Libertarian ping.To be added or removed from my ping list freepmail me or post a message here
Posted on 03/17/2006 9:13:20 PM PST by Jeremydmccann
While the Patriot Act and National Security Agency wiretapping have received enormous attention and criticism from the mainstream media, another federal agency has been quietly gathering far more personal information about U.S. residents than those laws ever can. And this unreported project affects thousands more people.
Our inquisitive federal government has been demanding that selected U.S. residents answer 73 nosy questions. They are threatened with a fine of $5,000 for failure to respond.
When I first heard about this from a reader in Lake Geneva, Wis., I thought it might be a joke or an anomaly. But when another in Ishpeming on Michigan's Upper Peninsula received the same questionnaire, I realized something is going on nationwide.
These nosy questionnaires come under the friendly name "American Community Survey." But this is not a Gallup or a Harris poll; the interrogator is the U.S. government and has the power to compel and computerize your responses. The U.S. Constitution authorizes the government to take an "enumeration" every 10th year in order to reapportion the seats in the U.S. House of Representatives to accord with the "respective numbers" of each state's population. The Constitution thus authorizes a count of people; it doesn't authorize the government to find out with whom you share your bed and board. Beginning in 1960, the 10-year census-taking significantly changed. The government began sending a long form with many questions to a limited number of people, randomly selected, and a short form with only six questions to all remaining U.S. residents.
The government is jumping the gun on the 2010 census, and without public announcement is already sending out an extremely long form, starting with a few thousand mailings each month to a handful of residents in widely scattered small towns that don't generate national media. Recipients can't find neighbors who received the same mailing, so it's difficult to avoid the impression that the project was planned to avoid publicity and citizen opposition.
The person filling out the new long form is labeled "Person 1." That person is required by law to list the name of every other person in the household, giving his or her birth date, sex, race, marital status and relationship. Other people can be husband, daughter, grandson, in-law, etc. Others can also be "unmarried partner" (defined as a person "who shares a close personal relationship with Person 1") or "roommate (someone sharing the house/apartment but who is not romantically involved with Person 1").
Person 1 must answer 25 questions about his residence and the size of the property. What kind of a home, apartment or condo do you live in, when was it built, when did you move in, are you operating a business in your home, how many rooms and how many bedrooms do you have, what kind of bathroom and kitchen fixtures do you have, and what is the market price of your residence?
The survey asks how much you pay each month for electricity, gas, water, rent, real estate taxes, fire or flood insurance, plus six very specific questions about your first and second monthly mortgage payments. There are questions about your telephone and automobile, and about how many months of the year you and others occupy the residence.
The survey then gets really personal, seeking the answers to 42 questions about you and about every other person who resides in your household. Person 1 is used like a private investigator to extract the information from everybody else, and warned that if anyone doesn't want to answer your nosy questions, you must provide the name and telephone number of such person so Big Brother can follow up.
The information demanded for you and every other person includes very specific questions about what kind of school you and each other one attended and to what grade level, what is each person's "ancestry or ethnic origin" (no matter if your ancestors came here hundreds of years ago), what language you speak at home, how well you speak English, where you lived one year ago, what are specific physical, mental or emotional health conditions, and whether you have given birth during the past year.
More questions demand that you tell the government exactly where you are employed, what transportation you use to get to work, how many people ride in the vehicle with you, how many minutes it takes you to get to work, whether you have been laid off or absent from your job or business, how many weeks you worked during the last year, what kind of a job you have (for-profit company, not-for-profit company, government, self-employed), what kind of business it is, exactly what kind of work you did, what was your last year's wage or salary, and what was your other income from any other source.
The Census Bureau warns: "We may combine your answers with information that you gave to other agencies." (Does that mean IRS? Social Security? New hires directory? Child support enforcement? Criminal databases? Commercial databases?)
The questionnaire promises that it will take only 38 minutes to answer these questions. Of course, that estimate fails to include the hours it takes to collect the required information from so many different sources.
The government has been asking similar questions on the census for decades, it's not a new thing.In 1850 they started to enumerate members of the household individually instead of just head of household and age groups. Employment status, type of employment, medical questions, age at marriage, number of kids, year of immigration,parents birthplace, primary language, race, education, ownership of home, etc. I use the census for genealogy purposes, and am grateful for the insight it has given me into the lives of my ancestors. I have been able to use the census to find family graves, and reconnect with living family members. What I really get a little peeved at is when the questions were pretty obviously not answered by the family, likely a neighbor, who "guesstimated" the answers. 1900 is my favorite census, I get a birth month with that one. Of course, I have some ancestors who shared the sentiments of many on this thread, didn't trust the census enumerators or government, so would tend to disappear on census. Or lie. Which has caused me a lot of genealogy hair-pulling. Just thought to put a different perspective on all those snoopy questions.
At the school my children went I marked other for race and put human in the line.
beeeeeutiful !
Never fear! All we have to do is get Republicans, the party of limited governor and self-empowerment, in control of the White House, Senate and House of Representatives, then all will be well! Err...wait
We did the same thing..never heard anything. My guess is that a publicity firestorm would ensue if the the information gathering aspect of the census were enforced.
I got the ACS, and didn't fill it out. They sent someone out to bug me for about 2 months. They kept calling and threatened me with the fines. I told them to go piss off. They did nothing, that was over a year and half ago.
Libertarian ping.To be added or removed from my ping list freepmail me or post a message here
I got one of those once and threw it away. They sent me several letters saying I needed to fill it out. I threw them away.
Finally they started calling. I ignored their calls until I picked up the phone without letting the answering machine screen the call because I was expecting a call from a friend and they were on the line.
The woman said I needed to send in my survey. I told her I had no intention of sending it. She asked me to talk to the supervisor. I told the supervisor that I don't answer surveys. She said; "But this is for the government." I told her I didn't care who it was for, I didn't answer surveys. After about 5 min she said OK but because it was computerized I’d keep getting forms for a few months.
They sent out a few more letters and I never heard from them again.
In 2000 I got a long form and only answered how many people were in the family. For a few months people came knocking on the door at different hours now and then and I never answered it if I looked out and didn't know the person. That harassment stopped after a time and I have yet to fill out a more than the number of people in my family.
Yes, this is the "tip of the iceberg". There is a large array of surveys that has been growing in number and complexity for many decades (i.e., it didn't start with Bush, or Clinton, or any of the latest bugaboos of one or the other of the "big tent" parties).
http://www.census.gov/econ/overview/FORMSNDX.HTM
http://ask.census.gov/cgi-bin/askcensus.cfg/php/enduser/std_alp.php?p_lva=&p_li=&p_page=1&p_new_search=1&p_search_text=Household%20surveys
In some ways, the surveys are LESS intrusive now than they have been in the past. For example, until the 1930's, there was a decennial census of religion.
http://www.thearda.com/Archive/ChMember.asp
http://www.thearda.com/Archive/Files/Descriptions/1936CENSCT.asp
Whereas now, such collection, at least on a "mandatory" basis, is deemed illegal:
Information on religion
Question
Information on religion
Answer
The U.S. Census Bureau does not collect data on religious affiliation in its demographic surveys or decennial census. Public Law 94-521 prohibits us from asking a question on religious affiliation on a mandatory basis; in some person or household surveys, however, the U.S. Census Bureau may collect information about religious practices, on a voluntary basis. Therefore, the U.S. Census Bureau is not the source for information on religion, nor is the Census Bureau the source for information on religious affiliation. Some statistics on religion can be found in the Statistical Abstract of the United States, Section 1, Population. In addition, we do provide a list of contacts for further assistance regarding religious information.
We do publish economic data on Religious Organizations down to the county and ZIP Code level in the County Business Patterns series. Religious organizations are comprised of (1) establishments primarily engaged in operating religious organizations, such as churches, religious temples, and monasteries and/or (2) establishments primarily engaged in administering an organized religion or promoting religious activities. Additionally, the County Business Patterns series provides data on used merchandise stores that are operated by religious organizations.
http://ask.census.gov/cgi-bin/askcensus.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=29&p_created=1074732806&p_sid=HFhBzM2i&p_lva=&p_sp=cF9zcmNoPTEmcF9zb3J0X2J5PSZwX2dyaWRzb3J0PSZwX3Jvd19jbnQ9MTE2JnBfcHJvZHM9JnBfY2F0cz0mcF9wdj0mcF9jdj0mcF9wYWdlPTEmcF9zZWFyY2hfdGV4dD1Ib3VzZWhvbGQgc3VydmV5cw**&p_li=&p_topview=1
I got the long form and didn't send it in too. When they came to my house to ask about it, I looked them in the eye, and said, "Two." When she asked what I meant by that, I said, "The Constitution requires me to tell you 'two' and nothing more. That's how many people live here."
They are threatened with a fine of $5,000 for failure to respond.
It's $500 and never, ever enforced.
starting with a few thousand mailings each month to a handful of residents in widely scattered small towns that don't generate national media.
It's being done in the entire country including cities and suburbs. It's not targeted at "widely scattered small towns."
it's difficult to avoid the impression that the project was planned to avoid publicity and citizen opposition.
ROFL...the reason there hasn't been any publicity is there's no budget for the usual sorts of TV advertisements you see prior to a decennial census, not some evil plot to avoid publicity.
The Census Bureau warns: "We may combine your answers with information that you gave to other agencies." (Does that mean IRS? Social Security? New hires directory? Child support enforcement? Criminal databases? Commercial databases?)
I'm a bit dubious of this and I have no idea where this info is supposedly from. And INDVIDUAL data on people from the Census is COMPLETELY unavaliable to ANY other government agency. Including the FBI (they've tried a couple times and been shot down in the courts) and the IRS. You could send in the form with your name being Osama Bin Laden and occupation as Professional Terrorist and nothing would happen to you.
What IS avaliable is stuff like the AVERAGE income in a town or the AVERAGE time to drive to work, etc.
There's no contracted company. It's all Census. They have a call center in Indiana that's Census operated.
Yep, actually the questions on the long form (the ACS is REPLACING the long form, nobody will get those in 2010) have been REDUCED.
Since this silly crap started I have been pinged twice. I did not answer the nosey buggers and have never heard anything more from them. Perhaps the hungry cougar, rattle snakes and 18 pit bulls in the drive have something to do with that.
Eh, they're not paid that much themselves, I'm sure.
I wish Republicans were in charge. This would stop!
From the 1860:
The Census of 1860:
Schedule 1. Free Inhabitants in _________, in the County of ________, State of _________, enumerated by me, on the _____ day of ___________, 1860. ___________________, Ass’t. Marshal.
1. Dwelling houses and number in order of visitation.
2. Families numbered in the order of visitation.
3. The name of every person whose usual place of abode on the 1st day of June, 1860, was in this family.
Description:
4. Age.
5. Sex.
6. Color – White, black, or mulatto.
7. Profession, occupation, or trade of each person, male or female, over 15 years of age.
Value of real estate owned:
8. Value of real estate.
9. Value of personal estate.
10. Place of birth, naming the state, territory, or country.
11. Married within the year.
12. Attended school within the year.
13. Persons over 20 years of age who can not read and write.
14. Whether deaf and dumb, blind, insane, idiotic, pauper or convict.
Schedule 2. Slave Inhabitants in _________, in the County of ________, State of _________, enumerated by me, on the _____ day of ___________, 1860. ___________________, Ass’t. Marshal.
1. Names of slave owners.
2. Number of slaves.
Description:
3. Age.
4. Sex.
5. Color.
6. Fugitives from the state.
7. Number manumitted.
8. Deaf and dumb, blind, insane, or idiotic.
9. Number of slave houses.
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