Fact check: Are American cars really that bad?

CNNMoney ^ | January 26, 2006 | Peter Valdes-Dapena

[Dan Nunn]

With all the bad news coming out of Detroit these days, many have a disarmingly simple suggestion: Ford and General Motors should simply build better cars.

"I read that Ford plans to cut about 30 000 jobs in North America alone," one CNNMoney.com reader wrote. "How about building better cars instead?'

How about that?

A perception of poor quality certainly isn't the only reason Ford and GM cars can have trouble in today's market. But it's a factor.

We looked at J.D. Power and Associates Long-term Dependability Surveys to get a sense of where American cars rank in terms of reliability and how much they've improved. That survey measures the number of problems vehicle owners have after 3 years of ownership.

We also checked with Consumer Reports to see what they thought about GM and Ford's performance in terms of reliability.

The answer is that, overall, GM and Ford cars are not that bad. In fact, depending on which survey you believe, they may even have become pretty good.

The problem is that "pretty good" has become "not quite good enough" in a world where quality standards have been raised so high and which many consumers still have bad memories of General Motors and Ford cars that have failed them in the past.

[esoxmagnum]

And my wife reminded me, after buying their "bumper to bumper" warranty, everything that goes wrong becomes an "adjustment". Our electric window motor went out once, and that was an "adjustment", our in board computer that showed speed and stuff went out, and that was an "adjustment".

Ford is a sham company, or at least the dealers are here in Chicago land.

I say good riddance to 'em. They have bilked too many good people out of their money.

[weave09]

1995 Honda Accord owner here.

210,000 miles and counting and has never has been in the shop for anything other than oil changes, brakes and the like.

[TChris]

IMO, JD Power & Assoc. ratings aren't worth the paper they're printed on. There's no differentiation in the severity of flaws. A transmission that explodes and falls out on the freeway is ranked the same as a broken volume knob on the stereo. A defect is a defect is a defect.

If all defects are equal, the rating is absolutely meaningless.

[hdstmf]

Too much.

[rarestia]

The new Challenger:

YUM!

Posted from: http://www.allpar.com/cars/dodge/challenger.html

[eraser2005]

They were generally very reliable. Not much on them to go wrong, as they were basic transportation. In fact, towards the end of the Escort run, Popular Mechanics (back with their old-style car reviews) had it listed as more reliable than a Camry (97% to 92%, I believe, though I could be wrong).

[bk1000]

"The Japanese brands didn't build their reputation for refined, high-quality cars overnight, nor did the big 3 make their reputation for building crap overnight."

The Japanese cars first came here during the Carter days as a market for fuel-efficient cars grew. Detroit's answer: the Ford Mustang II and the Chrysler K. There was also all this new anti-pollution noise, and rather than start over with a fresh new perspective, we got chopped up, pollution controlled weanie engines that were an embarrassment after the glory days of the '60s muscle cars. American automobile crap was born and they still haven't figured it out.

I can almost always tell an American made car simply by the tactile feel of the materials. The hardness of plastics, texture of foams, the feel of a switch when it clicks, etc. American cars today MAY be as reliable as their Asian competitors, but they still FEEL cheap, and thereby overpriced and undesirable. There's that perception thing. They seem to be aware of it, which is what's most puzzling. When they asked: "Have you driven a Ford LATELY?", they were implying that they knew of people's perceptions and things had changed.
Things haven't changed that much though, IMHO. Again, they aren't all bad, just different in a bad way.

[gogeo]

Finally, the media then starts asking people if American cars are all that bad. They are shocked that the PERCEPTION of quality is poor, even though the truth is that there is little difference between American and Japanese quality.

Perception is a lagging indicator.

[eraser2005]

Well, I'll try to pay attention what rpm I'm running on the way home from work, though with a different powertrain, it might not be that relevant. I'll admit, I'm light on the gas, but I still keep with the flow of traffic.... but in the city I rarely break 2000 rpm unless it needs to downshift to get up a hill...

[eraser2005]

It took them awhile, but there was a silent recall program out on the 3.8L engine for its headgaskets.

Actually, it took the threat of a lawsuit, just like Toyota is now facing with Camry and Avalon strut mounts and recently faced with engine sludge, and like what Honda faced with Accord trannys....

[CodeToad]

How about the fact that the lower new car prices have caused used car prices to tumble such that trade-in values are too low. People are upside down on their trade-ins to the point that they cannot afford to buy a new car.

[dhuffman@awod.com]

2K3 VW Jetta TDI 45 - 55 mpg. Stealerships' no-service departments suck VWoA.

[Eva]

I heard on the radio, last summer that Mercedes, BMW (it could have been Audi, or both) and Land Rover topped the list of used cars NOT to buy.

[alarmguy]

I love my 2003 Mercury Marauder.

[aimhigh]

When they asked: "Have you driven a Ford LATELY?", they were implying that they knew of people's perceptions and things had changed.

I've owned a Ford recently, and won't go back or look back. I now own two Japanese cars that are years ahead of US cars.

[-YYZ-]

It can be a real conundrum.

I had a '96 Nissan Sentra. Good basic transportation, pretty reliable and fuel efficient. It did eat 2 alternators over the course of 270,000 km, though. Anyway, when it was in for bodywork (due to an accident that was not my fault, btw), they gave me a 2000 Chevy Cavalier to use. Compared to my car it was buzzier and the overall fit, finish and materials inside looked pretty cheezy, even compared to my stripped-down Sentra. OTOH, it drove better on the highway, having better directional stability and resistance to cross winds. The brakes were crap, though, as per usual for a Cavalier.

[383rr]

I have a jeep wrangler, 209,000, 12 yars old... still trucking, Also a 1986 jeep J10 truck with a ba-zillion miles.... I have yet to see a toy-ota do any better than my jeeps. Maintenance is the key for any of this stuff. By the way, I've been a auto tech for 17 years. I have seen numerous nightmares with foriegn cars. All manufacturers have made a lemon or two.

[auggy]

I have a '04 Camry. It hurts my back when I ride in it, and I don't really see the quality over a GM car. American cars are not lacking in quality.

I'll never buy another Jap car.

[discostu]

there's still obvious physical design flaws in so many American cars that makes them look lower quality. Here's an example, had to drive a Dodge Neon recently and it had lights in the rearview mirror, fairly common design feature these days. Except the way they implemented it for the Neon was stupid, first the lights were actually IN the mirror as opposed to in the mirror mounting area so the lights iluminated the top of the dashboard rather than an area the passengers might actually need it (like your lap to look at a map), then they put the buttons in this stupid place where you'll probably put your thumb to adjust the mirror, then they made the mirror one that glues onto the window rather than suspending from the ceiling so there was this ugly cord dangling from the roof to the mirror to give the lights power. A stupid ugly useless design. Then you get other little things like only the front windows being power the rears were hand cranked, and having the old fashioned forward and backward button for the power windows rather than the newer kid safer up and down buttons, and the fact that the automatic transmission had a longer shift lag than most first time stick drivers. Sure the car might have run forever but two minutes of comparing it to a Sentra or Corolla would show that it was a lower quality car.

[thebaron512]

My buddy has a 57' Chevy Wagon 210 four-door that is for sale that needs to be restored, but does run....