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1 posted on 10/11/2005 8:53:49 AM PDT by Kitten Festival
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To: Kitten Festival

A weak article. Constitutionalism is not an ideology, it is a process first. A liberal can be a constitutionalist.


2 posted on 10/11/2005 8:59:00 AM PDT by FastCoyote
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To: Kitten Festival
It's not a good omen when conservatives like this author start talking about the need for "flexibility", especially as regards the Constitution.
3 posted on 10/11/2005 8:59:20 AM PDT by inquest (FTAA delenda est)
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To: Kitten Festival

I could not disagree more.

Social conservatives are put out front during elections but relegated to the back of the bus when it comes time to govern. We have been told 'the time is not quite right but just wait.'

We have watched as Kennedy, Souter, Breyer and Ginsburg have been appointed. We are just tired of waiting.

Social conservatives will not let Republicans treat them the way Democrats treat blacks. If Republicans can't EVER deliver, we will find somewhere else to go (or just stay home like we did in 1996).


4 posted on 10/11/2005 9:05:23 AM PDT by NeilGus
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To: Kitten Festival
On the one hand, the author says the liberals are too steadfast in their beliefs and then criticizes the conservatives for having diverse opinions on the Meirs selection for SCOTUS. I'm not sure what he is getting at.
5 posted on 10/11/2005 9:05:47 AM PDT by Old Seadog (Birthdays start out being fun. But too many of them will kill you..)
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To: Kitten Festival
Executive Summary:

Good points: The reaction to Miers has been unduly venemous in tone.

Bad Points: Anyone who does not support the Miers nomination is an close-minded, elitist who opposes the nomination only because Bush didn't do it their way. Principled opposition to the Miers nomination is impossible and any opposition makes you similar to a Marxist ideologue.

My Conclusion: This article proves that both sides in the Miers debate have been unduly venemous. The author does not, however, understand or care that his contribution to the venom is as rich as the opposition's.

7 posted on 10/11/2005 9:07:38 AM PDT by ModelBreaker
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To: Kitten Festival

great post. it is time for some people on the right to look at issues like Social Security reform, the history of GWB with other judges, his stand for the unborn and remember that he got re-elected because he put up a fight. This article addresses many of those points and one judge does not "the court make."


12 posted on 10/11/2005 9:32:20 AM PDT by q_an_a
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To: Kitten Festival
You know, this guy doesn't get much of this argument.

I'm not "against" Miers. I don't care that she's a woman, when a man might have been nominated. I don't care that she never attended the most exclusive colleges or law schools. I don't care that she's never been a judge. I don't care that she's spent her adult life in private practice, other than a very short stint on the Dallas City Council. She has similar credentials to thousands of other lawyers which might also have been nominated, and I wouldn't automatically disqualify them, either, or be troubled by the nominee, per se.

The President can nominate whomever he wants - this is one of his major prerogatives of office. And so he did. What troubles me about this nomination (but Miers is NOT the source of what troubles me) is the fight Bush ducked.

We could be stuffing the Democrats/Liberals further into the box they are in now. We could have nominated probably 25 different people, some currently judges, some women, some women and minorities, some of the finest hearts and minds in the conservative thought, and let the Dims implode and explode over it. We could force the RINO's to come to the table. We could force the Senate to end their silly and unconstitutional filibusters over these fine nominees. We could halt "Borking" in it's tracks, once and for all.

And if the first one nominated somehow couldn't get approved, send them a second one just like the first, or even farther on the right, if possible. Do it over and over, until you get the fifth or eighth nominee seated. Who cares how long it takes, or how many nominees you go through? Every one of them makes the Libs and the RINO's look less powerful, and illustrates over and over what obstructionists they all are.

Bush ducked this entire fight. "He's weak at the polls now." "He needs to spend his political capital on something else." I don't buy any of it.

Who knows what kind of judge Miers might be? Only three or four people even THINK they know, and they might all be wrong. But I'm not upset that she's the nominee, it's the fact that this was one of the best opportunities in several decades for conservatives, and Bush ducked it.

13 posted on 10/11/2005 9:33:24 AM PDT by willgolfforfood
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To: Kitten Festival
[ Apart from these axioms, everything else was open to debate. Until today, there has never been an orthodox party line in conservatism. ]

Conservative is a nebulous term..

15 posted on 10/11/2005 9:50:06 AM PDT by hosepipe (This Propaganda has been edited to include not a small amount of Hyperbole..)
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To: Kitten Festival
Thanks in large part to its Marxist roots, the Left has been a slave to ideological thinking. Major questions of goals, values, and policy are taken as settled.

It's nearly all as a result of Marxist political practice, or perhaps more properly Leninist. It isn't so much the policies themselves but the right of an elitist party cadre to dictate them that has so enervated the Left.

That said, I do not see this as a growing phenomenon on the Right at the moment - surely most of the controversy is due to Bush's departure from what might be considered a conservative policy package with the nomination of someone who does not openly espouse it. I think the controversy is a healthy sign, actually. The shrillness and vituperation it has taken on isn't, necessarily. That is a characteristic of Leftist "debate" that both they and we could do without.

16 posted on 10/11/2005 10:11:54 AM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: Kitten Festival
conservatism has never been an ideological movement, in the sense of possessing an overarching system of thought demanding acceptance in toto. American conservatism is based on principle, firmly-grounded, straightforward concepts: that men are lower than angels, that governs best which governs least, and that innovations must be examined under the presumption of error. Apart from these axioms, everything else was open to debate.

That's it? Conservatism had no other components but small government, no cultural beliefs, for example?

The consequent flexibility and dynamism have been a major factor in the conservative resurgence.

What resurgence? Flexibility means caving to liberal ideas. They had neither the power nor the will to resist being forced to be "flexible", bragging about this flexibility is making a virtue out of necessity, declaring victory and getting out.

Operating from principle rather than within a structured system has enabled conservatives to remain open to consensus, to drop outmoded concepts, to react quickly to opportunities and crises. It has given us the ability to maneuver.

The ability to maneuver, there's a motto to die for, eh?

This ability in turn has taken us from the Goldwater era, when conservatism was the punchline of a joke, to a new millennium where the problem is managing an empire.

!!!

Compare this to the Left, which has steadily lost ground during the same period.

No, the Democrats have lost ground, not leftism. Here is the whole problem with this guy, he can't distinguish between the social, historical and political movement of a society on the whole and mere partisan politics. What he is preaching is Republican-Partyism not conservatism, the doctrine that the be all and end all measurement of success is determined on election night no matter how that success is achieved. This is a common problem among conservatives that is caused by powerlessness, the inability to compete against the cultural establishment which leads to saving face by declaring defeats to be victory.

Which brings us to the current uproar, and the question of why a large segment of the conservative elite is treating Harriet Miers, and beyond her the President of the United States, with the same disdain the ACLU treated Hentoff.

I'm surprised he couldn't work Hitler in there. Miers may make a good justice, who knows, the real gist of this problem is that the Republicans, who have controlled both Houses of Congress for years now (it's a resurgence, you know) feel it necessary to nominate an unknown stealth candidate out of fear of their opponents.

The danger is that conservatism the Republican Party could go the same way, losing its current dominance due to obsessions that have no meaning for the average voter.

True enough, as corrected, but they could also lose their current dominance by being so flexible that they are shapeless and lose the enthusiasm of their core supporters.

18 posted on 10/11/2005 10:44:55 AM PDT by jordan8
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To: Kitten Festival
"This is why the response to Bush’s move is so venomous, so hysterical, and so contemptuous. This is not good news for conservatism."

IMHO this is the money quote. It is certainly what has disturbed me the most about the arguments of the Miers Critics. It is one thing to disagree with this particular pick; it is quite another to heap insults upon her (and by extension President Bush) in the absence of any facts.

This unjustified (and premature) viciousness by too many people I once had a lot more respect for has had the unintended effect of undermining the possible sensible and logical criticisms of the Miers pick by associating them with what can AT BEST be called "elitism" and might be something a lot worse. It's like having Michael Moore agree with you.

(By the way those Miers Critics who believe such criticisms of their motives to be unfair need to understand that since so much of their anti-Miers attacks cannot be explained logically people are naturally going to speculate about the REAL reasons for it. This shouldn't be THAT hard for them to understand since that is precisely what they have been doing to Bush.)
22 posted on 10/11/2005 1:31:10 PM PDT by FredTownWard
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To: Kitten Festival

I have always thought of ideology as simply a conscience about political matters. Give me a political question and I can give you an opinion based upon my political conscience. This is different from pragmatists who believe that any political question should be answered in a fashion that benefits them. An example of the latter is Robert KKK Byrd


24 posted on 10/11/2005 2:12:05 PM PDT by muir_redwoods (Free Sirhan Sirhan, after all, the bastard who killed Mary Jo Kopechne is walking around free)
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To: Kitten Festival
It is arguable that conservatism is the ultimate ideological school. It is based on the notion that ideas are worth testing and holding, at least where they prove their historical bona fides. Conservatism is NOT based on a rigid manufactured set of beliefs, but it is most certainly founded on ideology!

This whole article reeks of equivalence: since liberalism is guilty of doctrinal rigidity (at least in terms of its absurdity), so must conservatism be. However, it is the wholesale dearth of ideological purity that makes liberalism so weak; since it stands for anything, it stands for nothing.

Heaven forefend the day that same can be said of conservatism. That is the day to toll the bell.

30 posted on 10/11/2005 7:40:22 PM PDT by IronJack
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