Can a good Muslim be a good American?

A friend who knows | 8/11/2006 | Agent Smith

[Agent Smith]

I ask my fellow freepers indulgence for this vanity, because I believe it is too important to be buried in the back of the forum.

Can a good Muslim be a good American? I sent that question to a friend who worked in Saudi Arabia for 20 years.

The following is his reply:

Theologically - no. Because his allegiance is to Allah, the moon god of Arabia.

Religiously - no. Because no other religion is accepted by his Allah except Islam (Quran, 2:256)

Scripturally - no. Because his allegiance is to the five pillars of Islam and the Quran (Koran).

Geographically - no. Because his allegiance is to Mecca, to which he turns in prayer five times a day.

Socially - no. Because his allegiance to Islam forbids him to make friends with Christians or Jews.

Politically - no. Because he must submit to the mullah (spiritual leaders), who teach annihilation of Israel and Destruction of America, the great Satan.

Domestically - no. Because he is instructed to marry four women and beat and scourge his wife when she disobeys him (Quran 4:34).

Intellectually - no. Because he cannot accept the American Constitution since it is based on Biblical principles and he believes the Bible to be corrupt.

Philosophically - no. Because Islam, Muhammad, and the Quran do not allow freedom of religion and expression. Democracy and Islam cannot co-exist. Every Muslim government is either dictatorial or autocratic.

Spiritually - no. Because when we declare "one nation under God," the Christian's God is loving and kind, while Allah is NEVER referred to as heavenly father, nor is he ever called love in The Quran's 99 excellent names.

Therefore after much study and deliberation...perhaps we should be very suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country. They obviously cannot be both "good" Muslims and good Americans. Call it what you wish...it's still the truth. The more who understand this, the better it will be for our country and our future. The war is bigger than most Americans know or understand.

[EdReform]

Let them renounce islam and pledge their allegiance to the United States of America.

[Aquinasfan]

Anyone who is slavish to their God, mullah or priest is not to be confused with the vast majority of Christians, Jews, Muslims, Shintoists, Budhists who are more socially advanced and open their hearts and minds to reason and dignity.

This "principle" doesn't apply equally to these religions. An "extremist" Christian, like Mother Theresa, is objectively superior to a lukewarm Christian. An extremist Mohammedan (like Bin Laden) is objectively inferior to a lukewarm Mohammedan.

In fact, a lukewarm Christian really isn't a Christian (Rev 3:15-16), since he places the god of comfort and convenience above Christ (Phillipians 3:19) as his last end, similarly with lukewarm Mohammedans.

[Abd al-Rahiim]

I'm going to have to disagree with a number of points.

I'm not Muslim, but I hate it when people bash the religion and make statements which are simply not true.

1. Allah is not “the moon god of Arabia.” God is an English word. Do you think it exists in all languages? Of course not. So, Allah is Arabic for God. In Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, there is only one God. Adherents of these three religions all believe in the same God. The major difference is that neither Jews nor Muslims believes in the Trinity.
2. It’s interesting that you selected that verse to claim that Islam does not tolerate other religions. In fact, this verse is often cited to demonstrate that Islam is respectful of other religions! Actually, you should cite 5:73 if you seek to show that Islam does not view Christianity in a positive light.
3. The Five Pillars were most likely derived from scripture, but they are a practice. The only scripture Muslims hold as fully accurate is The Qur’an.
4. The only religious allegiance Muslims have is to God. This doesn’t mean that they can not be proud citizens, though.
5. There are verses supporting and refuting this in The Qur’an.
6. Which Muslims must submit to mullahs? Mullah is Persian; it is not Arabic. Thus, only Shi’a Muslims in Iran would listen to the violent teachings in question.
7. That verse does not instruct Muslims to marry four women. I don’t know where you got that from.
8. I wonder how many American Muslims exist. It is true that Muslims believe The Bible is corrupt, but that does NOT mean they can not accept the Constitution.
9. Democracy and Islam can coexist. Türkiye Cumhuriyeti is a secular republic, but most of its citizens are Muslim.
10. A Muslim believes in the same one God you do. And, Al-Wadud means “The Loving, the Kind One.”

[Coldwater Creek]

Exactly!!!!!

[highball]

I guess that you didn't read my ultimate goal for all, including the Muslims.

We know all too much about your "ultimate goal," thank you very much.

[kellynla]

Seems to me there are only three options:

Conversion
Deportation
Internment


you forgot one, DEAD!

[Old Student]

"God is First. Always."

Maybe it helps to belong to a church that says the U.S. Constitution was inspired by God. I don't believe in the U.s. Congress, but I do believe, very strongly, in the Constitution.

[ClearBlueSky]

Thank you!
Ever notice how the defenders of Islam TODAY have to go waaaaay back for comparisons to other religions?
In the 12th century EVERYONE was more barbaric than today. All religions can point to shame in their history.
ONLY ISLAM is still there. Now-today- in the news. FROM THEIR CLERICS AND PULPITS.
Sure, there are violent people of other religions, but they are ABERRATIONS and act against the theology of their religion. Every Muslim terrrorist acts in accordance with Islams holy word.
Try as they might-unless they are willing to revise the Koran to a kinder,gentler version-every murder and atrocity committed by a Muslim in the name of Islam IS,IS,IS sanctioned and ordered by Islam.

[sinkspur]

Enoch Powell was right. Opening the borders of Christendom to the flotsam and jetsam of the Third World was a huge mistake that will end in rivers of blood.

What kind of "Christianity" does Powell, and you, believe in? Sounds rather Pharasaical to me.

[Ace of Spades]

"I guess that you do not believe in the death penalty??????"

You have to be kidding me. What are the majority of Muslim citizens guilty of? What crime?

Is this what being Christian means to you?

[kabar]

U.S. Marine Corps Establishes First Islamic Prayer Center

[Coldwater Creek]

I believe if you will check my first post on this thread was for internment.

At least I haven't resorted ti name calling of my fellow Freepers.

[durasell]

I gotta tell you, I understand your desire for a quick and definitive outcome, but it ain't gonna happen. Muslims are a significant part of the world's population.

So, here's a Winston Churchill quote:

“You can always count on Americans to do the right thing - after they've tried everything else.” Winston Churchill

Note: Churchill's mom, of course, was a Brooklyn chick, and they're tough cookies.

[kabar]

Religious fanaticism is not confined to just Muslims.

[Leftism is Mentally Deranged]

Send them to a country where their throat-slitting murderous beliefs are "respected".

[Coldwater Creek]

My guess is that you are a Muslim Hmmmmm?

[highball]

I guess that you do not believe in the death penalty??????

Non sequitur.

Throwing them all "into the gas chambers and ovens", as you suggested, has nothing to do with the death penalty.

Taking away a person's freedom solely because of their religion has nothing to do with the death penalty.

I am for the death penalty, but the problem with your philosophy is that a person must be convicted of a crime before they are eligible. To suggest that we execute Muslims just for being Muslims is obscene.

[farmer18th]

In the 12th century EVERYONE

Right, and the other point is that violence can never be removed from its context. If a Catholic priest has a Spanish, Christian soldier execute an Aztec priest, who refuses to stop butchering his victims, I don't really lose much sleep over that as a Christian. The fact is that institutional Christianity is far more peaceful, historically, than any religion the world has ever known.

[kellynla]

"Stick them in interment camps on a permanent basis?"
"permanent basis?"
do you mean ad infinitum?
are you gonna pick up the tab?

[sinkspur]

The Muslims are freeloaders on the liberty my ancestors bought at great cost in blood and treasure.

Why would a Muslim join the military when he knows he's going to run into attitudes such as are expressed on this thread?