Posted on 10/03/2007 10:15:01 AM PDT by jacknhoo
Religion Must Be Destroyed, Atheist Alliance Declares By Matt Purple CNSNews.com Correspondent October 03, 2007
(CNSNews.com) - Science must ultimately destroy organized religion, according to some of the leading atheist writers and intellectuals who spoke at a recent atheist conference in Northern Virginia. God is a myth, and children must not be schooled in any faith, they said, at the "Crystal Clear Atheism" event, sponsored by the Atheist Alliance International.
Some of the luminaries who spoke at the conference, held at the Crown Royal Hotel in Crystal City, Va., over the weekend, included Oxford professor Richard Dawkins, author Sam Harris and journalist Christopher Hitchens. The Atheist Alliance International describes itself as "the only democratic national atheist organization in the United States."
While most attendees on Friday night were adamant that God was a myth, the convention, attended by hundreds of people, brought into focus a divide among atheists as to their identity as a movement and the nature of the enemy they faced.
In his speech, Dawkins portrayed a black-and-white intellectual battle between atheism and religion. He denounced the "preposterous nonsense of religious customs" and compared religion to racism. He also gave no quarter to moderate or liberal believers, asserting that "so-called moderate Christianity is simply an evasion."
"If you've been taught to believe it by moderates, what's to stop you from taking the next step and blowing yourself up?" he said.
By contrast, Harris's speech was a more tempered critique of the atheist movement itself. While Harris said he believed science must ultimately destroy religion, he also discussed spirituality and mysticism and called for a greater understanding of allegedly spiritual phenomena. He also cautioned the audience against lumping all religions together.
"The refrain that all religions have their extremists is bull-t," Harris said. "All religions do not have their extremists. Some religions have never had their extremists."
Specifically, he noted that radical Islam was far more threatening than any radical Christian sect, adding that Christians had a right to be outraged when the media treated the two religions similarly.
Harris also criticized movement atheism and questioned the use of the word "atheist."
"Atheism is not a philosophy, just as non-racism is not," he said. "It is not a worldview, though it is frequently portrayed as one.
"Rather than declare ourselves atheists, I think we should emphasize reason," Harris added.
While the audience gave Dawkins a standing ovation, Harris received only polite applause. One questioner later declared herself "very disappointed" in Harris's talk.
But whatever differences the speakers had with each other, they were united in their contempt for religion and their belief that religious faith had to be challenged and ridiculed by secularism and reason.
"Religion is not the root of all evil, but it gets in the way of [determining] how we got here and where we find ourselves," Dawkins said. "And that is an evil in itself."
Dawkins was particularly critical of parents who raise their children as a "Catholic child" or "Protestant child." Children must not be labeled as subscribing to a particular religion, he said, and should be allowed to examine the evidence and determine their beliefs for themselves.
"If I said that's a post-modernist child, for example, you'd think I was mad," he quipped.
Other speakers at the convention included philosopher Daniel Dennett, evolutionary scientist Eugenie Scott, and Charles Darwin's great-great-grandson Matthew Chapman. There was also a performance by atheist rapper Greydon Square, who wore a shirt that read "The Black Carl Sagan."
Many of the attendees seemed to have developed an aversion to religion from conservative, Protestant Christians. Several of the atheists Cybercast News Service spoke to complained of living under fundamentalist parents who frowned upon any questioning of the Bible or any activity condemned in Scripture.
"It wasn't easy [telling my parents I was an atheist]," one said. "I still haven't entirely told them. I just say I'm a humanist, which they don't seem to mind."
Further emphasizing the attendees' distaste for conservative religion was the convention gift shop which, in addition to atheist materials, sold politically liberal-themed bumper stickers and pins, including "Impeach Bush" and "Stewart/Colbert '08."
A common decoration at the convention was the red letter "A," which was emblazoned on t-shirts and pins worn by several of the attendees. The "A," an allusion to Hester Prynne's punishment in Nathaniel Hawthorne's The Scarlet Letter, is a symbol of the Out Campaign, a movement started by Dawkins to encourage Americans to proudly display their atheism.
Although Crystal Clear Atheism was well-attended, it received little publicity and media attention. The convention also experienced frequent technical difficulties, particularly during Dawkins' Powerpoint slideshow.
Atheists are still a small minority in America. A Newsweek poll earlier this year found that 91 percent of Americans believe in God. A more recent Pew Research Center poll found that atheists were among the most distrusted people in the nation, with 53 percent of Americans holding an unfavorable opinion of them.
But they are a proudly elitist and self-certain minority. When asked what the main difference between believers and atheists was, Dawkins had a quick answer: "Well, we're bright."
A competent God would not have created a world in which the innocent suffer, wars kill millions of innocents, and abortions even need to be considered. Did God create Smallpox, diptheria and Bubonic Plague? If so, what could he have been thinking?
I think you are on the wrong forum. This is for conservatives.
Okay, so the fact that God doesn’t seem to fit the Santa Claus ideal that you think He should, indicates to you that He doesn’t exist.
I notice that you still haven’t responded to my earlier question. If you think that Christianity is a sham, how do you think the Nazis disparaged it?
You’re truly all over the map on this...
My advice would be to locate someone that you can trust and believes in a Christian God to explain to you how God INDEED created a paradise, literally heaven on earth that was ruined by one of His angels, Satan.
And Heaven is not something that will or can be ruined.
Our time here is fleeting. Eternity is not.
Besides, your way gives us all that suffering with absolutely ZERO to look towards afterwards!
“If you think that Christianity is a sham, how do you think the Nazis disparaged it?”
I respect the morality that true Christians live by, but don’t believe in a divine basis for it, or anything else. The Nazi’s disparaged Chrisitianity by doing the exact opposite of what Christians of the same time period were preaching - brotherhood, tolerance, respect, etc. You are reading way too much of your own prejudices of what a non-religious conservative is like into what I am saying. You are twisting my words, and acting in an arrogant and hateful way.
...you come on here spewing idiocy about Hitler-Christian.com...evilbible.com...nazi-christian.com...calling Christianity a fairy tale...
and THEN tell us WE’RE being hateful?
frankly you should consider yourself fortunate that people here have been trying to educate you and help you, let alone converse with you!
The Enlightenment was, in part, a consequence of the Religious Wars that ravaged central and western Europe for more than a hundred years. Its leading advocates damned both Catholics and Protestants, and renounced religion as superstition . Without religion, they said, fanaticism will cease and Reason will reign in the affairs of men. Then they came to power. The men of reason gained control of France and we have the first taste of modern totalitarianism, the French Terror, which in a short while consumed more victims than the Inquisition did in a hundred.
Well, here we are, more than 200 years later, and we again hear the refrain: Repigion is bad; rid the world of it; trust us, we are the men of Reason.
“You’re truly all over the map on this...”
No, actually I am conistent - it is in reading what others have posted with their prejudice towards what I have been trying to say that is confusing things.
“My advice would be to locate someone that you can trust and believes in a Christian God to explain to you how God INDEED created a paradise, literally heaven on earth that was ruined by one of His angels, Satan.”
Why would an Omniscient God create Satan in the first place, knowing full well he would rebel and cause untold suffering in Heaven and on Earth?
“And Heaven is not something that will or can be ruined.”
Hmmm.. don’t see any wat prove this or disprove it - but it doesn’t seem too likely considering it would require a supernatural explanation.
“Our time here is fleeting. Eternity is not.”
On this we are in perfect agreement.
“Besides, your way gives us all that suffering with absolutely ZERO to look towards afterwards!”
I completely agree! I wish it WAS “your way”! I simply see no evidence that it possibly can be!
Except you don't believe in the sanctity of life.
The Nazi’s disparaged Chrisitianity by doing the exact opposite of what Christians of the same time period were preaching
They were also big on the euthanasia and abortion movement, which you support.
You are reading way too much of your own prejudices of what a non-religious conservative is like into what I am saying. You are twisting my words, and acting in an arrogant and hateful way.
Untrue, I just happen to understand that without our God given rights to "Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness" that everything else falls apart.
No, actually I am conistent - it is in reading what others have posted with their prejudice towards what I have been trying to say that is confusing things.
riiiight evilbible.com just couldn’t POSSIBLY be the problem!
I completely agree! I wish it WAS “your way”! I simply see no evidence that it possibly can be!
Try turning on the lights!
btw....love requires a supernatural explanation...and love exists. I hope you’ve experienced that with someone!
“Christian.com...evilbible.com...nazi-christian.com...calling Christianity a fairy tale...”
I did no such thing. There are no such web sites as you describe above with the exception of evilbible.com. I said to do searches using the other criteria you mentioned and find that the Nazis described (thought of) themselves as Christians. I was NOT equating Christianity with Nazism! Wagglebbe and 8mmmauser had knee-jerk reactions when I pointed out that ONE uncomfortable fact and blew an aneurysm over it - misinterpreting what I was trying to say. Read some of my other posts - I like Christians even though I don’t share their religious beleifs. I even said Chritianity was the best of all religions in my opinion.
There are no such web sites as you describe above with the exception of evilbible.com.
OK...
Again, you seem like a decent enough person, I once again just invite you to explore your genuine search for answers with someone who has the time and patience to explain some of these things from a GENUINE Christian perspective.
Life is tough, and a Christian life is no exception! There are forces out there hell-bent (pardon the pun) to keep you from seeing the truth.
When you are going to directly reference another FReeper, you should also ping them.
Read some of my other posts
Like this one?:
| Religion Must Be Destroyed, Atheist Alliance Declares |
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| Posted by Locke_2007 to wagglebee On News/Activism 10/03/2007 5:53:24 PM EDT · 113 of 191 I’ll give you all the rest, but Hitler was a Christian. Didn’t ACT like one, but thought of himself as one. As did the rest of the Nazi’s. The Spanish Inquisition weren’t exactly nice guys either. Some people, like many you have listed, espoused atheism for purposes of convenience - in order to excuse their actions. This should be rightfully condemned. However, there are many others who espouse atheism for reasons of high conviction and intellectual honesty. I do find the stridence of some of these people to be quite annoying, in the same way I find the stridence of Creationists to be annoying. They claim to knowledge they cannot and do not possess. Just exactly who did Margaret Sanger kill? Are you talking abortions? Post Reply | Private Reply | To 107 | View Replies |
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You flat out declared that Hitler was a Christian.
The universe is not infinite as verified by recent observation - IT HAD A BEGINNING and is expanding from that begining.
It had a beginning (and will have an end),
and therefore, Something Else that IS infinite had to “start” it.
“Again, you seem like a decent enough person, I once again just invite you to explore your genuine search for answers with someone who has the time and patience to explain some of these things from a GENUINE Christian perspective.”
Thank you for a decent, polite, reasoned reponse. I really appreciate that. I HAVE studied the Bible, and Christianity, quite a lot, actually. I’ve taken passing looks at most other religions as well out of pure intellectual curiosity. The only one that I feel has any merit at all is Christianity. I also think one of the main reasons for the success of European (Western) civilization is the binding, stabilizing force of Christianity. However, I’ve never felt whatever it is that makes people believe so strongly in it. I just don’t see how it can be possible for so many rational, logical, and yes, scientific reasons. But I really appreciate at least one persion having the decency to treat me like a human being here, and not some kind of monster.
“Science must destroy religion”???
On the contrary - scientific analysis of the universe and our place in it keep giving stronger and stronger evidence FOR a Creator.
“This sh* didn’t happen by accident...”
Yes, because he considered himself to be one. As did most of his buddies. I am tired of your hate, wagglebee. You can rejoice, I am no longer a part of this conversation. Now you can crow victory over the evil atheist (even though I am not). Enjoy your delusions. Bye.
Atheism is a religion.
Best of luck to you.
“I’ll give you all the rest, but Hitler was a Christian. Didn’t ACT like one, but thought of himself as one.”
Sorry, I take it back. One last thing, then I’ll go. In your mindless knee-jerk reactionism to prove how evil I am - you didn’t bother to read the next part: “Didn’t ACT like one, but thought of himself as one.”
Did you read that? What defines a person as a Christian? Their actions? The fact that they are baptized? The fact that they go to a particular Church? The fact that they declare they are a Baptist, Protestant, Catholic, etc.? Did you consider any of these other things? No? It’s pretty easy to see why you would be so credulous as to believe most anything. You don’t exercise your brain much, do you?
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