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Church worships together for last time
Midland Reporter Telegram (TX) ^ | 5/30/2005 | Elise Rambaud

Posted on 05/31/2005 2:44:43 PM PDT by MeanWestTexan

Members of St. Nicholas' Episcopal Church and supporters from churches around the city, state and nation began to fill the pews nearly an hour before Sunday's service. By 7 p.m., chairs spilled out into the sanctuary's foyer until there was standing room only. It was the final Sunday many of St. Nicholas' parishioners would gather together in the building they built only four years ago. Nearly 90 percent of the congregation is leaving St. Nicholas' to begin Christ Church Midland (Anglican Communion) after Bishop Wallis Ohl of the Episcopal Diocese of Northwest Texas told those who were dissatisfied with the direction of the national Episcopal Church to leave the St. Nicholas church building by June 1. Controversy has been over Biblical teachings and the denomination's election of a gay bishop and stance on same-sex marriage blessings.

(Excerpt) Read more at mywesttexas.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events; US: Texas; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: aac; acc; anglican; churchclosing; churchclosings; ecusa; episcopal; fallout; homosexual; homosexualagenda; homosexualbishop; midland; schism
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To: ahadams2; coffeecup; Paridel; keilimon; Hermann the Cherusker; wagglebee; St. Johann Tetzel; ...
Thanks to PAR35 for spotting this stopry abput MeanWestTexan's church!

Traditional Anglican ping, continued in memory of its founder Arlin Adams.

FReepmail sionnsar if you want on or off this moderately high-volume ping list (typically 3-7 pings/day).
This list is pinged by sionnsar and newheart.

Resource for Traditional Anglicans: http://trad-anglican.faithweb.com

Speak the truth in love. Eph 4:15

41 posted on 05/31/2005 4:07:42 PM PDT by sionnsar (†trad-anglican.faithweb.com† || Iran Azadi || Fraud in WA: More votes than voters!)
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To: tom h

Interesting.


42 posted on 05/31/2005 4:08:08 PM PDT by Conservativegreatgrandma
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To: Steve_Seattle; Little_shoe
Apparently the church becomes the property of the diocese regardless of how it was paid for; that's probably true of most churches affiliated with a major denomination. It's very unfortunate for those people who had to leave, but they probably have no legal recourse.

I don t know if that's true of other denominations; in ECUSA the Dennis canon was enacted after the departure of whole congregations, property and all, in the late 70s.

The Dennis canon (Title I, Canon 7.4): "All real and personal property held by or for the benefit of any Parish, Mission or Congregation is held in trust for this Church and the Diocese thereof in which such Parish, Mission or Congregation is located. The existence of this trust, however, shall in no way limit the power and authority of the Parish, Mission or Congregation otherwise existing over such property so long as the particular Parish, Mission or Congregation remains a part of, and subject to, this Church and its Constitution and Canons."

Interestingly, the Continuing churches (APCK and probably most others), prohibit the diocese and province from any ownership of a parish's property.

43 posted on 05/31/2005 4:16:36 PM PDT by sionnsar (†trad-anglican.faithweb.com† || Iran Azadi || Fraud in WA: More votes than voters!)
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To: MeanWestTexan

If your Church is a member of the National Council of Churches, it is supporting a Communist Front.


44 posted on 05/31/2005 4:21:21 PM PDT by Abcdefg
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To: MeanWestTexan

Did your church leadership ever consider the Reformed Episcopal Church? I think they are to EPCUSA what PCA is to PCUSA: an evangelical alternative denomination.


45 posted on 05/31/2005 4:41:58 PM PDT by rudy45
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To: MeanWestTexan

You did right, and set a WONDERFUL example for others. Thank you!


46 posted on 05/31/2005 4:43:06 PM PDT by walden
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To: Abcdefg

See post 24.


47 posted on 05/31/2005 4:57:47 PM PDT by La Enchiladita (Remembering our Heroes today and every day.)
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To: MeanWestTexan; sionnsar
First, MWT..prayers for you and your fellow parishoners, and also, congrats..not in the sense of victory, for no pleasure is taken in what transpired, but joy in the happiness you will be able to find in worship in the future, without this hanging over your head..Like the Bolton nomination, tis far better when it is resolved...

If there are stories next week about the services at both churches, please post them, and ping Sionnsar, who will spread the word..

At least, you were "spared" a farewell message from the AofC. Given his latest pronouncements, you had to feel even more strongly you have all chosen the correct path.

One last item. I have no doubt that you'll be able to buy your property back, in a few years, for about ten cents on the dollar. It's going to be a diocesan money pit, the ECUSA equivalent of the definition of a boat...."a hole in the water surrounded by wood into which one pours $$$." Put some of your in-house attys to work now on planning for the return..

Regards

48 posted on 05/31/2005 5:39:14 PM PDT by ken5050 (Ann Coulter needs to have children ASAP to pass on her gene pool...any volunteers???)
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To: rudy45; MeanWestTexan
Did your church leadership ever consider the Reformed Episcopal Church? I think they are to EPCUSA what PCA is to PCUSA: an evangelical alternative denomination.

rudy45 is correct. There are basically two most likely homes for an evangelical Anglican (American) church leaving ECUSA. The REC is one of those (and their coverage includes Texas, too). The other is affiliation with the AMiA, whose coverage also includes Texas. (Both groups are predominantly Eastern/Midwestern. Neither is well represented out here on the West coast.) You can find links to them from the site in my tagline.

(It's "ECUSA" now, used to be "PECUSA.")

49 posted on 05/31/2005 5:45:04 PM PDT by sionnsar (†trad-anglican.faithweb.com† || Iran Azadi || Fraud in WA: More votes than voters!)
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To: ken5050; MeanWestTexan
One last item. I have no doubt that you'll be able to buy your property back, in a few years, for about ten cents on the dollar. It's going to be a diocesan money pit, the ECUSA equivalent of the definition of a boat...."a hole in the water surrounded by wood into which one pours $$$." Put some of your in-house attys to work now on planning for the return..

It's a bit of a longshot... but then I've heard the story of St. Augustine's (APCK), Chico, CA, that did just that, even though ECUSA would not sell them the building.

50 posted on 05/31/2005 5:47:52 PM PDT by sionnsar (†trad-anglican.faithweb.com† || Iran Azadi || Fraud in WA: More votes than voters!)
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To: sionnsar

Actualy, if ECUSA refuses to sell them the building , and instead sells it to a mini-brewery, or some such..from a PR standpoint it would be petter..show how bitter ECUSA is..


51 posted on 05/31/2005 6:03:22 PM PDT by ken5050 (Ann Coulter needs to have children ASAP to pass on her gene pool...any volunteers???)
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To: LasVegasMac

Yes, it can be scary; but it is nothing new at all, through all history. The church remains, the body remains intact, and no matter the firestorms lobbed at and within. Keep the faith!


52 posted on 05/31/2005 6:48:13 PM PDT by Alia
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To: curmudgeonII
I do not know how female priests in the EPIS church are addressed in these times; but I still occasionally catch references to these as "priest". Which I find quite interesting, actually.. considering the sleeper movement just wouldn't make the stand right away, after ordaining women to the priesthood -- to calling them Priestesses. Perhaps the Goddess fringe element got in the way?

But I think, not.

I think the ordination of "gays" as Priests was in the works long ago. Therefore, why bandy titles about; equalize them by tearing down what is right and proper - is what I think they were thinking.

53 posted on 05/31/2005 6:52:20 PM PDT by Alia
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To: Steve_Seattle
Yes, it was awful for me to observe that in the RC. However, in the Episcopalian church.. there was Bishop Pike, who "saw" things. (I often wonder if he and Cayce met in "astral" form. snort) In fact, he saw fit to sue his own church's seminary -- demanding quotas, he did. Racial quotas. RC had the nuns and their "wanna be"ism. But so did the EPIS have their own "wanna be's".

The point being, IMHO, when an ordained has decided to not serve; it is time for them to move on to elsewhere, in life. Sabbaticals can be quite restful; but no doubts the liberal Catholics via national/world council of churches decided the Teachers and their Unions should have exclusive rights to the word "sabbatical". (sarcasm on this last bit, but I did notice the lack of the work in usage among clergy RIGHT about the time educrats began using the word massively, and clamoring for taxpayer funds, special health issues, tax deductions, etc.)

54 posted on 05/31/2005 7:09:25 PM PDT by Alia
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To: Alia

bttt


55 posted on 05/31/2005 7:11:01 PM PDT by ConservativeMan55 (DON'T FIRE UNTIL YOU SEE THE WHITES OF THE CURTAINS THEY ARE WEARING ON THEIR HEADS !)
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To: La Enchiladita
Don't despair. A refuge for Anglicans who wish to remain Christian exists.
56 posted on 05/31/2005 7:12:44 PM PDT by B-Chan (Catholic. Monarchist. Texan. Any questions?)
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To: sionnsar

.. Chico. I seem to recall.. ECUSA did cheerily sell the church to those who turned it into a Chinese Restaurant, and then the traditional parish bought it back, but from the Chinese Restaurant owners.


57 posted on 05/31/2005 7:13:28 PM PDT by Alia
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To: LasVegasMac

Dear LVM:

It has been my great blessing to be able to attend Mass at RC parishes using the Congregation of St Pius X Latin service. The translation is nearly identical to the English we use in our 1928 BCP service and I so agree with you: there is little more solemn and beautiful than a Latin Mass said by a priest who fully understands the language and the liturgy.

In Christ,
Deacon Paul+


58 posted on 05/31/2005 7:51:39 PM PDT by BelegStrongbow (I think, therefore I vote Republican)
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To: BelegStrongbow
I was on temp duty assignment in Hawaii, early '80s.

A local (not on the AFB) parish Priest would actually take a poll before Mass......

"Children of God, what is your wish? Latin or English?"

The most hands raised, won.

Latin, hands down - every time.

LVM

59 posted on 05/31/2005 8:55:46 PM PDT by LasVegasMac ("God. Guts. Guns. I don't call 911." (bumper sticker))
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To: Alia
The split has also been happening within the RC church. Again, there are liberal RC and EPIS churches and CONSERVATIVE ones. Then there are the hookworm liberal ones scattered in the middle between these two. Did you know... the liberal RC has been involved with Amnesty International for overlong?

There is some truth to this. But the Catholic Church is not nearly as bad as the ECUSA. We have our share of liberal wienies in the clergy and even bishops. But we also have an unimpeachably orthodox guy at the top. B-16 is not gonna put up with a lot of nonsense. I think it would be an awesome trade if we could ship all our liberal wing nuts to the ECUSA and they would point their orthodox Christians over in our direction. In the meantime I wish all of my Christian brothers and sisters in Texas the best.

60 posted on 05/31/2005 9:32:55 PM PDT by jec1ny (Adjutorium nostrum in nomine Domine Qui fecit caelum et terram.)
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