Steve Wilson: Safety Second?

ABC affiliate WXYZ TV (Detroit) ^ | 2/23/07 | Steve Wilson

[mouske]

Steve Wilson: Safety Second? By Steve Wilson February 23, 2007

Watch Steve Wilson’s confrontation with Colonel Crews.

Chief Investigative Reporter Steve Wilson went to the American Growler factory with hidden cameras rolling.

Wilson went to see how their vehicles are produced.

Watch the video for the colonel’s response to the visit.

[mouske]

This investigative reporter compares military vehicles for field soldiers. The successful vehicle is completely open - no doors, roof, or sides and did not meet bid specs. The second vehicle is completely enclosed with armor and meets all bid specs. The successful bidding company is run by retired colonel with contacts at the Pentagon. It seems Congress should be investigating situations like this rather than spending days debating meaningless, non-binding resolutions. If this is true, it is shameful. Reportedly, the successfully bidded vehicles have been in use and still do not meet the bid specs.

This is my first post. I hope that I have provided enough info for viewing the report(s).

[Williams]

No roof, doors, or sides. The succesful bid vehicle was a toboggan??

[bondjamesbond]

Not every military vehicle must be armored. Some roles require a lighter vehicle without armor. We fought WWII with topless jeeps and canvas sided trucks.

A vehicle like the Growler with an armored compartment would be a contradiction in terms.

[YOUGOTIT]

First what were the "Bid Specifications", if one has a federal government contract the company is NOW allowed to change any contract specification unless approved by the agency in charge and the contracting officer in charge of that buy. Further, the procurement officer and the contracts officer have full authority on the contact so I am skeptical of any reporter that knows little or nothing about government contracts and is probably trying to help the terrorist kill Americans.

As I read part of the “Specifications” the American Growler must be small, light weight and able to fit into an Osprey. Because the Osprey has space and weight limits, the vehicles must be less than 5 feet wide, weigh no more than 3,000 pounds and be able to withstand G-forces. At the same time, the weight must be evenly balanced so it won’t alter the aircraft’s balance.

This is more like a WW II and Korea and Vietnam Jeep that the armored vehicles in use.

And as I understand it, it is VERY illegal to take a camera into a factory making defense vehicles or weapons. The reporter should be in jail.

[YOUGOTIT]

The American Growler has no doors or windows and is made that way. Picture at the below web site.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-12-28-corps-jeep_x.htm

[Redbob]

"...if one has a federal government contract the company is NOW allowed to change any contract specification..."

Is this what you intended to say?
It doesn't make any sense.

[Redbob]

"Danielle Brian, executive director of the Project on Government Oversight, a non-profit group that monitors Pentagon contracts, says taxpayers are getting a deal that "stinks" on an unarmored vehicle that makes no sense for today's missions, where troops face ambushes and roadside bombs."

I can see that "Danielle" would prefer to sit in the dubious comfort of an armored vehicle, but not all warfare is conducted that way; sometimes being able to move and react quickly is more important than safety.

[philman_36]

This ought to make you as livid as it did me. VERY ping worthy.

[Citadel84_1]

I was very involved in the testing of this vehicle as a consulting engineer to General Dynamics OTS. This vehicle was NOT the primary reason for this award. The marines were not just buying this vehicle they were buying a weapon system. The Growler vehicle was designed to be a prime mover for a 120mm mortar system. Unfortunately for the other company the mortar that they offered was not and is not nearly as good as the GDOTS system.

[philman_36]

That vehicle shown in the video built by the firm that didn't get the contract looked to fit the bill.
If it were my backside on the line no way in hell would I pick that piece of crap, and I'm being gracious in calling it that, which was chosen!
Which of the two vehicles would YOU want to be in combat in if they both fit the bill?

[philman_36]

That doesn't even look like the vehicle in the video.

[mouske]

As reported on the news program, the mortar is made in France, and I believe the engine was also imported I don't remember exact origin, but it may have been Belgium(?) or Brazil(?).

[mouske]

"...it is VERY illegal to take a camera into a factory making defense vehicles or weapons."

Good point.

[YOUGOTIT]

NOT

[philman_36]

The reporter should be in jail.
So should Sandy the Burglar.

[philman_36]

Which of the two vehicles would YOU want to be in combat in if they both fit the bill?

[YOUGOTIT]

I was in combat with the normal old Jeep and the normal old Huey Chopper and the normal old fatigues and the only armor that I saw was the M 113s not much armor there.

So depending on the mission for the American Growler - which is the transporter for a 120 mm mtr and others it is in a position where it cannot have armor because of the mission and its requirement to be transported by the Osprey, and other choppers.

[philman_36]

Blah, blah, blah!
I asked a simple question...Which of the two vehicles would YOU want to be in combat in if they both fit the bill?
What is so difficult about answering it in a straightforward manner?

[CyberAnt]

"And as I understand it, it is VERY illegal to take a camera into a factory making defense vehicles or weapons. The reporter should be in jail."

That was my first thought too.

And .. as usual .. the "drive-by media" is ready and willing to try to make some conspiracy out of a former military person having "connections" with the Pentagon. To me .. that just seems like a logical connection. What better person to be building vehicles for our military than a former military person.

When will the media ever get a brain!

[Citadel84_1]

The mortar is made in France but the rounds are made here. Believe me you want to be in the ammunition business not the mortar manufacturing business.

This mortar actually has more capability than most howitzers.

The reason the vehicle is so stripped down is the lighter it is the more rounds it can carry.

You put armor on the less rounds you have available. The vehicle is not designed to go into combat with.