Baptists turn from public schools [NC]

News & Observer ^ | Aug 26, 2007 | Yonat Shimron

[jern]

Convinced that God has been erased from public schools, Southern Baptists are now working to open their own schools, where Jesus is writ large and Bible study is part of the daily curriculum.

Church leaders are not calling for a wholesale exodus from public schools, which would be a monumental hit, considering that Southern Baptists make up the nation's largest Protestant denomination with 16 million members.

Rather, they talk about alternatives to public schools capable of educating a new generation ready and willing to advocate for biblical principles rather than popular culture.

"In the public schools, you don't just have neutrality, you have hostility toward organized religion," said Daniel Akin, president of Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary in Wake Forest. "A lot of parents are fed up."

Southeastern is leading the push, sponsoring a Christian School 101 workshop Monday and Tuesday. The program is designed to train church leaders to open private schools.

At Southeastern and elsewhere, Southern Baptists have become convinced that fighting to change the system is futile. They say public schools have long demonstrated a commitment to teaching evolution over creationism, world faiths over Christianity, sex education over abstinence, moral relativism over Christian claims of truth.

A history of alienation

The denomination's disenchantment with public schools is not new. It dates to the 1920s, when states debated the teaching of creationism vs. evolution. Evolution increasingly won, despite the famous Scopes Monkey Trial in Tennessee, which gave the victory to creationists. The 1962 and 1963 U.S. Supreme Court decisions banning prayer and devotional readings from public schools only increased Southern Baptists' ire.

Since then, alienation with public schools has grown alongside the nation's culture wars, pitting evangelical Christians against secularists.

"Southern Baptists see the new religious establishment in this country as secularism,"

[wintertime]

Wow...amazing you can speak so ill of my children, never having even met them. But it speaks volumes about you.

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In what sentence did I speak ¨ ill¨ of your children?

[beezdotcom]

In what sentence did I speak ¨ ill¨ of your children?

By implication. You imply that they are too emotionally disturbed, too brainwashed and too bereft of a strong Christian walk to either offer or receive any positive benefit from the public school environment.

And, it's pretty clear there's some projection going on, though I can't quite narrow down exactly what it is. However, when you talk about my children in public school, you have pretty much the same air of someone with BDS talking about anything Bush does.

[uptoolate]

And your point is?

[uptoolate]

I don’t know that our views of doctrine of separation from worldliness would correspond.

In what way would they not correspond?

[wintertime]

Huh?

[John Leland 1789]

Wish I could meet some of those “conservative” Sounthern Seminary men just an hour away in So. Indiana.

[beezdotcom]

There should be a society of Christian education that mutually supports and connects homeschoolers, privately educated, and public school educated believers, all.

That may be tough to create, based on some of the responses I read here. I'm gathering that no true Christians could send their child to ANY public school, so obviously you'd have to exclude any who do.

[John Leland 1789]

“I don’t know that our views of doctrine of separation from worldliness would correspond.” — JL 1789

“In what way would they not correspond?” — uptoolate

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It would take a lot of writing here to explain. It would not be useful to go down that road unless I know your bent, frankly. I already use too much time in these matters on this forum. My purpose is not to either start or put out another fire. I only responded to your suggestion that my views are similar to Vottie’s. My easy answer is that they are only partially so, and that there might be some major differences in a couple of important areas. Anything further would need to go to a private message.

[noamnasty]

What I thought . Lot of change from the original teachings .

[achilles2000]

Hey - I was just helping with excuses...

[gondramB]

>>Why should they figure it out or care ? Public schools are getting your tax dollars regardless of what they teach.<<

We do need a solution though. All the good private schools are so full they are turning away good kids. The vast majority of parents are not qualified to home school through high school. We need some way to greatly improve public schools.

[gondramB]

>>I’m gathering that no true Christians could send their child to ANY public school, so obviously you’d have to exclude any who do.<<

I’ve read the bible and I’m pretty darn sure that sending your kids to school does not exclude one from being a Christian.

[N3WBI3]

I would, if I had to, go that route without hesitation. It would be allot easier to correct some doctrinal differences I have with the catholic church at night than to worry about teachers telling my kids not to respect their parents..

[cinives]

The vast majority of parents are not qualified to home school through high school

Sorry, but I don't buy that for a minute. What you really mean is that the ed establishment has brainwashed parents into thinking they can't homeschool their kids. Since anyone with half a brain to ask questions or do research realizes that a high school age kid, besides teaching themselves or learning from mom, dad or a local co-op, can take classes at community colleges, distance learning colleges, high schools via correspondence or online, or by some combination of it all, that argument won't wash. The problem is, everybody tells parents they can't do it and have their kid succeed in life, and they frighten parents into believing it.

I homeschooled my kid from 6th grade thru her graduation from high school this year. She started her first college class today, and she's already received credit for some distribution classes based on her high school work. How did she get thru high school ? Some tutoring from mom, CLEP tests, co-ops, and a lot of self-teaching from college-level textbooks and high quality literature.

You cannot EVER fix public schools because we now have a populace that is completely unable to agree on common principles. Do you think a conservative will stand for liberal indoctrination, or a liberal for having their kids taught the wonder that are the principles underlying America ? How about the centuries old phonics vs whole word reading curriculum argument that is still going on after over a century of convincing research in support of phonics ?

The state has allowed, no encouraged, parents to abdicate their responsibilities in this matter. The only solution I see is to leave parents to the education of their kids. Whether the parents choose private schools or homeschool or some combination thereof, should be left to parents. States and the Fed must get out of the way, and stop taking so much tax money that parents are forced to send their kids to government schools. I realize that ain't gonna happen if left up to the unions and government, but the parents who care and who have any cash left after taxes and basic living expenses will finally be forced to take action. I'd love to know what the parents of Miss South Carolina are thinking about their daughter's education, and the parents of other kids watching that painful performance.

[achilles2000]

“They’ve been turning a blind eye to it for a long time and they’re just now beginning to deal with it?”

Yes. That’s a concise and accurate description of the situation.

[gondramB]

>>The vast majority of parents are not qualified to home school through high school

Sorry, but I don’t buy that for a minute. What you really mean is that the ed establishment has brainwashed parents into thinking they can’t homeschool their kids<<

No it means that I’ve been a department head at a good private school and I don’t think even highly qualified teachers should teach high school outside their field. A good literature teacher is very unlikely to be a good physics teacher. And many good physicists shouldn’t teach physics because they don’t have the special teaching skills.

[achilles2000]

“But there were a lot of members who are public school teachers and they raised such a stink that it never got off the ground.”

This is the reason Baptist pastors and leaders have tried to ignore this issue for so long - the public school tares in the congregations.

[beezdotcom]

I’ve read the bible and I’m pretty darn sure that sending your kids to school does not exclude one from being a Christian.

YOU know that, and _I_ know that...but there are apparently posters who DON'T.

[achilles2000]

“Church of God, take note of what the Baptists are doing.”

In general, Pentecostals are ahead of the Baptists on this issue - way out in front.

[cinives]

She didn’t speak ill of your children; she asked rhetorical questions every parent of any kid in any kind of school should be willing and able to answer about their kid’s education.