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NASA Aims For Mars Two Years After Columbia Disaster
spacedaily.com ^ | 07/08/05

Posted on 07/11/2005 3:56:03 PM PDT by KevinDavis

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Marsward Ho!!!!!
1 posted on 07/11/2005 3:56:12 PM PDT by KevinDavis
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To: RightWhale; Brett66; xrp; gdc314; anymouse; RadioAstronomer; NonZeroSum; jimkress; discostu; ...

2 posted on 07/11/2005 3:56:56 PM PDT by KevinDavis (the space/future belongs to the eagles, the earth/past to the groundhogs)
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To: KevinDavis

For a trillion dollars, what kind of results can one expect to get with manned versus unmanned?

Which would be better, a couple manned missions, possibly ending in tragedy, or 1000 unmanned missions (10% of which fail), each advancing the art further, based on earlier discoveries?


3 posted on 07/11/2005 4:02:15 PM PDT by Atlas Sneezed (Your FRiendly FReeper Patent Attorney)
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To: KevinDavis

Jefferson said in his inaugural that the West would last for thousands upon thousands of generations of honest, moral, and hard-working farmers. Ignoring that the West as a frontier barely lasted for four generations, how long would a Space Frontier last if it were ever opened by establishing private property rights?


4 posted on 07/11/2005 4:02:39 PM PDT by RightWhale (withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty)
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To: Beelzebubba

Land claims are predicated upon setting foot on the land in question. Landing some robots might not meet the requirements for recognition. The point is moot anyway while the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty remains in effect, but if national claim is ever to be asserted, landing some human beings would be essential.


5 posted on 07/11/2005 4:06:22 PM PDT by RightWhale (withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty)
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To: RightWhale

Corporations get leases and private citizens get deeds.


6 posted on 07/11/2005 4:06:37 PM PDT by DoughtyOne (US socialist liberalism would be dead without the help of politicians who claim to be conservative.)
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To: Beelzebubba; All
1. It is not going to cost a trillion dollars.

2. Manned missions can do a lot more than robots...

3. Also we have to leave this stikin rock...
7 posted on 07/11/2005 4:07:00 PM PDT by KevinDavis (the space/future belongs to the eagles, the earth/past to the groundhogs)
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To: RightWhale; All

However, if the ship is launched from Costa Rica (a nation that did not sign the 1967 Outer Space Treaty), the point is moot.


8 posted on 07/11/2005 4:08:07 PM PDT by KevinDavis (the space/future belongs to the eagles, the earth/past to the groundhogs)
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To: DoughtyOne

I was kind of hoping for a crown charter. That is actually what set off the Boston Tea Party and the American Revolution, that a chartered stock-corporation had exclusive rights to carry tea, but a similar system also opened the West through building railroads, which in backlash to the Robber Barons led to both the Populist and the Progressive political movements.


9 posted on 07/11/2005 4:12:17 PM PDT by RightWhale (withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty)
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To: KevinDavis

Bump!


10 posted on 07/11/2005 4:12:57 PM PDT by TheLion
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To: KevinDavis

You would have to whack a bunch of American-owned building lots to make room for that kind of spaceport. Would the gov't of Costa Rica be willing to chance exercising their eminent domain power for that and take the chance of invasion by the American military to protect American corporate interests?


11 posted on 07/11/2005 4:15:23 PM PDT by RightWhale (withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty)
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To: RightWhale; All

I don't think so.. Costa Rica is somewhat of a Libertarian Government....


12 posted on 07/11/2005 4:16:42 PM PDT by KevinDavis (the space/future belongs to the eagles, the earth/past to the groundhogs)
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To: RightWhale
"...how long would a Space Frontier last if it were ever opened by establishing private property rights?"

Extrapolating from the given example, between four hundred and a thousand years.

Primary factors are:
Limited access
Limited expansion capacity of emigrant population
Tremendous area of expansion -- Mars has twice the dry land area of Earth, plus nearly a hundred moons that could be settled elsewhere.

If one accepts that the Oort Cloud has potential, it could last several thousand years, and would lead naturally to interstellar colonization.

13 posted on 07/11/2005 4:22:24 PM PDT by NicknamedBob (Mighty and enduring? They are but toys of the moment to be overturned by the flicking of a finger.)
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To: NicknamedBob

I think that is a fair estimate.


14 posted on 07/11/2005 4:25:35 PM PDT by RightWhale (withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty)
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To: KevinDavis

I wonder how much longer they will survive as an independent country. Guatemala, Honduras, notorious Nicaragua, Costa Rica all would be gone if they had anything of value.


15 posted on 07/11/2005 4:30:02 PM PDT by RightWhale (withdraw from the 1967 UN Outer Space Treaty)
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To: KevinDavis

well that and i would LOVE to see old golry on mars!


16 posted on 07/11/2005 4:35:09 PM PDT by minus_273
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To: minus_273; All

Me, I want to go to Alpha Centauri......


17 posted on 07/11/2005 4:39:13 PM PDT by KevinDavis (the space/future belongs to the eagles, the earth/past to the groundhogs)
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To: RightWhale
Early human migrants over the face of the Earth were limited by their ability to cross barriers, particularly water, and to learn how to use the resources of their new lands.

Later industrialized migration patterns depended on trade routes and access, and on the economical exploitation of recognized resources.

The migration through the solar system and beyond will be similar. Early encampments will depend on solar energy and limited fission power capabilities. Only the most promising locations, such as Mars and the moon, will be attractive.

As fusion power becomes available, fewer limits will be seen. The asteroids in all orbits, the moons of the outer planets, and even some rather intimidating planets themselves, such as Mercury and Uranus, will be settled.

The Oort cloud could well be swimming with decent real estate, requiring only cheap energy to wake it up.

The distances will be vast. Isolation will be reminiscent of the old west. But available energy from fusion will push the speed envelope faster and faster, until the nearest stars don't seem so far away after all.
18 posted on 07/11/2005 4:45:38 PM PDT by NicknamedBob (Mighty and enduring? They are but toys of the moment to be overturned by the flicking of a finger.)
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To: KevinDavis

If I said what I was thinking, I'd get flamed to ashes.


19 posted on 07/11/2005 4:48:43 PM PDT by airborne
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To: KevinDavis

1. It is not going to cost a trillion dollars.

For any given price, unmanned will do more.

2. Manned missions can do a lot more than robots...

Can a few mission do more than hundreds of robotic missions? Computers have advanced since Apollo.

3. Also we have to leave this stikin rock...

I'm happy here, and don't want my earnings spent for the dreams of others.


20 posted on 07/11/2005 6:07:16 PM PDT by Atlas Sneezed (Your FRiendly FReeper Patent Attorney)
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