Posted on 09/10/2006 5:38:02 AM PDT by voletti
At the moment, what passes for genetic engineering is mere pottering. It means moving genes one at a time from species to species so that bacteria can produce human proteins that are useful as drugs, and crops can produce bacterial proteins that are useful as insecticides. True engineering would involve more radical redesigns. But the Carlson curve (Dr Carlson disavows the name, but that may not stop it from sticking) is making that possible.
In the short run such engineering means assembling genes from different organisms to create new metabolic pathways or even new organisms. In the long run it might involve re-writing the genetic code altogether, to create things that are beyond the range of existing biology. These are enterprises far more worthy of the name of genetic engineering than today's tinkering. But since that name is taken, the field's pioneers have had to come up with a new one. They have dubbed their fledgling discipline “synthetic biology”. Truly intelligent design
One of synthetic biology's most radical spirits is Drew Endy. Dr Endy, who works at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, came to the subject from engineering, not biology. As an engineer, he can recognise a kludge when he sees one. And life, in his opinion, is a kludge.
(Excerpt) Read more at economist.com ...
BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA!
The Mandelbrot Set is infinitely complex and shows both explicit order (in the form of infinitely repeated structures) and implicit order (it is a map of all possible Julia Sets, each of which is possesses a high degree of symmetry or antisymmetry). It is generated from a single, simple rule, and as its structure depends only on the properties of complex numbers, it does not even presuppose the existence of any particular universe.
If you're going to insist that even math itself is "designed", then I aver that your theology has evaporated into the meaningless aether.
Don't just limit yourself to biology and biochemistry :)
Turtles all the way up as well as down?
[Give me one example where order and complexity are known to arise from a non intelligent cause]
Water condenses from clouds turning to snow on its way to the ground and the water molecules organize themselves into the complex structures of ice crystals, which seem simple enough from some vantage points but which are far more complex than can be readily comprehended from others. Yet definite patterns are present and are even predictable to a certain extent. Such "phase transitions", where order and layers of complexity are created from simplicity and randomness, are incredibly common in nature.
It's plausible that God intervenes in this process to purposefully guide every intricate detail of snowflake production to His exact tastes, but to accept that idea violates the scientific principle of parsimony, though not the religious principle of faith.
You pinging me?
You mean mocking the participants and balrog making such cute new names for God? You evo-obsession is nothing less than a cult--harassing a thread that was harmless to you at its start. It was on that same thread you mentioned "Scr*w her" to me--and you or I could provide the link if necessary.
The headline said "prayer requests" and your friends couldn't respect that--they took it as an invitation for an evo-rave. And I didn't arrive until well after your buddies started getting suspended.
Literate. scoff-- Fanatic is more like it.
Your illiteracy is showing.
Not to be confused with Brown.
Here you are, pinging me, when you could be in the cozy little Dingbat Central den, congratulating one another on your...scientific and mathematical literacy. What compels you to FR--except that it is a reliable source of conservative Christians? You need them.
Not the good ones. :)
Like Chicken Man, I'm everywhere.
The world around us is filled with a plethora of cases where order and complexity are known to arise from intelligence, either directly or indirectly.
And it's also filled with a plethora of cases where order and complexity are known to arise from natural processes. So your decision to just flat-out declare that therefore anything/everything you might care to ponder about must therefore have been made via the application of intelligence instead of natural processes is, to say the least, wildly presumptuous.
Shall I repeat the question so that you can actually answer it this time?
There are cases where the best that could be said is that no one knows for sure.
No, there are cases where we know for a fact that natural processes can and have produced order and complexity. See various prior posts on this thread if you're still unclear on the concept and/or want to keep pretending that no one has offered you specific examples.
But it is not reasonable to decide with no basis for that decision, that there is no intelligence behind order and complexity. There's simply no precedent for it.
See above. Are you being dense, or just intellectually dishonest now?
Now that you're done dancing back and forth and making entirely circular arguments, would you like to answer the question now, or simply retract your unsupportable claim?
Wow, are *you* confused... First of all, many of US are conservative Christians ourselves. Second, you really need to get over your persecution complex. Third, you obsess over us to a great degree, while for the most part we don't even think of you at all unless you're in our face screaming at us, which admittedly happens rather often.
Really, get over yourself.
Ich--VR pinged me, not the other way around. You posted to me, not the other way around. Get over yourselves. Or try harder to enjoy one another's company.
Stop carrying the flames and resentments from one thread to the next!
And that can't be explained by degradation from the design because..................?
And that can't be explained by degradation from the design because..................?
...because no one who has actually looked at the genome could make such an elementary mistake.
...because you've been screaming in our faces and calling us all sorts of names for several days now. Was that so hard to figure out? How many examples would you like me to post reminding you of your behavior, if you're unable to recall it yourself for some strange reason? Stop being a confrontational, insulting, namecalling harpy and we'll be more than glad to forget all about you. Somehow, though, I doubt that's what you really want, since so much you do seems to be a bid for attention.
And no, this isn't carrying flames from one thread to the next, it's an attempt to *resolve* a longstanding source of flames, namely Mamzelle's habitually troublemaking behavior and desire to constantly go on the offensive.
Get over yourselves.
You are, yet again, projecting.
Or try harder to enjoy one another's company.
We enjoy each other's company just fine. I just wish I could enjoy yours, but you make that impossible.
Learn to behave in a decent manner, please.
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