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Why I want the draft(Charlie Rangel)
New York Daily News ^ | November 22nd, 2006 | REP. CHARLES RANGEL

Posted on 11/22/2006 5:27:30 AM PST by kellynla

The question of whether we need a universal military draft will be important as long as this country is placing thousands of young men and women in harm's way in Iraq. As long as Americans are being shipped off to war, then everyone should be vulnerable, not just those who, because of economic circumstances, are attracted by lucrative enlistment bonuses and educational incentives. Even before the first bomb was dropped, before the first American casualty, I have opposed the war in Iraq. I continue to believe that decision-makers would never have supported the invasion if more of them had family members in line for deployment.

Those who do the fighting have no choice; when the flag goes up, they salute and follow orders. So far, more than 2,800 have died and 21,000 have been wounded. They are our unrecognized American heroes.

The great majority of people bearing arms for this country in Iraq are from the poorer communities in our inner cities and rural areas, places where enlistment bonuses are up to $40,000 and thousands in educational benefits are very attractive. For people who have college as an option, those incentives - at the risk to one's life - don't mean a thing.

(Excerpt) Read more at nydailynews.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Government
KEYWORDS: draft
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To: radar101

I knew he was a veteran but does anyone know in what capacity he actually served? Normally, I wouldn't be weary of someone's service but I am of his. Something that always sticks in my mind is that Congressman from Washington state that had said he was a Viet Nam vet, yet it turned out he never left California the whole time. Apparently he was a shrink on base. And that other guy Harkin who said he was an ace fighter pilot when in fact he never flew a plane in a combat mission.


61 posted on 11/22/2006 6:40:33 AM PST by panthermom
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To: steve-b
No. The simple fact is that it is NOT true.

Why not, exactly? I'm not sure what your point about WWI was, other than to point out that once upon a time, upper class types volunteered be officers, in order to send poor grunts charging at entrenched machine guns.

Regardless, America, 2006 is a long, long way from America, 1917. Back then, everyone knew someone affected by the war. Nowadays, outside of more conservative circles, it's pretty rare. For most of my civilian friends, I'm the only one they know that's been to Iraq, and they consider that quite a novelty. Knowing a WWI vet in 1921 wasn't considered novel in any way.

62 posted on 11/22/2006 6:40:41 AM PST by Steel Wolf (As Ibn Warraq said, "There are moderate Muslims but there is no moderate Islam.")
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To: panthermom
Charles Bernard Rangel, (born June 11, 1930 in (Harlem) New York, NY) is an American politician. He has been a Democratic member of the United States House of Representatives since 1971, representing the Fifteenth Congressional District of New York (map) His district was numbered the Eighteenth District from 1971–1973; the Nineteenth District from 1973–1983; and the Sixteenth District from 1983–1993. Rangel's district encompasses Upper Manhattan and includes such neighborhoods as Harlem, Spanish Harlem, Washington Heights, Inwood, and part of the Upper West Side. He was born in New York City and served in the United States Army from 1948 to 1952, earning a Purple Heart and a Bronze Star for his service in the Korean War.
63 posted on 11/22/2006 6:51:39 AM PST by radar101 (LIBERALS = Hypocrisy and Fantasy)
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To: kellynla
“Right now, it’s the skill and passion of our all-volunteer force that gives George Bush the arrogance to challenge our enemies on their soil,” Rep. Rangel said. “With a military full of reluctant conscripts, Bush won’t be so cocky. We’ll be safer because, as we all know, when American troops stay home fewer terrorists are created.”

Brainless and clueless. He wants to start a draft on the premise that this would stop Bush from being "cocky" and fighting our enemies on their soil, leaves us to fight them on our soil. What a pinhead! The last sentence proves that stupid people can be elected to congress!
64 posted on 11/22/2006 6:54:16 AM PST by Edgerunner (Better RED than DEAD)
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To: kellynla
As long as Americans are being shipped off to war, then everyone should be vulnerable, not just those who, because of economic circumstances, are attracted by lucrative enlistment bonuses and educational incentives

His second sentence is the clue you need to decipher where this asshole is coming from. He thinks people shouldn't have to, or have the right to, make decisions based on their own circumstances. He thinks that income inequality is wrong.

And, of course, as is evident further in the article, the man is a racist. Not a reverse racist, not a man that shouts a racial epithet in a moment of anger, not that there's anything right with that; just a virulent racist of the Hitlerian variety.

65 posted on 11/22/2006 6:55:21 AM PST by chesley (Republicans don't deserve to win...But America does not deserve the Dhimmicrats!)
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To: Triggerhippie
We always use the 'bread-based' stuffing... :)

Cornbread stuffing is the only way to go. I've tried them all, and this is my considered opinion. Like with Bill Buckley, that makes it a fact. :)

66 posted on 11/22/2006 6:57:48 AM PST by chesley (Republicans don't deserve to win...But America does not deserve the Dhimmicrats!)
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To: radar101

Yeah well, he's still an @ss. John Kerry had three Purple Hearts, in case you didn't know.


67 posted on 11/22/2006 7:03:09 AM PST by panthermom
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To: steve-b
No. The simple fact is that it is NOT true.

It takes a lot of faith in what you are doing to risk your life. It takes a lot more to risk your kids.

Chairman Mao had a son, Mao Anying. After the onset of the Korea War, Mao's son went to the frontlines with the People's Volunteer Army, where he was killed by a U.S. airstrike. Mao may have been a cynical old bastard, but the loss of your eldest son hurts a proud Chinese leader on many levels.

I somehow don't see President Bush being so ready to "stay the course" or "leave that to the commanders on the ground" if Jenna or Barbra were, say, captains in an MP company. I don't say that to imply President Bush is a bad guy. I met him, briefly, while I was in the Army. He thanked me for my service, and I believe he was 100% genuine about it. It's just not the same. No one in his inner circle, except Ashcroft, I believe, had any direct blood in the fight. You can feel bad about the fears or loss of others, but it'll never really ring home until you risk or lose your own blood.

68 posted on 11/22/2006 7:04:49 AM PST by Steel Wolf (As Ibn Warraq said, "There are moderate Muslims but there is no moderate Islam.")
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To: kellynla

"Those who do the fighting have no choice"

Yes they do they do not have to enlist.


69 posted on 11/22/2006 7:06:55 AM PST by kalee (II have taken the pledge... I will no longer read homeschooling or breastfeeding threads on FR.)
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To: kellynla; All
Good for Charlie Rangel.
He always can be counted on to give me a reminder of why I look down on him as a little scumball and un American douchebag, and less than marginal legislator.

His constituents deserve what they don't pay their fair share for.

He was a Corporal in the USMC in the '50's. Me too.
I know learned early enough not to continually show the world my ass by running my mouth before engaging my brain.
He obviously did not.
70 posted on 11/22/2006 7:07:36 AM PST by Gideon Reader ("The quiet gentleman sitting in the corner sipping Kenya AA and enjoying his Stan Getz CD's".)
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To: kellynla

"Those of us who served want only those who WANT to serve with us."

I agree. What I would like to see is a period of required service to the nation, that everyone would grow up expecting, but which could take other forms than military. I think that a lot of people would want the military option if they had to do some form of service, but currently do not choose any form of service. Whether such people would meet your definition of WANTING to serve with you, I don't know.


71 posted on 11/22/2006 7:08:44 AM PST by Stirner
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To: xjcsa
HE WAS FOR IT BEFORE HE WAS AGAINST IT AND FOR IT.
72 posted on 11/22/2006 7:10:41 AM PST by The PeteMan (Go to H*ll Dan Rather!)
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To: kellynla

Heard something that made me think yesterday. A local conservative talk show host was actually for the draft.

If this passes, there would be a lot of riots in the country at least.


73 posted on 11/22/2006 7:11:22 AM PST by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: kellynla

This idiot keeps stepping into this hole and Republicans are too stupid to exploit it.

We need some geezer with horn rimmed glasses and a herringbone tweed coat in front of a camera, shaking his finger in the air and intoning solemn outrage: "Our children will not be fodder for your foreign adventures sir!"

Narrator:
"Rangel wants control of your kids, but only for a few years. He won't say what he wants it for.."

Then the camera cuts to footage of Kofi Anan saying "...the people of Sudan must understand that violence achieves nothing..."

Then cut to a picture of Huey Long, fade to one showing a breadline, then a picture of Charlie Rangel.
Narrator:
"Maybe Charlie Rangel wants to be the next Huey Long, maybe just knowing he has this control will satisfy him.
Huey Long, the "KingFish"
"Kingfish?" Charlie, you look like a Catfish.
Hmmmmm. The Catfish. "


74 posted on 11/22/2006 7:24:16 AM PST by tsomer
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To: kellynla
Thank you for the idea, Charlie. Here's what I want: A DMZ in Washington DC. That's right. No more military protection of the Capitol Building, the White House, none. Zip Zero Nada. No intercepts in the air, no AA batteries on the ground, no fleets of evac helicopters, no radiation monitors. Nothing. Let Congress remain as defenseless as the rest of us. ONLY THEN WILL THEY TAKE SERIOUSLY THE THREAT AGAINST US.
75 posted on 11/22/2006 7:26:38 AM PST by NonValueAdded (Prayers for our patriot brother, 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub. Brian, we're all pulling for you!)
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To: wita

Excellent post.


76 posted on 11/22/2006 7:28:16 AM PST by beyond the sea ( Now that Pelosi Galore is in charge, it's never too late or early to start drinking.)
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To: Steel Wolf
I'm not sure what your point about WWI was, other than to point out that once upon a time, upper class types volunteered be officers, in order to send poor grunts charging at entrenched machine guns.

Society was more class-centered then, true. However, this isn't all that relevant a distinction -- being an officer in WWI wasn't all that much safer than being a grunt.

77 posted on 11/22/2006 7:35:39 AM PST by steve-b (It's hard to be religious when certain people don't get struck by lightning.)
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To: redgolum
A local conservative talk show host was actually for the draft.

Q: How many legs does a cow have if you call a tail a leg?
A: Four. Calling it something doesn't make it so.

78 posted on 11/22/2006 7:37:06 AM PST by steve-b (It's hard to be religious when certain people don't get struck by lightning.)
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To: kellynla

This idiot keeps stepping into this hole and Republicans are too stupid to exploit it.

We need some geezer with horn rimmed glasses and a herringbone tweed coat in front of a camera, shaking his finger in the air and intoning solemn outrage: "Our children will not be fodder for your foreign adventures sir!"

Narrator:
"Rangel wants control of your kids, but only for a few years. He won't say what he wants it for.."

Then the camera cuts to footage of Kofi Anan saying "...the people of Sudan must understand that violence achieves nothing..."

Then cut to a picture of Huey Long, fade to one showing a breadline, then a picture of Charlie Rangel.
Narrator:
"Maybe Charlie Rangel wants to be the next Huey Long, maybe just knowing he has this control will satisfy him.
Huey Long, the "KingFish"
"Kingfish?" Charlie, you look like a Catfish.
Hmmmmm. The Catfish. "


79 posted on 11/22/2006 7:45:12 AM PST by tsomer
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To: rrebo
"Remember when those protests stopped? They stopped when the lottery was instituted for the draft and most of those protesters found out that they would not be called."Also noted by another posting.

True. I was in my late teens/twenties then. So, when you see those MSM photo's from back in the'60's that say, "Anti-Vietnam War Protest", please remember that much of the participation (potential draftees, girlfriends, parents) was really anti-draft based. Unless the MSM media is controlled or self-controlled, as in WWII, a draft will generate and power an anti-war movement. It is understandably very hard for young men who were scared of dying in the War to admit being scared, or to admit a selfish desire to place their personal time above the country's need. But the MSM will take the most credible reasons for opposing a war and provide all the cover any potential draftee needs to bug out.

IMHO, I think President Bush could have done, and could still do more regarding recruitment if he simply related the burden being carried by those currently in the military and asked Americans to enlist. If the "Go Long" or "Go High" option is chosen in Iraq (as opposed to "Go Home") he should ask Americans to enlist in conjunction with that decision. But, here's the problem: JFKennedy's "Bear any burden, pay any price in the the defense of liberty" words assured potential enlistees (like me) of the nation's COMMITMENT. That their efforts, or death, would not be in vain. Having run from that commitment in Vietnam, a clear commitment by both Democrat and Republican leaders would now be necessary to encourage a large number of enlistments.

I've previously compared this situation to marriage. In both cases, COMMITMENT, is key. Does "for better or for worse, until death do us part" have the same value to a marriage when it comes from the lips of a divorcee?

80 posted on 11/22/2006 7:58:43 AM PST by LZ_Bayonet
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