Posted on 08/04/2007 2:34:44 PM PDT by mmanager
Mitt Romney engaged in a heated discussion about his Mormon faith with a prominent Des Moines talk show host off the air on Thursday morning. The contentious back-and-forth between Romney and WHO's Jan Mickelson began on the air (video link courtesy Breitbart.tv) when the former governor appeared on the popular program that has become a regular stop for GOP presidential hopefuls. But the conversation spilled over to a commercial break and went on after the program ended, where a visibly annoyed Romney spoke in much greater detail about his church's doctrines than he is comfortable doing so in public.
The footage was captured by the station's in-studio camera and posted on its website. But Romney, who is careful to portray a sunny and upbeat public image, clearly did not know he was being recorded. The candidate reveals a private side that is at turns cutting, combative and sarcastic, but most of all agitated at being forced to defend what he and his church stand for.
(Excerpt) Read more at politico.com ...
Funny I felt the church I use to belong to also deceived me but I did not make it a life mission to box with them
I went on a quest for the truth not to justify my decision for leaving!
Good for you. Obviously you and I have different convictions.
You see, If protestantism is incorrect, I am still saved. If Catholicism is incorrect, I am saved. I am saved because of my relationship with Christ. So I have nothing to lose when you attack my Church.
But if Mormonism is a false doctrine, then you are damned because you put your faith in a Church and in ordinances, oaths, and covenants that bind you to that Church.
That is why I testify that Mormonism is a false belief system that removes you from faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation, when it places your position in the eternities upon what you do - the works, ordinances, covenants and oaths you partake of, and teaches that the LDS Church is the only way for you to advance to an everlasting life in relationship with God the Father and Jesus Christ.
“I’m not voting for Mitt (unless he somehow inexplicably wins the nomination) because, in my view, he’s not conservative enough.”
Well said, and darn close to how I feel, and I, too, am Mormon.
We'll answer the questions, but some don't like the answers, and we don't say what you want to hear.
This is a totally unBiblical false doctrine because the Jews had to fight Philistines and others for their survive.
“Thank you for fulfilling prophesy and proving Joseph Smith to be a true Prophet. Joseph Smith predicted that he would be known for good and evil. I know him for good and you know him for evil.”
I’m sorry Saundra, but a statement like that is the mark of someone truly deluded. It is a statement that cannot be proven false about anyone from Mother Theresa to Adolf Hitler. It is also the mark of a deceiver when they issue statements like that about themselves.
I FastCoyote will have many who will know me as evil (you, Saundra), and many who will know me as good (my family).
Voila, I’m a Prophet giving Revelations! Worship me! ! !
When Jesus was on earth he did not have 30,000 denomintions using his doctrine every which way did he CC?
Gal 1
10 For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.
11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
So I have nothing to lose when you attack my Church.
I am not attacking your Church CC I said if you are such a happy camper why do you keep looking back!
But if Mormonism is a false doctrine, then you are damned because you put your faith in a Church and in ordinances, oaths, and covenants that bind you to that Church.
But you told me you are still connected so I am confused again...
That is why I testify that Mormonism is a false belief system that removes you from faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation, when it places your position in the eternities upon what you do - the works, ordinances, covenants and oaths you partake of, and teaches that the LDS Church is the only way for you to advance to an everlasting life in relationship with God the Father and Jesus Christ.
Correction through Jesus Christ is the only way all will be saved and all will be resurrected and than each will stand before the Judgement bar, to learn where each will be spending their eternity.
I am very aware when I am walking with the Lord and on days I am not as close as I should be!
Some love to preach fear, hell and damnation concepts, which is reserved for the Sons of Perdition (SOP) not the children of God
In case no one told you CC FEAR is NOT of the Lord
John 14:
27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.
When one understands the 3 degrees of glories
Telestial, (Worldly)
Terrestrial, (Garden of Eden) and
Celestial (Eternal Kingdom)
Those who live the commandment of the Lord will know which degree of glory they are living and what they need to do to improve the shining moment.
For those who can hear no more wondering to and fro in the earth
To Whom It May Concern:
Press dispatches having been sent for political purposes, from Salt Lake City, which have been widely published, to the effect that the Utah Commission, in their recent report to the Secretary of the Interior, allege that plural marriages are still being solemnized and that forty or more such marriages have been contracted in Utah since last June or during the past year, also that in public discourses the leaders of the Church have taught, encouraged and urged the continuance of the practice of polygamy—
I, therefore, as President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, do hereby, in the most solemn manner, declare that these charges are false. We are not teaching polygamy or plural marriage, nor permitting any person to enter into its practice, and I deny that either forty or any other number of plural marriages have during that period been solemnized in our Temples or in any other place in the Territory.
One case has been reported, in which the parties allege that the marriage was performed in the Endowment House, in Salt Lake City, in the Spring of 1889, but I have not been able to learn who performed the ceremony; whatever was done in this matter was without my knowledge. In consequence of this alleged occurrence the Endowment House was, by my instructions, taken down without delay.
Inasmuch as laws have been enacted by Congress forbidding plural marriages, which laws have been pronounced constitutional by the court of last resort, I hereby declare my intention to submit to those laws, and to use my influence with the members of the Church over which I preside to have them do likewise.
There is nothing in my teachings to the Church or in those of my associates, during the time specified, which can be reasonably construed to inculcate or encourage polygamy; and when any Elder of the Church has used language which appeared to convey any such teaching, he has been promptly reproved. And I now publicly declare that my advice to the Latter-day Saints is to refrain from contracting any marriage forbidden by the law of the land.
WILFORD WOODRUFF
President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
President Lorenzo Snow offered the following:
“I move that, recognizing Wilford Woodruff as the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and the only man on the earth at the present time who holds the keys of the sealing ordinances, we consider him fully authorized by virtue of his position to issue the Manifesto which has been read in our hearing, and which is dated September 24th, 1890, and that as a Church in General Conference assembled, we accept his declaration concerning plural marriages as authoritative and binding.”
The vote to sustain the foregoing motion was unanimous.
Salt Lake City, Utah, October 6, 1890.
EXCERPTS FROM THREE ADDRESSES BY
PRESIDENT WILFORD WOODRUFF
REGARDING THE MANIFESTO
The Lord will never permit me or any other man who stands as President of this Church to lead you astray. It is not in the programme. It is not in the mind of God. If I were to attempt that, the Lord would remove me out of my place, and so He will any other man who attempts to lead the children of men astray from the oracles of God and from their duty. (Sixty-first Semiannual General Conference of the Church, Monday, October 6, 1890, Salt Lake City, Utah. Reported in Deseret Evening News, October 11, 1890, p. 2.)
It matters not who lives or who dies, or who is called to lead this Church, they have got to lead it by the inspiration of Almighty God. If they do not do it that way, they cannot do it at all. . . .
I have had some revelations of late, and very important ones to me, and I will tell you what the Lord has said to me. Let me bring your minds to what is termed the manifesto. . . .
The Lord has told me to ask the Latter-day Saints a question, and He also told me that if they would listen to what I said to them and answer the question put to them, by the Spirit and power of God, they would all answer alike, and they would all believe alike with regard to this matter.
The question is this: Which is the wisest course for the Latter-day Saints to pursue—to continue to attempt to practice plural marriage, with the laws of the nation against it and the opposition of sixty millions of people, and at the cost of the confiscation and loss of all the Temples, and the stopping of all the ordinances therein, both for the living and the dead, and the imprisonment of the First Presidency and Twelve and the heads of families in the Church, and the confiscation of personal property of the people (all of which of themselves would stop the practice); or, after doing and suffering what we have through our adherence to this principle to cease the practice and submit to the law, and through doing so leave the Prophets, Apostles and fathers at home, so that they can instruct the people and attend to the duties of the Church, and also leave the Temples in the hands of the Saints, so that they can attend to the ordinances of the Gospel, both for the living and the dead?
The Lord showed me by vision and revelation exactly what would take place if we did not stop this practice. If we had not stopped it, you would have had no use for . . . any of the men in this temple at Logan; for all ordinances would be stopped throughout the land of Zion. Confusion would reign throughout Israel, and many men would be made prisoners. This trouble would have come upon the whole Church, and we should have been compelled to stop the practice. Now, the question is, whether it should be stopped in this manner, or in the way the Lord has manifested to us, and leave our Prophets and Apostles and fathers free men, and the temples in the hands of the people, so that the dead may be redeemed. A large number has already been delivered from the prison house in the spirit world by this people, and shall the work go on or stop? This is the question I lay before the Latter-day Saints. You have to judge for yourselves. I want you to answer it for yourselves. I shall not answer it; but I say to you that that is exactly the condition we as a people would have been in had we not taken the course we have.
. . . I saw exactly what would come to pass if there was not something done. I have had this spirit upon me for a long time. But I want to say this: I should have let all the temples go out of our hands; I should have gone to prison myself, and let every other man go there, had not the God of heaven commanded me to do what I did do; and when the hour came that I was commanded to do that, it was all clear to me. I went before the Lord, and I wrote what the Lord told me to write. . . .
I leave this with you, for you to contemplate and consider. The Lord is at work with us. (Cache Stake Conference, Logan, Utah, Sunday, November 1, 1891. Reported in Deseret Weekly, November 14, 1891.)
Now I will tell you what was manifested to me and what the Son of God performed in this thing. . . . All these things would have come to pass, as God Almighty lives, had not that Manifesto been given. Therefore, the Son of God felt disposed to have that thing presented to the Church and to the world for purposes in his own mind. The Lord had decreed the establishment of Zion. He had decreed the finishing of this temple. He had decreed that the salvation of the living and the dead should be given in these valleys of the mountains. And Almighty God decreed that the Devil should not thwart it. If you can understand that, that is a key to it. (From a discourse at the sixth session of the dedication of the Salt Lake Temple, April 1893. Typescript of Dedicatory Services, Archives, Church Historical Department, Salt Lake City, Utah.)
No; it wasn't.
Read the text and see!
The only thing 'reveled' is what would happen to the LDS organization if it's LEADERS had not stopped the 'practice'.
NOWHERE do you find GOD saying...
WHY are they accepted??
WHY are they accepted??
At some point in time between digging up the plates and today, the Temple rites were started.
We merely want to know WHY??
WHERE is the authorization to do them?
WHAT part of your Scriptures lays out the details of the ceremonies?
But you do NOT know from WHERE he got those Temple Rites you guys perform.
You do NOT know WHY you folks do those things.
You do not have a CLUE as to what GOD said to someone(?) to get them started.
Please leave us alone.
If this church is man-made, it will come to naught but if it be of God, you are fighting against God Himself. (paraphrase of Gamaliel)
If they’re not against us, they’re for us. (paraphrase of Jesus Christ our Savior)
Even a stupid fool can appear to be wise if he shuts his trap. (paraphrase from Proverbs)
Let every man be a liar and let God be True. (somewhere in the Bible)
Jesus is my Savior and I am not ashamed of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Amen.
I feel there is no hope for those miners. I've been in mines that use the type of collapsed ceiling method to extract the coal.
It allows the removal of a lot more coal from the seam as the columns used to support the roof are chewed away as the face of the seam retreats.
If that big WHUMP was the ceiling going down - big enough to simulate an earthquake, I'm afraid the supporting columns that they were relying upon failed.
I HOPE that these fellows will have survived somehow, but my gut says they ahve not and their bodies will never be recovered, either - way to much material to be removed.
(Stop in Helper and check out the outdoor mining mueseum.)
I don't think you were; I took it as a heartfelt request for others to pray.
I'm not!
People would rather be ruined by praise; than saved by rebuke!
If he just stays outta that park!
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