Posted on 10/16/2007 10:27:25 AM PDT by eraser2005
NEW YORK, CNNMoney.com -- The Toyota brand has lost its top position for iron-clad reliability, according to an influential Consumer Reports survey released Tuesday.
The survey dropped Toyota from first to fifth place - behind Honda, Acura, Scion and Subaru - in average vehicle reliability. The rankings are based on average predicted reliability for all models sold under a given brand.
Brands made by Toyota Motor Co. and Honda Motor Co. still dominate the rankings: Scion is Toyota's low-priced car brand and Acura is Honda's luxury car brand.
Consumer Reports said it no longer recommends V6 versions of Toyota's Camry or V8 versions of its Tundra pick-up because of poor reliability.
In the past, because Toyota (Charts) products have so consistently proved reliable, the magazine would assume at least average reliability for Toyota's brand new cars, without waiting for survey data from owners.
But from now on, the magazine will wait for a full year of reliability survey data to come in before it recommends a Toyota product - as it does with most other manufacturers.
(Excerpt) Read more at money.cnn.com ...
oops - double clutched. Sorry
When they use tems like “220 percent less” I have no idea what is meant in any context. I was taught in grade school that anything reduced by 100 percent would cease to exist, how can something be said to be “220 percent less”? I have been forced to come to grips with the fact that in modern usage “500 times smaller” is taken to mean reduced to 1/500th of original size but “220 percent less” sounds like gibberish with no discernible meaning whatsoever. Apparently this is what passes for “journalism” in this age. I used to wonder if things reported were true, now I am left to wonder if the reporter even has any idea what he is attempting to say!
still see Ford and Chevys from the 70’s and 80’s on the road today.
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I occasionally see a Ford F-1 from the early fifties still on the road. My father bought a 51 model new and had no trouble with it for six years and then someone drove a huge Buick into it at an intersection and destroyed it. I think one of those things would last forever if you took proper care of it. He used to drive it all over the fields on the farm and routinely haul two to four times the rated payload.
I had an uncle who lived next door who owned a 49 model of the same truck and it too seemed indestructible. He died in 59 and the truck was sold and I saw it occasionaly for many years afterward, That truck had been used for hauling everything from firewood to 2000 pound cattle. The old flathead V-8 was still strong after ten years of hard use.
Surprisingly, both the Ford Expedition and the barge-like Ford Excursion are far better off road than the H2 is, at least in terms of suspension durability.
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I don’t know why that would be so surprising, the last time I saw a Chevy Z-71 up on a lift I looked underneath and the frame and suspension looked to be about one-fourth the strength of what is under the Ford. If I had to go off-roading in one or the other there would be no question, the GM off road vehicles may be better now but they never impressed me in the past.
80 percent Chevy? I wasn’t there so I can’t say otherwise but it ain’t that way here! I still remember a Consumer Report rating back in the seventies that concluded with something like this,”if you use your pickup as a passenger vehicle buy a Chevy, it rides a little better. If you want to actually haul something buy the Ford, don’t even consider the Dodge”.
For all I can see the same advice might be applicable today.
I have a 2004 Scion XB and have not had one problem with it.
On the other hand, Toyota just recalled almost half a million vehicles in Japan, including the bB (the name of the xB in the Japanese market) - I don’t believe it goes back as far as 2004 for the bB, though the range for all the vehicles recalled goes from 1999 to 2007....
So, why doesn't Toyota offer a LIFETIME powertrain warranty? Sorry, I drive Chrysler products. Best trucks (Dodge)on the market.
How’s the body durability on those Sonatas?
My mom has a 2004 (or maybe 2003) Hyundai Elantra, and it’s been a fine little car, but the body panels dent inordinately easily. Every one of them I’ve seen has a collection of dings and dents on the sides. The Sonatas I’ve seen, even the previous generation, don’t appear to have that problem so much. I don’t know if the Elantra’s problem is the guage of metal they used, or the quality of it.
“So, why doesn’t Toyota offer a LIFETIME powertrain warranty? Sorry, I drive Chrysler products. Best trucks (Dodge)on the market.”
Because they don’t have to. Toyota and other Japanese makes have a solid record of producing powertrains that don’t need replaced right after the warranty expires. Offering a 10-year or lifetime warranty to me suggests that you’re having trouble moving your product (like Hyundai in the US a few years ago) and you need a gimmick to help bring people in.
A few weeks ago, my wife and I rented a Dodge Charger. It was a nice car, but in 10 years, will it have held up as well as a Honda or Toyota? Given my past experiences, I think not. And I know for a fact that the resale value will hold up no where near as well as a comparable Japanese product.
My 2004 Sonata has 42K on it. So far, nothing of consequence. One of the buttons on the stereo messed up and they replaced the radio with no discussion.
I have not owned an Elantra, but have driven a friend’s in addition to test driving a new one a year ago. It was going to be our “in town” car. But the step up in interior size, weight, quiet and ride were considerable in the Sonata so I instead bought the 2007 with the 2.4L four. The Elantra is definitely “tinnier” than the Sonata.
The 2006 & 2007 Sonata are nearly identical. A little heavier feeling than my 2004. Bodies seem fine in strength. I have found a few [very small] imperfections in the paint. Inconsequential, but the kind you don’t get if you spend another $10k.
Nice highway car. The 2.4 four doesn’t have the raw power and pickup that the six has. But it hums along quietly and effortlessly at 80+ for hours.
Subarus, amusingly enough, is building Toyota Camries under contract from Toyota in their IN plant.
That is because Toyota now owns part of Subaru, although a smaller percentage than what was owned by GM.
A lifetime warranty is a gimmick? Nope. Just an awful lot of confidence in your product.
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