Baptists turn from public schools [NC]

News & Observer ^ | Aug 26, 2007 | Yonat Shimron

[jern]

Convinced that God has been erased from public schools, Southern Baptists are now working to open their own schools, where Jesus is writ large and Bible study is part of the daily curriculum.

Church leaders are not calling for a wholesale exodus from public schools, which would be a monumental hit, considering that Southern Baptists make up the nation's largest Protestant denomination with 16 million members.

Rather, they talk about alternatives to public schools capable of educating a new generation ready and willing to advocate for biblical principles rather than popular culture.

"In the public schools, you don't just have neutrality, you have hostility toward organized religion," said Daniel Akin, president of Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary in Wake Forest. "A lot of parents are fed up."

Southeastern is leading the push, sponsoring a Christian School 101 workshop Monday and Tuesday. The program is designed to train church leaders to open private schools.

At Southeastern and elsewhere, Southern Baptists have become convinced that fighting to change the system is futile. They say public schools have long demonstrated a commitment to teaching evolution over creationism, world faiths over Christianity, sex education over abstinence, moral relativism over Christian claims of truth.

A history of alienation

The denomination's disenchantment with public schools is not new. It dates to the 1920s, when states debated the teaching of creationism vs. evolution. Evolution increasingly won, despite the famous Scopes Monkey Trial in Tennessee, which gave the victory to creationists. The 1962 and 1963 U.S. Supreme Court decisions banning prayer and devotional readings from public schools only increased Southern Baptists' ire.

Since then, alienation with public schools has grown alongside the nation's culture wars, pitting evangelical Christians against secularists.

"Southern Baptists see the new religious establishment in this country as secularism,"

[beezdotcom]

All that being said, I have almost nothing bad to say about homeschooling, either. Most parents wouldn’t do as bad a job of it as they or other people would fear. Sure, there are bad homeschoolers, but there are bad teachers in private and public schools.

[achilles2000]

“WOW — now that is cool — I am forwarding that to our youth minister. Thank you!”

Don’t be surprised if your youth minister does not become an advocate. Youth pastors are typically part of the problem - the model of evangelism they are taught is to use children in the church to bring other kids to youth events. The hope is that some of the kids with make a profession and get baptized,which allows the senior pastor to enhance his reputation for “evangelism” (even though he doesn’t really evangelize). That, and keeping children and teens out from under foot by providing them with entertainment, is the function of the youth pastor today.

A pastor friend told me once that if a youth pastor told the parents of the youth in the church that they should remove their children from government schools that the parents would kill him and then the senior pastor would fire his dead body.

[achilles2000]

“Who is this Baucham?”

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/102-4979016-8218503?initialSearch=1&url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=voddie+baucham&Go.x=8&Go.y=13

I call him “the large communicator”.

[beezdotcom]

She didn’t speak ill of your children; she asked rhetorical questions every parent of any kid in any kind of school should be willing and able to answer about their kid’s education.

Defend her if you must, but timing and context is everything. Rather than trust my involvement in the school and my assessment of it as previously described, she would rather use her 'checklist' to sneeringly insinuate that our family has so little respect for our Christian walk that we would actually have to stop and rethink things after reading it, never ever having considered the evils of the world before. Give me a break.

[cinives]

I disagree again, and here’s why.

You assume that all kids must be taught by a person with a specific set of skills. Clearly, you do not believe that a child can do any self-teaching, or that using a textbook or other resources without a teacher to interpret and guide what is read or performed is real learning.

Have you never taught yourself anything outside of a classroom ? Is learning not valid if a teacher doesn’t give it a stamp of approval ? If you read a book about constellations and telescopes and then go join the Amateur Astronomical Society, they will ask you for a reference from a teacher before you can display any of your knowledge ?

You discount the entirety of human invention, because no advance in human thought or the human condition EVER occurred in a classroom.

[achilles2000]

Just about anybody can homeschool through highschool because of the technology and resources now available. As for greatly improving government schools...I think that has been tried over and over again and has failed over and over again. Rather than school reform, it would be more productive to just become a Civil War reenactor specializing in Pickett’s Charge.

I see that the (already dumbed down)national SAT is reporting that averages are down again.

[dan1123]

>> I just did some spot checking - The Critical Analysis of fossils Prentice was the one that made post a suggestion to be carefuol using that site. The use of terms like macroevolution show a lack of familiarity with science while senctences like

“Their fossil “evidence” gets destroyed by facts every so often, but they never question their assumptions, they just string together a new set of bones and call it a “series of intermediaries” until it gets disproven as well.”

shows a desire not to educate but inspire blind disdain for science. <<

So you’re not talking about *facts* but *tone*.

[StarCMC]

Actually, I got a thank you back and he’s putting it in his weekly email to the youth parents. :-)

[cinives]

OK, so as a parent you feel insulted. She didn’t insult your kids by asking those questions.

Her points, however, really apply to any school. As a parent, if you choose your child’s education, you should do due diligence before sending off your darling for 7 hours a day into the care of strangers. Otherwise, caveat empter.

[JenB]

All that being said, I have almost nothing bad to say about homeschooling, either. Most parents wouldn’t do as bad a job of it as they or other people would fear. Sure, there are bad homeschoolers, but there are bad teachers in private and public schools.

Wow, talk about damning with faint praise... sheesh.

Any parent who is literate, actually cares, and wants to invest the time and money, can do at least as good a job as the average government school education. Period. I've known "dumb" parents educate intelligent kids. I've known average parents of genius children homeschool successfully.

Most parents will do a great job, and of course "what other people would fear" is completel irrelevant. No one but the parents have any right to judge their fitness to homeschool.

[cinives]

LOL you are so correct. The problem is that now you can’t compare this year with any prior years and get any kind of a direction.

That was the intent, wasn’t it ? They need to lower the bar before the NCLB kids show up.

[StarCMC]

And I really should comment on the rest of your statement...

I’m sorry to hear about your experiences - but our youth pastor is incredible, and our church would not settle for what you seem to think is the norm. Nor does our pastor care about his “evangelist” reputation, he cares about the lives and the souls of his church members and the community.

[beezdotcom]

The state has allowed, no encouraged, parents to abdicate their responsibilities in this matter. The only solution I see is to leave parents to the education of their kids. Whether the parents choose private schools or homeschool or some combination thereof, should be left to parents.

Y'know, we mostly agree. I'm not one of these "parents aren't qualified to homeschool" public school apologists, and in fact, my children's education has been an amalgam of the three.

You advocate a choice between private schools or homeschools. Fine - but while the public schools are still standing, I'm going to evaluate them among my choices, too. Believe it or not, there are still a few worth considering. And you don't HAVE to believe me - but I see no reason for people to constantly insult my integrity by assuming that I must not care about my children's well-being.

[achilles2000]

Not my experiences - I described the standard youth pastor model taught in seminaries. There are obviously exceptions - but what I described is taught and practiced in a majority of churches - even if yours isn’t one of them.

[beezdotcom]

Wow, talk about damning with faint praise... sheesh.

Sorry. I could offer much more praise, but constantly having my intelligence, motivations and Christian faith questioned takes away a bit of enthusiasm.

Any parent who is literate, actually cares, and wants to invest the time and money, can do at least as good a job as the average government school education.

I agree. That's why we wouldn't even be in a government school unless I was convinced it was providing something well above the norm - which in our case, it is. And which, according to some on this thread, is still no excuse.

No one but the parents have any right to judge their fitness to homeschool.

I completely agree - and I would extend that to say that no one but the parents has any right to judge their fitness to evaluate their educational options, be they homeschooling, private school or public school.

[achilles2000]

I think that is wonderful. As the article indicates, things are changing. Not long ago no seminary president would have dared to say what Aiken and Al Mohler have said about education.

It would be a good thing if youth pastors were reassigned to become education pastors...

I hope that many youth pastors and senior pastors will pass along the article.

[StarCMC]

Somehow I think you’re a little extra-cynical. But ok.

[StarCMC]

You should not have to apologize to anyone for doing what is best for your child in your situation. Period.

[beezdotcom]

OK, so as a parent you feel insulted. She didn’t insult your kids by asking those questions.

No, it insults my children even more. The questions assume that my children are passive, mindless, weak in Christ and a whole range of other issues. That they would sit next to kiddie drug dealers without protest. That they would willingly submit to abuse of any kind, such that I would never know. That they would blithely submit to brainwashing.

Quite frankly, it insults many good people at the school, too. It's not as if Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid built a school to their liking and air-dropped it into our neighborhood. I daresay they would not be happy with the number of Christian teachers at this school. Perhaps your argument is that they shouldn't even be teaching there - but while they are, I'm happy to utilize them.

[JenB]

Has a right to dictate? Of course not. Offer their opinion? That must be all right, considering how many unsolicited opinions I heard my parents recieve as I grew up about how they were dooming us to pathetic jobs and no future because we were homeschooled.

I think government school parents should be challenged, because the average parent has not put any thought into where their child is educated. The big yellow bus stops at the bottom of the hill, so that’s where the kid does. It’s easy, it’s popular, it feels good, you can vote for a tax increase every three years and feel like that’s enough.

Like you said, it’s your choice... hope it works well for you. I am sure you’ve weighed the choices and feel the government school is the best option. I am biased as I literally cannot imagine a situation where I’d believe that. I’d send my (not yet existent) kids to one of their grandmothers to be educated before I’d send them to the local P.S. 103. But obviously other people have other priorities; I’m just happy to have married someone with the same world view.