Is Driving Rinos out of the GOP Good for the Country? Thought-Provoking Must-Read for Rudy-Haters.

FR | April 16, 2002 | Common Tator

[dirtboy]

"Dr. Keyes" is famous only as the political loser who foisted Obama upon the nation.

That's hilarious. The Illinois GOP foisted Obama upon the nation. Their guy was such a loser that they had to ask Keyes to come to Illnois to run some kind of opposition against Obama.

You can't even make a coherent lie.

[nopardons]

You appear to neither know Rudy's nor LIEberman's records.

Your statement is 100% inaccurate, false, erroneous, and specious.

[BigSkyFreeper]

Every "plus" you can list for Rudy yields no distinct advantage over just about any other Republican candidate. And when you turn to the minuses, well . . . . let's just say, charitably, that Rudy is to the left of some Democratic candidates.

I didn't realize Hillary was for the Iraq War or the troop surge, or that she was pro-life, and a staunch defender of the 2nd Amendment. Obama too for that matter.

Why hell, I was thinking it was just the opposite.

I think you have a point. Maybe our conservative agenda is all backwards. Upside down even.

Maybe we should be supporting the Democrats instead. Maybe we were better of with Harriet Miers afterall. Perhaps John Roberts is too far out of the mainstream.

[Howlin]

Try to live in the real world concerning Hunter:

ABC News/Washington Post Poll. Feb. 22-25, 2007. N=1,082 adults nationwide. Fieldwork by TNS. Results below are among leaned Republicans.
					.
"If the 2008 Republican presidential primary or caucus in your state were being held today, and the candidates were [see below], for whom would you vote?" Names rotated
					.
		2/22-25/07	1/16-19/07	12/7-11/06
		%	%	%
	Rudy Giuliani	44	34	34
	John McCain	21	27	26
	Newt Gingrich	15	9	12
	Mitt Romney	4	9	5
	Mike Huckabee	2	1	-
	Tommy Thompson	2	1	2
	Sam Brownback	1	1	1
	Chuck Hagel	1	-	-
	George Pataki	1	2	3
	Ron Paul	1	1	n/a
	Jim Gilmore	-	1	n/a
	Duncan Hunter	-	-	1
	Tom Tancredo	-	1	-
	None of these (vol.)	2	2	6
	Wouldn't vote (vol.)	1	1	-
	Unsure	4	9	9
					.
	Without Gingrich (recalculated, based on second choice of Gingrich voters):
					.
		2/22-25/07
		%
	Rudy Giuliani	53
	John McCain	23
	Mitt Romney	5
	Sam Brownback	2
	Mike Huckabee	2
	Tommy Thompson	2
	Chuck Hagel	1
	George Pataki	1
	Ron Paul	1
	Tom Tancredo	1
	Jim Gilmore	-
	Duncan Hunter	-
	None of these (vol.)	2
	Wouldn't vote (vol.)	1
	Unsure	5

 

Zogby America Poll. Feb. 22-24, 2007. N=397 likely Republican primary voters nationwide. MoE ± 5.0.
					.
"If the Republican primary for president were held today, for whom would you vote: [see below]?"
					.
		2/22-24/07	1/5-9/07	12/6-8/05
		%	%	%
	Rudy Giuliani	29	21	17
	John McCain	20	17	19
	Mitt Romney	9	6	2
	Newt Gingrich	7	8	4
	Condoleezza Rice	7	7	12
	Sam Brownback	4	1	1
	Tom Tancredo	1	n/a	n/a
	Duncan Hunter	1	-	n/a
	Tommy Thompson	-	2	n/a
	Chuck Hagel	-	1	1
	Mike Huckabee	-	1	1
	Someone else	4	5	4
	Unsure	19	23	26
	Jeb Bush	n/a	7	4
	George Pataki	n/a	1	1
	Fred Thompson	n/a	1	1
	Bill Frist	n/a	n/a	3
	George Allen	n/a	n/a	3
	Tim Pawlenty	n/a	n/a	2
	Rick Santorum	n/a	n/a	-
	Haley Barbour	n/a	n/a	-
	Mark Sanford	n/a	n/a	-

[Jim Robinson]

I have shamefully compromised on big government spending and looked the other way on some political issues, but in the matters of life and liberty I am determined to stand fast. I had to compromise to support President Bush's "compassionate conservatism," but thankfully he stands in full support of life and traditional marriage and for the 2nd amendment and for tax cuts. I was mortified when he signed McCain-Feingold and signed on with Kennedy, et al, but stood by him for the long term because of his commitment to God, country and family. Hopefully, it'll be sooner rather than later that his supreme court will overturn the McCain fiasco. Also, I'm hoping the next conservative president will stand for the same American traditional values as did President Bush and that he will be an even better fiscal conservative and will be just as committed to defending the nation, even to the point of actually securing our borders.

[Sunsong]

Brilliant. "Dr. Keyes" is famous only as the political loser who foisted Obama upon the nation. His campaigns are roadmaps on how to alienate the middle.

Repeating the truth. The Alan Keyes conservatives are extremists and will never win anything.

[trisham]

That's not surprising.

[Dolphy]

Let's see if y'all pony up what you've caused to be lost come the next FReepathon.

That should be interesting.

[Sunsong]

Any time now, Keyes will *have* to enter the race to save the GOP, you see?

Yes and EV has already said that he is *saving* the GOP. LOL

[BigSkyFreeper]

Now you say that he is FOR the No Child Left Behind legislation and that it is "good law" wherein the Federal Government DOES get involved in state and local education issues.

Yep. Have you figured out why Ted Kennedy hates it?

[Howlin]

Yes, he will; after his supporters knock off all the competition, you see, he will ride right in with his black felt cowboy hat and save the party from all the unsavory RINOs.

[MadIvan]

Repeating the truth. The Alan Keyes conservatives are extremists and will never win anything.

Dr. Keyes shot his bolt electorally by going to Illinois. The Illinois GOP shot themselves twice over - first by ditching Jack Ryan in a particularly messy way, next, by getting an out of state candidate. This is not just ending one's political career, it's pouring concrete over the tomb.

Dr. Keyes can make a contribution, but it is not through running for office - he was at his best when he was doing his radio programme.

Regards, Ivan

[Howlin]

At the very least.

[trisham]

Try to live in the real world

*************

I guess this is that much touted "civility" to which you Rudy-supporters keep referring. How quaint.

[Howlin]

I am supporting nobody.

But you should try the real world.

[skeeter]

The 'moderates' are a mystery to me... the more they qualify their 'conservatism', the harder comes the winning, and more often the losing. Illogical in the extreme.

Makes me wonder what their real endgame is - its obviously not victory.

[Cold Heat]

Sorry, I cannot agree with you.

OK....I respect that, and i want you to equally respect my position which is based on what i think is the wisdom of history.

We, and I use the collective "we" meaning Republicans, have a long history of growing pains and political mistakes. The other side, the "they", have a equal if not longer saga that we exploit.

The democrats made the very same mistake that we are making now, when we exploited their arrogance and the resulting House Banking Scandal. This caused them to self destruct from within and we took all their territory, as you well know.

But then we became arrogant, and they exploited our error. They now have us on the defensive and we are self destructing from within, just as they did.

They gathered themselves together by simplifying their credo and they launched a political war against bush and everything they chose him to represent.

one of those representations is Social conservatism which they have successfully boxed up nice and neat and labeled dangerous and EVIL.......Just ask the people of Missouri what happened when Rush Limbaugh got into the stem cell debate. What happened in New Mexico as we attacked our own president and shelved the Immigration bill? What happened to Santorum and co. as a result of his stupid attempt to usurp States rights, a direct violation of long held Republican beliefs?

State after State after State held primary elections where the party was infighting, but that was not the problem. the problem was that when the general election was held, the party remained split like rotten log. it did not come back together as it should have, because the issues were not political, they were emotional and divisive.

So now, you give me that same list of issues, and you expect a different result because we were not somehow Conservative enough to win!

I respect your opinions on all of these issues, and I share many of them, but they do not belong in the political debate at election time during the general election. They need to be put aside after the primary and the elections cannot be solely based on this sort of social argument.

Even the immigration debate, having failed to sell it's self as a national security issue, became nothing more that a repeat of the hundred year old divisions regarding immigrants and the populations that they reside in. It was joined by every riff-raff advocacy group from skin heads to Azatlan nut cases, and it destroyed the legitamacy of the debate by connecting us to these groups. You know this because you saw it happen in our Arkansas FReeper group.

Speaking of Arkansas, I know that few people even know what happened here during the election, but it is sufficient to say that this southern state no longer has a viable Republican Party. We lost everything down to the local mayoral elections, and as a republican, I no longer have anyone to vote for. The ballot is likely to remain blank for the foreseeable future.

Please understand that when I see comments that indicate a repeat of the same tactics used in 2006, for the 2008 elections, it gives me much distress and the reality is that we cannot afford to do that again.

Not unless we have a suicidal wish.

There is a better way to handle this, and you need to listen to the moderates who have their hand on the pulse of this seemingly confused country. It is important that we remain in the game. We must, or the they will run amok and uncontrolled again.

[Sunsong]

Dr. Keyes can make a contribution, but it is not through running for office

Keyes is a preacher not a politican. And some of his supporters are wannabe preachers. They have little understanding of politics.

[William Terrell]

You don't just tell the truth twice and shut up. Too many people miss the first and second time.

[Spiff]

Yep. Have you figured out why Ted Kennedy hates it?

No Child Left Behind Ted Kennedy was a major player in the bipartisan team that wrote the controversial No Child Left Behind Act of 2001, which, according to both Kennedy and President Bush, was a compromise. He then worked to get it passed in a Republican controlled Congress, despite the opposition of members from both parties.

Ummm...he doesn't oppose it. He wrote it. Liberal Ted Kennedy stands firmly with liberal Rudy Giuliani on NCLB, support for Roe v. Wade, support for partial birth abortion, support for abortion on demand, support for gun control and confiscation, support for gay marriage, support for an openly gay military, support for amnesty for illegal aliens, etc. etc. etc.