Posted on 08/31/2006 11:20:47 AM PDT by zook
Re Fascism [Cliff May]
Michael, I just went a few rounds with Pat Buchanan on MSNBC on the legitimacy of the term “Islamo-Fascism.”
Pat’s argument was that the term was inappropriate because then the movement Mussolini led would have to be called “Christo-Fascism.”
Besides, he said, the term is offensive to Muslims.
These struck me as very strange perspectives, for rather obvious reasons. If folks disagree, I – or better you – can offer a rebuttal.
Hitler was "Christo-Facism." He manipulated all kinds of religious symbols, put clerics on the podium when he spoke, exaggerated the Jewish guilt in the death of Jesus.
The difference is that most Christians rejected his rant and went to war against him.
When the Muslims go to war against their facists, that will be the day they earn the respect they demand.
Who cares what it's called? The meme of Islam needs to be eradicated. Totally.
I'll take "All of the above" for $1,000, Alec.
--There can be no doubt that Pat Buchanan is either an utter imbecile, a devout Bush hater, a fascist himself, or all three. Everything he says or writes must be viewed through that prism.--
I disagree - Buchanan is right on about immigration and the Mexicanization of the US.
Like Bob Novak, he's an Arabist (since Arabs oppose Jews) when he's not bemoaning the perceived diminution of the white race.
"Pat’s argument was that the term was inappropriate because then the movement Mussolini led would have to be called “Christo-Fascism.”"
BS. The term "Islamo-fascism" defines the Islamic form of fascism they try to pass off as religon. Musolini did NONE of that.
Well I'm offended they want to kill us
Pat's got a soft spot for Islam, mostly because he shares Islam's desire for the eradication of "the Jews."
Buchanan is right on about immigration and the Mexicanization of the US.
but that is all he is right about, and I am suspicious of his motives.
Pat B is a nut job
No need for Islamo- or Christo- appellations.
The term is offensive to Muslims? Do I cuffing CARE if Muslims are offended by some of their number being called Islamo-facists? Why don't the non-fascists among the Islamic community gang up and call out their fascist brethren? Boot them right out of the mosque?
For one very good reason - the same one that prevented the "good" German people from throwing Adolf Hitler and the Nazis out of office in 1936. They were scared stiff of the consequences if they were less than successful.
After occupying the Rhineland, the Nazis were so emboldened, that it would have been impossible to effectively mount a resistance within the country without appealing to foreign countries.
As to the charges that he is a racist, fascist and anti-semite he has made statements that allow people to say these things about him, repeatedly. It seems to be an "edge" he is comfortable standing on. I would not dismiss those characterizations out of hand.
As to the charge he is a "Bush Hater" , yes, he is. Although he did support Bush in '04 against Kerry in looking at the big picture he challenged GHWB ('41) for the nomination as a sitting president, and many claim his weakening of Bush through the primariy season was a contributing factor to Bush's loss.
Pat seems, like many on the left, to dislike the class that Bush comes from. But his hatred isn't really the "entitled WASP prick" stuff you see on left web sites. Pat has clearly articulted his differences with the Bush family view of Conservatism.
They are globalists, he is a nationalist. They favor free trade, he favors mercantilism. They support defacto open borders, he favors strong immigration laws tightly enforced. They support strenghtening international institutions like the UN, he favors abandoning them. They are "neo", Pat is "paleo". They favor a muscular interventionist foreign policy, America as police-man of the world. He favors an isolationist policy.
The difference is obvious. Christianity does not officially sanction, by its doctrine subjugation and oppression of other religions, killing them, intolerance, subjugation of women, violence as a means to world domination and to heaven for its martyrs. Islam does. Islamists tell you so regularly. Read the Koran and listen to the Imams and Mullahs. If tyranny and subjugation are fascist, then so is Islam.
That's a pretty tall order. Any suggestions on how to accomplish it?
I don't disagree. It takes quite a bit of verbal wizardry to get Christianity to support facism and tyranny. It's been done, but it's hard.
Less so for Islam.
All we have to do is compromise with the Muslims. After all they are peace-loving just like us. All we have to do is give in on a few points and we would have peace. NO BIG DEAL !
First, since muslims believe homosexuality is a crime, all we have to do is agree with them and make homosexuality a crime, punishable by death. NO BIG DEAL,right? Secondly, muslims believe and insist that women are third class citizens, who should be subjugated and treated as chattel. So we just do as they say, don't let women vote anymore, don't let them go to school, kill them if they are not virgins before marriage, promote female clitoral castration to reduce the sex drive, and deny them divorce and property rights. Its what Allah commands. NO BIG DEAL, RIGHT?. Thirdly, let them annihilate the jews. Its only a tiny country anyways, and then we would have peace. ITS NO BIG DEAL, Right????? So all you Jews, Gays and Females, think about it. Its your reward, and its NO BIG DEAL !!!!!
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