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Debating Ron Paul
National Ledger ^ | Aug 29, 2007 | JB Williams

Posted on 08/29/2007 4:59:22 AM PDT by PlainOleAmerican

Ron Paul supporters are fast making a name for themselves on the web. Not because they are just web savvy, but because they have proven themselves to be the best at hacking on-line polls, invalidating conservative polling data on behalf of their candidate. It seems that even Democrat 527 MoveOn.org is now onboard the Ron Paul anti-war train.

Despite the fact that presidential candidate Ron Paul can not score better than 3% in any legitimate national poll, his supporters claim he is “the conservative” candidate to beat in the 2008 Republican race for the White House. Despite his less than conservative voting record in congress and his Teddy Kennedy like position on the war on terror in Iraq, his supporters think he is the most “conservative” candidate in the race. How?

(Excerpt) Read more at nationalledger.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: binladensboy; daviddukespresident; isolationism; liberalism; libertarians; nationalsecurity; nutburger; paulbearers; paulestinians; ronnutters; rupaul
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Comment #61 Removed by Moderator

To: PlainOleAmerican

Ron Paul - uberRino


62 posted on 08/29/2007 6:37:40 AM PDT by elizabetty (The funding dried up and I can no longer afford Tagline Messages.)
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To: NavyCanDo

You have to wonder???


63 posted on 08/29/2007 6:37:56 AM PDT by PlainOleAmerican
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To: 1689LBC

Understood, but don’t think for a second that the divisions within the conservative movement are an accident...

You can blame all the politicians you want, but at the end of the day, when American voters only vote for politicians willing to pander via the treasury, politicians from all party’s learn to pander.

Also, don’t fool yourself into thinking that when you lack the power to reform your own party, you somehow have the power to launch and control a new party...


64 posted on 08/29/2007 6:41:30 AM PDT by PlainOleAmerican
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To: PlainOleAmerican

The DNC is working behind the scenes to make him the Ross Perot of 2008, because no Democrat candidate can win unless the conservative vote is divided.


A good article with data for support. However I don’t agree that Paul will have the same impact as Perot did in 1992. First of all Paul has said he won’t run as a 3rd party candidate. If that is true then his impact will be mostly on the Republican primary selection and be minimial in that regards. Paul will be lucky to get more than an handful of delegates to the National Convention and won’t even be given a speaking slot, imo. Thus by Mar. 08 Paul’s run will be over.

He may stay in the campaign until the end but he’ll come nowhere near having the delegates to become the Republican nominee. His supporters aren’t normal Party members and will move on to other things once he’s history. He’s the Keyes of this cycle.


65 posted on 08/29/2007 6:51:14 AM PDT by deport (>>>--Keep your powder dry--<<< [ Meanwhile:-- Cue Spooky Music--])
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To: NavyCanDo
When I tune in Air America on my morning drive in to work...

I'm sorry...you've blown your credibility right there.

66 posted on 08/29/2007 6:54:08 AM PDT by Oberon (What does it take to make government shrink?)
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To: elizabetty
Ron Paul - uberRino

Now, as propaganda goes, this is a second-rate effort. For one thing it involves the use of a language non-native to your target audience, and therefore will only really be received by people with a certain modicum of education. This is counter to your purpose. Also, the term "RINO" is an acronym known primarily to Republican party members and those who debate them, again limiting the scope of your audience.

On the plus side, it's short, punchy, and would fit on a bumper sticker. Goebbels would give you a C+.

67 posted on 08/29/2007 6:57:13 AM PDT by Oberon (What does it take to make government shrink?)
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To: deport

I agree with your prediction...

He actually seems more the Republican Ralph Nader...


68 posted on 08/29/2007 6:57:53 AM PDT by PlainOleAmerican
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To: NavyCanDo

Know the enemy, eh?


69 posted on 08/29/2007 6:59:33 AM PDT by Martins kid
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To: PlainOleAmerican

The weekend after the 4th of July I took the family to Seattle’s Greenlake which is Mecca for Seattle area leftist anti-war moonbats. Its fun just watching all the very very strange people there. And who do I see? Dozens and dozens of Ron Paul supporters carrying signs and banners and handing out pamphlets to the 98% liberal visitors at the lake. I noticed they were received quite well, with smiles and hand shakes.
Try doing the same for any of the other GOP candidates and you would find your self in a confrontation real quick. Seattle Police would have to come to your rescue.

During the 2000 campaign for Bush/Cheney I volunteered to hold Bush/Cheney signs at Husky Stadium before the games and was flipped off so many times I could not count them all. A few even got in my face and tempted me to throw the first punch. And this was long before the war and the impeach Bush craziness. Imagine doing that now…
Then I look at these Ron Paul supporters being treated like old friends at a high school reunion, and I say Jeeeeeeeeez, who care what kind of voting record he can muster, if moonbats like him, he should be avoided like the plague.


70 posted on 08/29/2007 7:01:00 AM PDT by NavyCanDo
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To: Oberon
“I’m sorry...you’ve blown your credibility right there.”

Try reading the whole post before replying. I said at 4:30 in the morning you nothing but infomercials or Air America on the radio, and they are always good for a laugh. Yea I do tune in sometimes on the drive in to work, that does not make me a liberal. Read my profile for Gods sake.

71 posted on 08/29/2007 7:06:18 AM PDT by NavyCanDo
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To: NavyCanDo

No doubt about it...

No need to wonder any more!


72 posted on 08/29/2007 7:10:01 AM PDT by PlainOleAmerican
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To: NavyCanDo
Try reading the whole post before replying.

Oh, I did. However, my purpose in posting was not to engage you on any factual, logical, or reasonable grounds, but rather to discredit you in a shallow emotional way that makes for good propaganda.

It's a tactic I've learned from the neocons on the Ron Paul threads. If you search my posts, you'll see that several times I have evaluated and even graded anti-Paul propaganda efforts based on a simple idea I call the WWGT principle: What Would Goebbels Think?

I was particularly impressed with the term "Paulistinian." That was a very good effort on behalf of one of our fellow Freepers.

73 posted on 08/29/2007 7:11:25 AM PDT by Oberon (What does it take to make government shrink?)
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To: NavyCanDo

Snap judgments on partial information are so much easier and much more entertaining... LOL


74 posted on 08/29/2007 7:11:31 AM PDT by PlainOleAmerican
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To: Oberon
OK, then have fun discrediting me in an “emotional way” on my Post #70
75 posted on 08/29/2007 7:19:09 AM PDT by NavyCanDo
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Comment #76 Removed by Moderator

Comment #77 Removed by Moderator

To: Clara Lou; George W. Bush; OrthodoxPresbyterian

well, I think this author has taken an overly simplistic view to Ron Paul’s voting record. There was another thread where someone pointed to an ‘on the issues’ site or somethingrather which made similar claims.

Paul votes against nearly all pieces of legislation because he believes most of what congress does in unconstitutional. So, when bills are bundled together and amendments attached, he votes against the whole thing and then he is claimed as being against a part of what he was voting against, even though he might have voted for it if it had been on his own. Additionally, some of these votes may have been due to his strong belief in states rights. Others, the author of this piece is correctly stating he voted against an individual piece of legislation, but I think he is correct in doing so, votes against the failed War On Drugs for instance, defense of marriage, some aspects of foreign policy.

So, in conclusion I think this piece distorts on some facts, wildly speculates on others (the DNC is pulling for Paul as a 3rd party?!), contains many errors of ommission (only candidate to favor abolishing the IRS, pulling out of the UN, abolishing half the Fed gov), and has some truth to it here and there. :)

For a better sum up of Paul’s postions and legislative record see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Ron_Paul


78 posted on 08/29/2007 7:21:26 AM PDT by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/Ron_Paul_2008.htm)
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To: NavyCanDo
The weekend after the 4th of July I took the family to Seattle’s Greenlake which is Mecca for Seattle area leftist anti-war moonbats.

I'm glad you found some kindred spirits.

(see how easy it is to "debate" when you dispense with truth and reason?)

In all seriousness, judging Paul by the people who support him is illogical. David Duke probably voted for W, but that doesn't make W a klansman.

79 posted on 08/29/2007 7:24:12 AM PDT by Oberon (What does it take to make government shrink?)
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To: PlainOleAmerican
The subject is the spamming

No, the subject is hacking, which is a felony offense. Does the author have evidence of this, or is the author a libeler?

80 posted on 08/29/2007 7:24:46 AM PDT by steve-b (It's hard to be religious when certain people don't get struck by lightning.)
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