Posted on 11/06/2005 12:38:04 PM PST by NYer
I'm glad you didn't aim that at me because I do not need proof.
Paul McCartney's dead?!?!?
I think the walrus killed him.
It really doesn't matter what you believe or how liberated you are in your thinking....one day every knee will bow (including yours). Either we're right and you're on your way to a fire that eternally burns --- or we're wrong, in which case we'll all sleep with the worms. If I were a betting man, with those odds.......
"Seems to me that if the DNA matches the house of Levi ... Jesus was not born to that house."
Even more confusingly, there's more than one Levite line. A small number of Ashkenazic male Levites (myself included) are a direct descendent of Khazarian converts about a millenia ago. Google for R1a haplotype
"It really doesn't matter what you believe or how liberated you are in your thinking....one day every knee will bow (including yours). Either we're right and you're on your way to a fire that eternally burns --- or we're wrong, in which case we'll all sleep with the worms. If I were a betting man, with those odds......."
Oh it's not that simple. What if you're both wrong and the Calvinists are right, and God only predestines salvation for some? Or maybe the Jehovahs Witnesses are right, and we're all burning in hell... except for 144000 of them? What if you're both wrong, and Jesus is not the Hebrew Messiah? What if you're right but the penalty for being wrong isn't burning in eternal hell-fire? After all, that doesn't sound like a loving God, to me!
"There are many known scorches on the Shroud from the fire in 1532. Scorched linen will fluoresce, and as expected, the scorched images (on the shroud) do show fluorescence, but it's not a product of heated linen in the image the way a scorch would be. I believe there is ample scientific evidence to support that."
Schwortz now owns and operates an active Web site on the shroud, www.shroud.com. He said he believes the shroud is most likely authentic, but moving from skeptical science to active advocacy of that position took him about 18 years of study.
"I became an advocate based on direct involvement and personal examination of the cloth. I expected to see the brush strokes (that many have speculated were used to paint the image) and come home. But there is no paint. This is not a painting. Then it became a question of what is it."
For him, science became advocacy "when the weight of all the science together leads in one direction. I believe that's the case with the exception of the radiocarbon dating."
Skeptics take note.
According to several scholarly papers and a book by author Ian Wilson called "The Blood and the Shroud," the particles of dirt on the Shroud of Turin provided a close chemical match to the samples Nitowski took from the tombs. At the time, Kohlbeck acknowledged that his work was not proof that the shroud was in Jerusalem and that there might be other places in the world where aragonite has the identical chemical composition.
Interesting.
The clone would be nothing more than a twin, right? He would not necessarily have a divine nature.
The blood type also matches the Eucharistic miracle of Lanciano. So there's more than one source of Jesus' blood.
AND the Crown of Thorns in Paris, AND the Miraculous cardiac tissue in Naples, AND...all AB-.
Does the fact that scientists cannot duplicate the image or explain its genesis count for anything? At the very least, the argument for the Shroud's supernatural origin is highly probable.
But, see, they hadn't been added yet. That's what the women were going to do on Easter morning when they met the angel and Christ was already risen and gone.
For the last time, "The walrus was Paul"! ;-)
God is just. He provides hell for those who choose it.
I don't understand why it's so hard to accept that this could be Christ's burial shroud. We have articles of history much older than this linen. It's amazing how religion can spark such a response of doubt and second-guessing.
I can tell from several posts in this thread that for some people, Jesus is a joke. That is why we are told "...not to worship... idols, or images...." Relics and artifacts may be "holy" to some, but also are objects of derision for others.
My personal faith in Jesus as my savior would not be changed one bit if they prove or disprove the shroud. I remember reading about some lady in Hiroshima who had the pattern of her silk dress transferred to her skin after the atomic bomb blast, so I see how a burst of energy could imprint some image on a cloth, but if not, so what?
Scientists say yes, scientists say no. The fact is, NO scientist can describe with absolute certainty any unique past event without corroboration from a verifiable, independent observer.
Time will tell. "For now we see through a glass darkly, but then face to face."
Thanks for the ping. I believe it's Jesus and proof comes as science evolves.
Bumpus ad summum
Yes, darkly. Where the veil was rent in the mind and shut it off from perceiving 'face to face'.
But soon the veil will be lifted.
To that time.
( :}
INTREP
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