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To: Racehorse
World War II pretty much put an end to Washington style isolationism as something to be taken seriously. And, prior to World War II it was taken very seriously

However, you join with the Wilsonians in mislabeling it.

Washington nor Jefferson ever advocated isolationism. Go back and read again Washington's paragraph L in the debate. "Liberal intercourse with all nations, are recommended by policy, humanity and interest." That is hardly isolationistic. The debate is not between isolationism and non-isolationism; it is between maximizing our independence of action and allowing other interests to marginalize it. That is a very different thing.

Under the Washington/Jefferson foreign policy, America is free to pursue her interests and her people's interest in every corner of the earth. That is not the issue in this debate.

48 posted on 02/26/2005 1:17:32 PM PST by Ohioan
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To: Ohioan

I know the answer to the debate and it's not a cop-out.

Washington was right in his time and Bush is right in his time.

Am I wrong?


50 posted on 02/26/2005 1:21:30 PM PST by martian_22 (Who tells you what you are?)
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To: Ohioan
Under the Washington/Jefferson foreign policy, America is free to pursue her interests and her people's interest in every corner of the earth. That is not the issue in this debate.

Spreading democracies to every corner of the earth is in our countries best interest. That is the issue.

52 posted on 02/26/2005 1:24:40 PM PST by FreeReign
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To: Ohioan; Harmless Teddy Bear
. . . you join with the Wilsonians in mislabeling it.

No. I did not mislabel Washington’s views on foreign entanglements. I made claims about how they were perceived prior to World War II.

You make a mistake to suppose Washington, with the same diligent drafting assistance from Hamilton, would make the same speech today. He would not.

Washington nor Jefferson ever advocated isolationism.

By that, I take it to mean you do not believe Washington advocated building a high wall around the United States and thereafter cut off all contact with the outside world. Okay. I’ll agree.

Here you appear to link Washington and Jefferson, implying they held the same view on foreign affairs. They did not. They only agreed a foreign policy was unavoidable. They differed on what that foreign policy should be.

The debate is not between isolationism and non-isolationism; it is between maximizing our independence of action and allowing other interests to marginalize it. That is a very different thing.

Then a different President and a different speech should have been chosen.

Under the Washington/Jefferson foreign policy, America is free to pursue her interests and her people's interest in every corner of the earth. That is not the issue in this debate.

Between Washington and Bush there is no possible debate. Those speeches were given for entirely different historical reasons.

Harmless Teddy Bear in #18 comes closest to catching the historical context of Washington’s Farewell Address:

You also have to remember that we were just getting started. In Washington's opinion we were not ready to play with the big boys and likely would get creamed if we did. We were building something new and strange. Something that even we were not sure would work.

The speech needs to be read for what it is. Nothing more. Washington counseled the country to become first a nation of Americans. He carefully laid out what he believed was necessary for the people of 1796 to do to accomplish that coming together as Americans. The speech was not meant to be a checklist for us in 2005.

75 posted on 02/26/2005 2:58:03 PM PST by Racehorse (Where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.)
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