Giuliani as the GOP presidential nominee would be a dagger in the heart of the conservative movement

(From a thread) | Credit to Spiff for the chart and flashbunny for the grapics

[Jim Robinson]

Giuliani as the GOP presidential nominee would be a dagger in the heart of the conservative movement (and a knife in the back).

The only difference in a Liberal Rudy Giuliani and Liberal Hillary Clinton is the fact of which bathrooms they select to use and there are some who are willing to even question that.

Giuliani/Clinton/Dem vs. GOP Platform Comparison
Issue	Giuliani	Clinton	Dem Platform	GOP Platform
Abortion on Demand	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Partial Birth Abortion	SupportsOpposed NY ban	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Roe v. Wade	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Taxpayer Funded Abortions	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Embryonic Stem Cell Research	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Federal Marriage Amendment	Opposes	Opposes	Opposes Defined at state level	Supports
Gay Domestic Partnership/ Civil Unions	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Openly Gay Military	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Defense of Marriage Act	Opposes	Opposes	Opposes	Supports
Amnesty for Illegal Aliens	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Special Path to Citizenship for Illegal Aliens	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Tough Penalties for Employers of Illegal Aliens	Opposes	Opposes	Opposes	Supports
Sanctuary Cities/ Ignoring Immigration Law	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Protecting 2nd Amendment	Opposes	Opposes	Opposes Supports bans	Supports
Confiscating Guns	Supports Confiscated as mayor. Even bragged.	Supports	Supports Supports bans	Opposes
'Assault' Weapons Ban	Supports	Supports	Supports
Frivolous Lawsuits Against Gun Makers	Supports Filed One Himself	Supports		Opposes
Gun Registration/Licenses	Supports	Supports		Opposes
War in Afghanistan	Supports	Supports Voted for it	Supports	Supports
War in Iraq	Supports	Supports Voted for it	Supports Weak support	Supports
Patriot Act	Supports	Supports Voted for it 2001 & 2006	Opposes	Supports

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

It’s not idiocy when considering the realities facing us in 08. I am all for dumping Rudy if I had any confidence a true conservative had a shot of wining the States that will need to be won.

Blue state voters are going to vote for the Rat everytime, and conservatives are going to stay home. Rudy probably won't pick up states such as New York, California, or Illinois, especially if Obama is on the ticket. I don't know why this is so hard for you to understand.

[NRA2BFree]

Another great post, Jim!

There's nothing that will trip a politician up faster than to use his own words against him! IMO, it will be the downfall of Rudy.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Rudy is not honest though. This is a guy who said he’ll pay for his daughter to have an abortion, and then later on (a few months ago) saying that he “hates abortion” and wouldn’t pay for it. He spoke at NARAL Pro-Choice, for crying out loud. How can you trust a man who said he “hates abortion” when he spoke to the #1 pro-abortion group in the nation? Though not on the scale of Clinton, Rudy is not honest and trustworthy.

[RWR8189]

That’s all good and fine as we are still in the primary season and debate of this nature is healthy.

But if we end up with a Hillary vs Rudy scenario next year, we cannot afford to have the Democrats take the White House.

If it comes down to it, the battle against Islamofascism is more important than Rudy’s leftist leanings on social issues.

Jim, if it is the case that Rudy gets the GOP nod, I really do hope that you do not allow this site to turn into a platform for Constitution/Libertarian Party nuts that would play the role of spoiler for Hillary. And I hope that you would pledge support for whoever the Republican nominee for President may be.

[familyop]

...agreed!

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Welfare was cut, taxes were cut, unions lost power, property values skyrocketed, crime was cut- These things didn’t happen because Rudy is one of them, but because he is one of us and he is far and away our best chance of winning.

No one's denying the respectable job he did as Mayor and the outstanding job he did immediately after 9/11.

The simple fact is that running America is far different than running Gotham that badly needed Rudy's authoritarianism and aggressive crime control measures and happily tolerated his liberal social views and tabloid-trash personal life.

That's all Rudy is, a big-city Mayor.

[Jim Robinson]

I’m going to fight tooth and nail to block Giuliani from destroying the credibility of the GOP and devastating the conservative movement. Period. Giuliani must NOT become the GOP’s nominee and his shadow must never ever cross the threshold of the White House.

[AZRepublican]

Blue state voters are going to vote for the Rat everytime, and conservatives are going to stay home. Rudy probably won't pick up states such as New York, California, or Illinois, especially if Obama is on the ticket. I don't know why this is so hard for you to understand.

Why is so hard for you to understand under the climate that will prevail in '08 a geniune conservative is not going to prevail against either liberal candidate? Election 2000 was a nail-bitter for Bush, was it not? Ohio is going to be real tough for Republicans this time around. With Rudy he can afford to lose say OH and still win the electro college (polls have him taking NJ and PA from Dems -- so far).

Frankly, I don't see any conservative prevailing in the electro-college that supports the troops and tough on crime and who just might appoint a quality justice. With a lib in the WH neither will be the case.

[Jim Robinson]

You were warned. Buh bye, troll.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

You're pushing the same-old, refuted argument that the Republican candidate must "reach out" to the vast segment of voters who need to have their hands held on the issues, which of course means Republicans have to squander their principles so the MSM won't call them names.

Here's a suggestion: Everytime Republicans openly talk about lower taxes, limited government, protecting our unborn, strong defense, rule of law, and nominating judges who don't legislate from the bench they WIN EVERYTIME. Reagan's two landslides, 1994 Contract with America...even the Democrats won in 2006 because they became more conservative. I'm telling you, those blue state voters are not going to vote for a liberal Republican when they can more from the Rat.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Well, I guess Jim’s shotgun got to you before my reply did ROFL

[RWR8189]

And I’m with you 100% in finding someone other than Rudy to be our nominee.

However there is no usefulness in putting our heads in the sand and pretending there is no chance he will ever get the nomination.

Should he be the nominee, I will support him 100% as well.

The single biggest issue in this world right now is the Global War on Terrorism, and we know he has his head on straight with that issue.

We cannot afford the strategy of defeat and retreat to occupy the White House. We need to have a healthy debate leading up to the primary, and then have unity around whoever the Republican candidate is afterwords. Hopefully it is a consensus candidate like Fred Thompson, but if it is not we must unite to keep someone like Hillary out of the White House.

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

But if we end up with a Hillary vs Rudy scenario next year, we cannot afford to have the Democrats take the White House.

If Rudy gets the nomination, a 3rd party is going to spring up and one of the conservative contenders is going to run on it.

Why do you think states are moving up their primaries to Feb 5, including liberal states like NY and CA? Because they want to exclude more conservative challengers and stack the deck in favor of establishment ones like Rudy, and I predict lots of Democrats are going to crossover and vote for Rudy in the GOP primaries.

[Jim Robinson]

If you campaign against conservatism and for liberalism/socialism you are fighting for the enemy. There is nothing whatsoever that you can say or do that will justify running the abortionist, gay rights supporting, illegal alien loving, gun grabbing liberal Rudy Giuliani for president from the Republican party. Nothing. He’s disqualified for any consideration whatsoever. No thank you. Not on FR.

[Jim Robinson]

Well, then I suggest you double and redouble your efforts to help us ensure that Giuliani does not become the nominee. Because I guarantee you if he does we lose. Period. Giuliani will lose to the Democrats. Probably the only Republican that can.

[RWR8189]

If there is still a perceived horse-race between Hillary/Obama, I don’t believe there will be significant crossover votes in the primary.

It would also be irrational for Democrats to crossover and support the candidate that is probably the most “electable”

Whoever is disgruntled enough by the eventual GOP nominee to vote third party in a swing state should do so knowing they are casting a vote for Hillary. And if they are ok with that, then I suppose we will all suffer the consequences.

[OwenKellogg]

With all your vanities, I’m having a hard time finding the Anna Nicole Smith news. Can you please knock it off?

[OwenKellogg]

Actually, I just reinstated my monthly contribution.

Thanks for zotting the RINOs!

[OwenKellogg]

But I do hope the zottees come back when they realize that conservatism wins.

[RWR8189]

I disagree.

I think that Giuliani could probably win the general election with relative ease. He makes states competitive that a normal Republican would not.

This does not by any means make him the right choice for the GOP nomination.

It is my firm belief that one of four men will be the Republican presidential nominee: Mitt Romney, Fred Thompson, John McCain, or Rudy Giuliani. The guys that occupy the rest of the field are perpetually third tier candidates without any shot of going anywhere.

Of McCain, Romney, and Thompson, we need to figure out which candidate is the right one to carry on the conservative banner, and not splinter votes between themselves.