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Treasures looted by (Ancient) Rome are back in the Holy Land(Jerusalem treasure mystery solved)
Times Online ^ | September 25, 2006 | Dalya Alberge

Posted on 09/26/2006 6:26:26 AM PDT by NYer

A COLLECTION of sacred artefacts looted by the Romans from the Temple of Jerusalem and long suspected of being hidden in the vaults of the Vatican are actually in the Holy Land, according to a British archaeologist.

Sean Kingsley, a specialist in the Holy Land, claims to have discovered what became of the collection, which is widely regarded as the greatest of biblical treasures and includes silver trumpets that would have heralded the Coming of the Messiah.

The trumpets, gold candelabra and the bejewelled Table of the Divine Presence were among pieces shipped to Rome after the looting in AD70 of the Temple, the most sacred building in the ancient Jewish faith.

After a decade of research into previously untapped ancient texts and archaeological sources, Dr Kingsley has reconstructed the treasure’s route for the first time in 2,000 years to provide evidence that it left Rome in the 5th century.

He has discovered that it was taken to Carthage, Constantinople and Algeria before being hidden in the Judaean wilderness, beneath the Monastery of Theodosius.

Dr Kingsley said: “The treasure resonates fiercely across modern politics. Since the mid-1990s, a heated political wrangle has been simmering between the Vatican and Israel, which has accused the papacy of imprisoning the treasure.

“The Temple treasure remains a deadly political tool in the volatile Arab-Israeli conflict centred on the Temple Mount [the site of the Jewish Temple and the Muslim Dome of the Rock].

“The treasure’s final hiding place – in the modern West Bank . . . deep in Hamas territory – will rock world religions.”

Emperor Vespasian ordered the destruction of the Temple at Jerusalem after a Jewish revolt and Roman forces took about 50 tons of gold, silver and precious art to Rome.

The Arch of Titus, built a decade later, depicts Roman soldiers bearing the sacred spoils on their shoulders. The Jews were expelled from Jerusalem and dispersed throughout the world.

Between AD75 and the early 5th century, the treasure was on public display in the Temple of Peace in the Forum, in Rome.

The Vatican has told Dr Kingsley that there is no evidence in its archives that the treasure resided in Rome from the medieval period onwards.

He said: “One thing is for sure – it is not imprisoned deep in Vatican City. I am the first person to prove that the Temple treasures no longer languish in Rome.”

Dr Kingsley’s sources include Josephus, a 1st-century Jewish historian who sometimes exaggerated but is an authority on Roman and Jewish history. Dr Kingsley also found evidence in, among others, the works of Procopius, a court historian of the Emperor Justinian, who died in AD562, and from Theophanes Confessor (c760-817), a Christian monk from Constantinople.

In Chronographia, which spanned AD284 to 813, Theophanes recorded that Gaiseric, king of the Vandals, loaded the treasures that “Titus had brought to Rome after the capture of Jerusalem” on a boat to Carthage in Tunisia in AD455.

In the first holy crusade in AD533, the Byzantine Belisarius seized the treasure from a royal ship fleeing the Algerian harbour of Hippo Regius. It was then shipped to Constantinople, the capital of Byzantium.In the 7th century, Persians sacked Jerusalem, killing thousands of Christians, and dragging the Patriarch, Zacharias, to Persia. Dr Kingsley believes that his replacement, Modestus, spirited away the treasures to their final hiding place in AD614.

Dr Kingsley will reveal his findings in God’s Gold: The Quest for the Lost Temple Treasure of Jerusalem, to be published by John Murray on October 5.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Government; Israel; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: archaeology; archoftitus; biblicalarcheology; catholic; godsgravesglyphs; holyland; israel; jerusalem; letshavejerusalem; orthodox; romanempire; templemount; vatican
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To: Doneel; AppyPappy
"As for your remark about the third temple, it will be built by God after the coming of the Messiah, so it will have God's permanent protection."

You are speaking of the temple mentioned in Ezekiel's prophecies, which comes down from heaven?

There has to be some sort of temple built before then, since there is a false christ that will defile a "holy place" just before the Lord's return.

81 posted on 09/26/2006 4:08:00 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Atheist and Fool are synonyms; Evolution is where fools hide from the sunrise)
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To: Michael Goldsberry
Yes ~ quite ~ now, did they pick that up in the Delta in Classical times, or before then?

I've often thought a member of such a group was among Jesus' following.

82 posted on 09/26/2006 4:09:22 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Zionist Conspirator; Michael Goldsberry
I was trying to point out the irony of a chr*stian accusing Jews of "worshipping the Temple" considering the multiple chr*stian culti of statues, icons, saints, etc.

First off, Catholics do NOT worship statues. These 'images' are no different than the photographs of your wife, husband, children, parents, etc. that you carry in your wallet. They are a constant reminder of the presence of God in our lives.

But, since you raised the topic, you may have forgotten about the many passages where the Lord commands the making of statues. For example: "And you shall make two cherubim of gold [i.e., two gold statues of angels]; of hammered work shall you make them, on the two ends of the mercy seat. Make one cherub on the one end, and one cherub on the other end; of one piece of the mercy seat shall you make the cherubim on its two ends. The cherubim shall spread out their wings above, overshadowing the mercy seat with their wings, their faces one to another; toward the mercy seat shall the faces of the cherubim be" (Ex. 25:18–20).

David gave Solomon the plan "for the altar of incense made of refined gold, and its weight; also his plan for the golden chariot of the cherubim that spread their wings and covered the ark of the covenant of the Lord. All this he made clear by the writing of the hand of the Lord concerning it all, all the work to be done according to the plan" (1 Chr. 28:18–19). David’s plan for the temple, which the biblical author tells us was "by the writing of the hand of the Lord concerning it all," included statues of angels.

Similarly Ezekiel 41:17–18 describes graven (carved) images in the idealized temple he was shown in a vision, for he writes, "On the walls round about in the inner room and [on] the nave were carved likenesses of cherubim."

In fact, during a plague of serpents sent to punish the Israelites during the exodus, God told Moses to "make [a statue of] a fiery serpent, and set it on a pole; and every one who is bitten, when he sees it shall live. So Moses made a bronze serpent, and set it on a pole; and if a serpent bit any man, he would look at the bronze serpent and live" (Num. 21:8–9).

One had to look at the bronze statue of the serpent to be healed, which shows that statues could be used ritually, not merely as religious decorations.

Catholics use statues, paintings, and other artistic devices to recall the person or thing depicted. Just as it helps to remember one’s mother by looking at her photograph, so it helps to recall the example of the saints by looking at pictures of them. Catholics also use statues as teaching tools. In the early Church they were especially useful for the instruction of the illiterate. Many Protestants have pictures of Jesus and other Bible pictures in Sunday school for teaching children. Catholics also use statues to commemorate certain people and events, much as Protestant churches have three-dimensional nativity scenes at Christmas.

If one measured Protestants by the same rule, then by using these "graven" images, they would be practicing the "idolatry" of which they accuse Catholics. But there’s no idolatry going on in these situations. God forbids the worship of images as gods, but he doesn’t ban the making of images. If he had, religious movies, videos, photographs, paintings, and all similar things would be banned. But, as the case of the bronze serpent shows, God does not even forbid the ritual use of religious images.

It is when people begin to adore a statue as a god that the Lord becomes angry. Thus when people did start to worship the bronze serpent as a snake-god (whom they named "Nehushtan"), the righteous king Hezekiah had it destroyed (2 Kgs. 18:4).

83 posted on 09/26/2006 4:17:16 PM PDT by NYer ("That which is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. That is the whole Torah." Hillel)
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To: muawiyah
did they pick that up in the Delta in Classical times, or before then?

Now we enter the apocrypha, strange ideas indeed.

Long before. Enoch/Thoth

I've often thought a member of such a group was among Jesus' following.

Fascinating. Who?

84 posted on 09/26/2006 4:23:05 PM PDT by Michael Goldsberry (Lt. Bruce C. Fryar USN 01-02-70 Laos)
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To: NYer; Zionist Conspirator

Thank you, NYer! This is exactly the answer I had hoped for!


85 posted on 09/26/2006 4:24:43 PM PDT by Michael Goldsberry (Lt. Bruce C. Fryar USN 01-02-70 Laos)
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To: Michael Goldsberry
Not sure, but the the guys who wrote down that Jesus said this:

"Matthew 16:19 (Whole Chapter) "I will give you [Is 22:22; Rev 1:18; 3:7] the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and [Matt 18:18; John 20:23] whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven."

may have had a special agenda in that regard.

86 posted on 09/26/2006 4:35:50 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

Ah, I must disagree.

The Egyptians believed that knowing a god's proper name - and being able to pronounce it correctly - enabled them to control and use said god's powers.

The Scripture you point to documents a gift from God to man, not man's demand of God.


87 posted on 09/26/2006 4:44:12 PM PDT by Michael Goldsberry (Lt. Bruce C. Fryar USN 01-02-70 Laos)
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To: Michael Goldsberry
Hmmm ~ that's no doubt an agenda driven answer.
88 posted on 09/26/2006 4:53:44 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Lewite

:) Gotcha.


89 posted on 09/26/2006 4:57:24 PM PDT by madison10
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To: muawiyah
that's no doubt an agenda driven answer.

*Snicker*

Yes, I want you to blow yourself up for Allah.

;)

90 posted on 09/26/2006 4:58:20 PM PDT by Michael Goldsberry (Lt. Bruce C. Fryar USN 01-02-70 Laos)
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To: NYer; Yehuda; SJackson

Candelabra?

The candles that luminated the Ark? That had the golden bowls?


91 posted on 09/26/2006 5:21:45 PM PDT by RaceBannon (Innocent until proven guilty: The Pendleton 8)
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To: Michael Goldsberry

It's always something.


92 posted on 09/26/2006 5:26:09 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

LOL!

Take care.


93 posted on 09/26/2006 5:27:12 PM PDT by Michael Goldsberry (Lt. Bruce C. Fryar USN 01-02-70 Laos)
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To: NYer

Whatever happened to the guy who was supposed to dig up the Ark in Israel this year?


94 posted on 09/26/2006 5:43:59 PM PDT by Some Fat Guy in L.A.
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To: muawiyah

again huh?

You sound quite leftist when you describe as "binding" the simple act of respect and reverence Jews accord the Almighty by refusing to pronounce God's real name. If such a benign rule appears so onerous to you, how do you function with other issues of traditional respect conservatives cherish?

The origins of the respect and deference we are instructed to accord God's name are in the Old Testament a text which Christians as well as Jews revere. [Deut. 28:58; Leviticus 19:12; Exodus 20:7; Nehemiah 9:5; Malachi 3:20 to name a few]

..................

Parshat Ha'Azinu includes the verse: "When I say God's Name, it should be with greatness." The commentators explain this to mean when we say God's Name, we must concentrate on the great significance of who God is - that He encompasses all of past, present and future.

http://www.aish.com/torahportion/TorahBytes/Pronouncing_the_Name.asp

In Judaism, the name of God is more than a distinguishing title. It represents the Jewish conception of the divine nature, and of the relation of God to the Jewish people. In awe at the sacredness of the names of God, and as a means of showing respect and reverence for them, the scribes of sacred texts took pause before copying them, and used terms of reverence so as to keep the true name of God concealed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_God_in_Judaism


95 posted on 09/26/2006 6:52:55 PM PDT by dervish (Rachel weeps for her children, she refuses to be consoled. Shalit, Goldwasser, Regev)
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To: dervish

You are talking about something entirely different.


96 posted on 09/26/2006 7:02:28 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

"You are talking about something entirely different."


Something so sacred you can't even name it in your post?


97 posted on 09/26/2006 7:14:21 PM PDT by dervish (Rachel weeps for her children, she refuses to be consoled. Shalit, Goldwasser, Regev)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

"The "new testament," of course, has about as much credibility as the koran." Zionist Conspirator

Care to enlighten folks on what you mean by that statement?


98 posted on 09/26/2006 7:16:54 PM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (Never bring a knife to a gun fight, or a Democrat to do serious work...)
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To: Ancesthntr

...the possession of property known to have been stolen from another is, well, stealing.

Almost.

Property taken by conquest or derring-do is called Booty or Loot or Plunder or Spoil, and there's not a darn' thing wrong with that.

For example, most of the treasures of the Tabernacle (including the Ark of the Covenant) were made of goods "borrowed" by the Children of Israel from the Egyptians, on a rather permanent basis. (cf Exodus 12:35-36)


99 posted on 09/26/2006 8:10:07 PM PDT by DieHard the Hunter (I am the Chieftain of my Clan. I bow to nobody. Get out of my way.)
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To: HereInTheHeartland; Zionist Conspirator

>> "The "new testament," of course, has about as much credibility as the koran." Zionist Conspirator

> Care to enlighten folks on what you mean by that statement?



I suspect Zionist Conspirator was just trying to be provocative, build credibility and/or give unnecessary offense.

A great way to make friends and influence people, if you ask me /sarc...


100 posted on 09/26/2006 8:39:11 PM PDT by DieHard the Hunter (I am the Chieftain of my Clan. I bow to nobody. Get out of my way.)
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