The T-1A (pictured below) is a military version of a civil aircraft.
Also, some of the ELINT aircraft have minimal markings. I have seen some E-8s and EC-135s that had a minimum of markings.
Posted on 04/27/2007 8:38:26 PM PDT by Stayfree
I live in Southern California. Over the last twelve years, I have reported to the FAA strange flights of huge cargo planes coming from the south headed toward the dry lake beds in the Mojave desert. The first two flights I saw were private biz jets flying on the east side of slow-moving aircraft headed toward the desert. My assumption was that the biz jets carried drugs from south of the border, scimming the ocean until they got to Catalina Island and then hugged local aircraft over the LA basin until they got to the desert. According to every one of the FAA officials answering my phone calls, none of the flights could have been military. Today, I saw a huge 4-jet-engined cargo plane flying the same pattern only a few thousand feet over our house towards the upper desert. This is a plane that could move 50-75 tons of cocaine into our country. This is the third flight like this in the last year and a half.
The only local aircraft used in fire-fighting are based at the old Norris AFB in San Bernardino. Thay have two of them and they are painted red and white and are 2-engined.
FAA personnel, both men and women were polite, alert and responsive...but, not especially inquisitive...In other words, we didn’t see it, nobody else did, tell us what you can and we will note it our log before we finish our lunch.
BTTT!
I am 100 miles east of Van Nuys airport and none of the aircraft I am talking about were anywhere near a flight path either in or out of Van Nuys.
Thank you for all your suggestions. I just remembered something else. This last plane was bigger, with bigger engine pods. The two before it in the last year or so looked like 747’s because of the hump over the pilot’s area and were a little more greener than this one which was plain gray. I did not call the FAA on the one today, I only asked my wife if she saw it. She didn’t see it because she was inside the house, but she definitely heard it go over our house. She asked me what I was going to do this time, and I said I was going to go on the internet and see what some other like-minded folks might suggest other than just calling the FAA again.
When we live in Torrance before moving to Big Bear Lake, the several instances where I observed biz jets flying on the leeward side of the LAX radar of lumbering old DC3’s or DC6’s, the biz jets had straight wings like Lears, not swept wings.
Okay, that actually helps to narrow the possibilities.
There’s precisely zero chance any of these flights are drug-runners.
And it’s not the government’s responsibility to tell anyone who calls them what flights are military (as these assuredly are) and which are not, particularly if it’s classified operations.
Customs flies several Citations on interdiction duties that sound like what you saw. Up close, they can be distinguished by their somewhat large nose radomes.
I understand that, but most military flights in this area are well above established commercial flight patterns. The planes that I am describing are not in line to fly into or out of any military airbases within several hundred miles of me.
I have seen Citations flying...but these are not.
“And it’s not the government’ responsibility...” Any ATC facility will respond to a question from the public to the best of their ability, UNLESS it’s classified, which few CONUS flights are. As a 35 year ATCS, that’s from the horse’s mouth; (I think that’s the end I’m talkin’ outta).
You described a straight-wing bizjet...that’s what a Citation is.
Only saw today’s plane from below, obviously, but the wing shape was most like the lower picture...thinner than the thicker wing shape above. Sorry for the poor description, but it was very different from the others in recent months. This was much bigger, the engine pods were bigger and it seemed wider.
The older Lears have a sharp nose and the Citation that I saw in Chama, New Mexico flown by Bobby Unser had a more rounded nose.
Due to the prevailing onshore wind, almost all of the airports in the LA basin have landing patterns headed east to west and similar takeoff patterns east to west, including the tiny and dangerous airport in Big Bear. The planes I am talking about have been flying only from the south to the north right over Big Bear and never from north to south. No other planes do this at low altitude, they might at 15,000 ft or more where I do not see them, but not at 8-10,000 ft. where these guys are.
I just remembered something else. This last plane was bigger, with bigger engine pods. The two before it in the last year or so looked like 747’s because of the hump over the pilot’s area and were a little more greener than this one which was plain gray.
March AFB (Reserves)in Riverside has a few C-141B’s that are still in service. They have a bump on the top for the fuel receptical. Many were dark green.
http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?fsID=93
The KC-135 is also based there
http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?fsID=110
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.