We can defeat these countries, burn all the mosques and we'll win.
Posted on 12/06/2006 7:25:53 AM PST by presidio9
Popular consensus has it that we are losing the war in Iraq. Robert Gates, the White House nominee to replace Donald Rumsfeld as Secretary of Defense, stated on Tuesday that the United States was categorically not winning in Iraq. "What we are now doing is not satisfactory," Gates said. Popular consensus also has it that we are losing the war in Afghanistan. "[B]ecause of the Bush administration's inattention and mismanagement," wrote The New York Times editorial board on Tuesday, "even the good war is going wrong."
America has not "won" a major "hot" war since World War II. The Gulf War cannot be considered a full-fledged victory; it returned the situation in the Middle East to the status quo. The aggressor in that war, Saddam Hussein, would remain in power for another dozen years. The Vietnam War was surely a devastating loss. The Korean War ended in stalemate; North Korea, the aggressor in that war, remains militant and dangerous 50 years later.
It has been six decades since we emerged fully victorious from a major "hot" war. This is because the very definition of war has changed. Each modern war is now more of a battle than a war. Tearing out the enemy's motivating ideology by the roots is no longer a nation-centric task. Nazism was located in Germany and Shintoism in Japan. We could defeat both countries and win the war. Fundamentalist Islam, however, spans the globe. Even if we disestablish fundamentalist Islam in Afghanistan and Iraq, we still have not won the war. Afghanistan and Iraq are the equivalents of Okinawa and Utah Beach. Super-national ideologies mean that war is not a local affair, but a global one.
So how do we win a global war? We won the Cold War by waiting out our communist opponents. We could lose the war in Vietnam and still win the broader Cold War. We could stalemate in Korea without losing the fight against communism. Communist ideology was bankrupt, and if we denied them resources (as we did by funding anti-communist forces around the globe and rolling back communism under President Reagan), we would be successful in the long run.
That strategy will not work with fundamentalist Islam. Fundamentalist Islam is not an ideology that will crumble from within. It demands total religious obeisance of its practitioners, regardless of material hardships incurred. And anything but total replacement of fundamentalist Islam by another, friendlier ideology is seen as a victory by the fundamentalists. The Gulf War was not merely a victory squandered; it was a defeat. Denying Iraq oil may have hurt Saddam Hussein, but failing to depose Hussein hurt Western credibility and emboldened Muslims the world over.
Even were fundamentalist Islam internally unsustainable, we could not wait them out. The demographics are not in our favor. As time goes on, there will be more fundamentalist Muslims and fewer liberal Westerners to carry on the fight. Stalemate in Korea and prolonged fighting in Vietnam hurt the cause of communism. Stalemate in Iraq and Afghanistan favors our enemies, who can simply wait (SET ITAL) us (END ITAL) out.
There was one Cold War tactic, however, that remains useful today: suspicion of our enemies. Winning the Cold War relied on anti-infiltration strategy, particularly in Western Europe. Unfortunately, western civilization seems unwilling to acknowledge the growing fifth column in its midst, specifically because recognizing the growing threat would seem "racist." This is a recipe for disaster. If fundamentalist Islam relies on demographics to achieve its ends, ignoring the growing demographic threat in Europe is a crucial error. If fundamentalist Islam relies on proselytizing to spread its views, ignoring that proselytizing in the United States is an unforgivable mistake.
Will America ever win another war? Only if we combine our Cold War vigilance with our World War II ruthlessness. We cannot afford to lose in Iraq and Afghanistan -- and a stalemate is a loss. We cannot ignore demographic trends in the name of multiculturalism -- diversity will only survive in countries that can resist the long-term onslaught of fundamentalist Islam. This will be a long, hard slog, as former Defense Secretary Rumsfeld put it. In today's world, true victory always is.
So, in the name of liberty, you would prevent an American citizens from running for office because of his religion?
I'm sure you see the difficulty.
I can. It's just that what you're asking, is stupid.
read my tag,,,,,maybe that will help! lol
I would submit to you that we would never have elected a Nazi to Congress (or if we did he would have been rejected by the Congress) during WWII. The problem now is that we don't identify our enemy now as we did then. However, our enemy is having no problems identifying us.
"We will not win any other wars because Western civilization has grown fat and developed ADD, and a desire to own stuff,"
Ghengis Khan was unstoppable in his day because his army fought as they lived, spartan and mobile, there was no difference between peace/war.
When his sons/grandsons settled in Russia and stopped their expansion they grew fat and happy in their rendition of palaces and lost the will to fight as Ghengis once did.
A great power like the USA cannot do wholesale death and destruction in response to a terrorist attack...especially one coming from rogue elements and not recognized countries.
And, really...ALL here should know that.
You can be sure that if Iran nukes Israel, Iran will cease to exist as we know it.
I totally reject this 'we will not win' mantra.
We have decimated alQaeda's leadership, with 60-70 percent killed or captured.
We have NOT had any US embassies, military installations, or homeland attacked in almost six years! (except Iraq, of course)
Despite the daily hair-pulling tantrums and doomsday mongers in the Democrap party and mainstream media, the world is in decent shape, with economies on the upsurge.
WHERE IS OUR DEFEAT??
I submit we are winning big time.
There will always be the dissatisfied thirdworld underclass, complainers all. The MSM LOVES to seek them out with the goal of making it look like THEY are reality.
The only reality I recognize is the might and power of the US military, the US economy, and the good heart of the US people.
Please, let's all get out of this defeatist mentality.
I would be happy to see Congress do the right thing and declare war.
We can defeat these countries, burn all the mosques and we'll win.
This is the thinking the terrorists rely on. The Muslim countries have exported their military function to prevent our effective response against them. We struggle with the shadows while they are the ones blocking the light. In the end, all Muslims have the same goal--world domination. Their tactics differ and they may want their particular flavor of Islam but it will be Islam by any means.
You know, I don't even believe that anymore. It is quite possible that even a million casualties on American soil would not sufficiently harden the national will.
In my younger days I used to wonder why Rome fell. How they could have let it happen. Superior force, superior civilization...But force is meaningless without resolve, and civilization is a delicate thing.
And then there's the matter of birth rates and oil wealth. In fact, the only glimmer of hope I have is that something will be found to replace oil, or manufacture it by some wonderful new means. That would take the wind right out of the Islamic sails.
I'm reminded of a passage in a book by novelist Howard Fast..."The Jews, Story of A People."
He wrote, "The iron sword and the horse and chariot were the great equalizers; they catapulted the herdsman into history. Desert-parched, bitter with longing, the foot-bound wanderer of the desert and the badlands was suddenly mobile...On foot they had been helpless; but suddenly they stood in chariots, drove prancing horses, cast iron-shod spears. Now they began to hack and bite at the land which their mythology had assured them was theirs by right of first usage..."
This time, what spurs the barbarian is not a technology, but a fuel. Take away the oil---or its value---and you would take away their motive power. Otherwise they will hack and bite at the land of Israel, and the edges of civilization everywhere.
Here's the deal, though. Suppose an elected Muslim really does try to institute Sharia law -- which would be explicitly unconstitutional. If our nation is unable to reject such moves on that basis alone, then the Constitutional foundations of the nation are rotten anyway.
The words of the Constitution are meaningless without an informed and responsible citizenry are willing to defend and live by the spirit of the Constitution. It all boils down to our real difficulty, which is that we'd rather "be nice" than do what's right.
A Muslim in Congress poses no real risk unless we're already in trouble.
"we're already in trouble"
I think you just won the daily double.....LOL
They tried that in China, with Christianity. It didn't work.
The way to victory is to bring Muslims into modern society ... and to free their women.
Up to the minute the Saddam statute was toppled, or maybe when Bush landed on that carrier, we were fighting a war- and we easily won.
It's not the Democrats' fault and it's not the media's fault.
The war began in March of 2003, a year and a half later Bush won re-election. He had plenty of time.
You want to know what went wrong, read the FR archives. Reread what supporters expected- were certain- would occur next. Preventing Syria and Iran from arming the terrorists for example. Instead Bush held hands with the Saudis.
Bush did nothing to "win". He sent Karen Hughes to convince the Arabs to like us. There was no real aim or purpose. Where battles were fought we din't go for the kill. Abu Ghraib paralyzed the Administration. We put our stock in elections that were premature and meaningless. We supported Israel's withdrawal from Gaza which showed the terrorists that the West capitulates in the face of terror. Rice sent carrots to Iran and admonitions to Israel.
Only when sensing weakness then did the Democrats and the Media go for the kill. And they got their target in November.
The situation in Iraq may not winnable. We have a group of bureaucrats sitting a table dictating the rules of engagement and the rules of war which our troops must follow, or there will be hack to pay. The opposing force has no rules..they do what they please. If you see a mad dog in your front yard as a danger to your children, you kill it. Or do want to talk with it.
I agree with that, but I think we would've fought a tougher (at home and abroad) than we have - IOW much different ROE. Sadr and his group, for example, would have been taken out. Additionally, the Dems, ACLU, UN etc wouldn't have been tolerated when they undermined our troops and foreign and domestic war effort. Also, Airport security etc would not have been frisking Aunt Sadie while letting Abdul pass to avoid 'profiling'.
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