’s very true in this instance.

[Myrddin]

My wife is toying with archeology as a minor (coupled with studying the Shoshone language). Her major is going to be communications oriented to organizational management. That is aimed at improving her opportunities beyond dispatching police/fire/EMS.

My parents purchased a house in Chula Vista from the Ashley family in 1961. The Ashley's moved a couple blocks away to a new house. I grew up with Ray Ashley over the years. He earned his PhD in archeology and is curator of the San Diego Maritime Museum. One of those rare people who take that field of endeavor and succeed well beyond expectations. You can find lots of citations in Google from his work.

[Pokomam]

It is quite obvious you do not understand the sacredness of American Indians buried dead. As a full blooded Pokomam member of Salvadoran Mayas, it is quite visible how folks in the states cannot relate to the Americas. American’s ties with Israel a land foreign to them is more sacred than their own, I think this is pathetic.

[DavemeisterP]

Don’t lump me in a box you don’t understand yourself. All of us are biased in our own ways. So are you, as your reply clearly states. I, personally, don’t FEEL the connection to Israel that the media may lead you to believe I do. I am a Christian. Which means, a person trying to be Christ-like. That doesn’t mean I feel some connection at all with Israel. I am a historian, and have been since I was 5. I love history and perceive white American history as a perpetuated lie to warp the minds of our kids into acting in a very ethnocentric manner. Makes me sick going to my daughter’s plays at school, knowing the reality of what the plays are REALLY about. We also have some historical American holidays that I DID NOT vote into existence. You’re not talking to someone, at all, that fits into this biased image you have of Americans. I can understand your ill-feelings towards Americans and their lack of sensibilities, because I share your disgust of them. I still LOVE my country, in spite of it’s blinders...

It’s a pleasure to meet you,
DP