PRO-LIFE WARNING TO THE REPUBLICAN PARTY

A 2004 pro-life thread brought back to life | 11-13-04 | Vicomte13

[cpforlife.org]

PRO-LIFE WARNING TO THE REPUBLICAN PARTY

We believe that abortion is infanticide, and that a holocaust of infants is taking place. We do not believe that there is any other issue on Earth that compares with abortion in moral import. And therefore, there is no policy or combination of policies you Republicans can offer, including perfect tax policies, tort reform, and every other thing that is near and dear to Republican hearts, that matters a damn if abortion is overlooked and allowed to slide by.

We know that this issue has to be settled in the Supreme Court, nowhere else. And we know that the opportunity to put new justices on the court comes once in a decade, maybe, and that the current opportunity to alter the complexion of the court is not going to come again for a generation. Therefore, the real possibility exists that abortion can finally be seriously curtailed, soon, by the Supreme Court changing Roe v. Wade or eliminating it...IF, and ONLY IF, we can get pro-life judges on that court.

To do that, we have trusted the Republicans for years. We just came out and voted for you again this time, in unprecedented numbers, because we are not stupid and we know what is at stake. Not just evangelicals either. The religious CATHOLIC vote went Republican in 2004, and they didn't do it because of trade policy or even gay marriage. Their issue is abortion.

And the overriding issue is abortion.

So, if the Republicans allow Senator Specter to get the Chair of the Judiciary Committee and he blocks pro-life nominees, or if the Republicans do not use the nuclear option to override Democrat filibusters of pro-life nominees, THIS TIME there is no place for Republicans to hide. WE KNOW that you have the power, now, because WE just voted to give it to you. We understand that you can block Specter. And we understand the nuclear option.

And therefore, we most certainly will understand that if you allow the pro-life judges to be blocked, that it will be your political CHOICE to have done so. You CAN put pro-life judges on the bench, if you expend a lot of political capital. This will offend some people - a lot of people. And that is the price you HAVE to pay to get our votes next time. You have to be willing to bet the whole house to end infanticide.

If not, we will not vote for you. We won't go running to vote for the Democrats: they're pro-abortion. We won't go out and form a third party: we're not stupid and know that won't work. We'll just stay home, just like we did in 2000. Except that in 2000 it was out of frustration and neglect, and the lack of belief that anything will change. There was no organized campaign to keep the pro-life vote home in 2000.

This time, it's different. We understand the system, and we know that you have the power. And we demand that you use the power straight down the line to fill the high court and the appellate courts with judges who will protect the lives of babies. Period. This is not negotiable. At all. This is why we voted for you. You have nothing with which to bargain with us, and if you screw us, we will stay organized and we will stay home purposely to destroy the Republican party. Because if you do not protect the babies when you have the power to do it, you are no better than the Democrats...and worse, you will have lied to us.

This means, in effect, that all of those things YOU care most about: taxation, immigration, trade and business policy, deregulation - all of those core issues that come as an economic package, are held hostage to our issue: babies. If you will not protect the babies, we will stay home and let the Democrats destroy everything that YOU believe in.

This is called "Chicken". It is called a "Mexican Standoff". And since we are fired up by the certitude that we are doing God's work in defending babies, we cannot be bought, and you cannot win so much as an election for dog catcher in this country without us.

Therefore, the solution is simple and obvious: give us what we voted for you to do. Give us pro-life judges. Use all of your power to do it. Sweep Specter out of the way: is he worth losing all the rest of your agenda? - because we really will stay home and throw the country to the Democrats if you're no better than they are on abortion, just to punish YOU for having betrayed us. When the filibusters come, and they will come, use the nuclear option to override them. That will poison the Senate, yes. So what? We are talking about babies here. And with our votes, militantly mobilized because we are winning, alongside of yours, in 2006 and 2008 and beyond, even if the Senate is poisoned, you will be able to replace it with a more Republican one.

That there is even a debate going on as to what to do with Specter is alarming, but we have had our hearts broken before, so we'll sit and pray and trust President Bush and Senator Frist and the Republicans to do the right thing.

Screw us, though, and we will turn on you and your whole agenda will go down the drain with the blood of the babies you wouldn't put your power on the line to save.

The easy solution, the win-win solution, is to BE as pro-life as you campaigned as being. Just do it.

I apologize for the length of this post. But it needed to be said. The Republicans do not seem to get it. They need to understand that we are more committed to saving babies than we are to the fortunes of the Republican Party. That Specter is still in play demonstrates that too many of them do not take this seriously.

Rather than test us, what you guys should do is simply cave, now, and give us what we want. Do that, and you wont hear from us again - there will be no creeping theocracy in America - because this is about the only religious issue that Catholics and Orthodox and Evangelicals AGREE on.

[Syncro]

Oh I will get back to you.

Patient are a virtue to Doctors.

[ladyinred]

Nice to see you too Syncro!

[JeffAtlanta]

That makes no sense. The taliban doesn't use the Bible. The Constitution was penned with the Bible as its base.

You realize that I said "Taliban type government" right? The fact that the Tabliban actually uses the Koran rather than the Bible is a difference without distinction. I will spell it out for you - people fear a theocracy. When people hear that any religious text is being used as a rationalization of a public policy, it scares them.

Do you believe that the Bible should have legislative power in the United States?

[A Jovial Cad]

*But your degrading language is alright? And your immature remarks? And you're acceptance of your handlers using filthy language?*

Sez you...where? What "degrading language"? Post a link, please. "Immature remarks?"...where? "And you're acceptance of your handlers using filthy language?" What "handlers" would that be, sport? Point to them, please, and provide, please, a handy link...you entire post is garbage, as you well know, and has zero basis in any kind of fact to be found anywhere--but nice try. ...(snicker)...

[A Jovial Cad]

*Oh I will get back to you*

Oh, how I hope you do: it's precisely little tinfoil toy keyboarder's such as yourself that I get down on my knees and hope and pray to be able to confront, and hold up for all the world to see as ridiculous...as has already pretty thoroughly been done to date in this thread--but by all means, if you want to look still sillier, please continue...(snicker)...

[JeffAtlanta]

Alan Keyes not getting elected had nothing to do with his pro-life beliefs. And I feel confident that Toomey would have carried PA. if he had won the primary.

Keyes whole election was based on morals - primarily abortion. His extreme positions ensured that only extreme pro-lifers would vote for him. The choice between pro-life and pro-choice had never been so clear. He got about 30% of the vote. Why didn't the Catholics, evangeicals and hispanics rise to his defense? Answer: their votes aren't centered on pro-life nearly as much as posters in this thread would hope.

Toomey had no chance in the PA general election. Bush couldn't carry so why would Toomey? Why do you think that Specter got more votes than Bush did in PA? Specter represents the realities of PA politics.

[A Jovial Cad]

Still waiting on that link to *ANY* of this so-called "degrading language" and "immature remarks" AND "filthy language" supposedly provide by "handlers." Still waiting, eagerly, for such a post full of links to be forthcoming...but since we both well know that those claims were simply garbage to start with, I guess I'll be waiting a good while...(snicker)...

[Syncro]

Thanks for the Scriptural reverence.

I will expound on it.

² Thus says the LORD of hosts, 'I will punish what Am'alek did to Israel in opposing them on the way, when they came up out of Egypt.

³ Now go and smite Am'alek, and utterly destroy all that they have; do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.'" And he took Agag the king of the Amal'ekites alive, and utterly destroyed all the people with the edge of the sword.

⁹ But Saul and the people spared Agag, and the best of the sheep and of the oxen and of the fatlings, and the lambs, and all that was good, and would not utterly destroy them; all that was despised and worthless they utterly destroyed.

¹⁰ The word of the LORD came to Samuel:

¹¹ "I repent that I have made Saul king; for he has turned back from following me, and has not performed my commandments." And Samuel was angry; and he cried to the LORD all night.

¹⁸ And the LORD sent you on a mission, and said, 'Go, utterly destroy the sinners, the Amal'ekites, and fight against them until they are consumed.'

¹⁹ Why then did you not obey the voice of the LORD? Why did you swoop on the spoil, and do what was evil in the sight of the LORD?"

Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.

²³ For rebellion is as the sin of divination, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the LORD, he has also rejected you from being king."

²⁴ And Saul said to Samuel, "I have sinned; for I have transgressed the commandment of the LORD and your words, because I feared the people and obeyed their voice.

He feared the people, and could not follow what God had told him to so.

Yes, we don't understand why, and the Democrats are not interested in what God wants and many Conservatives don't understand. But this a good example of following God's plan instead of our own even if we don't fully understand it.

Sorry if this is too Biblical and too long of a response, but I did it anyway.

LOL

[A Jovial Cad]

Hey, Syncro old sport...WE'RE ALL STILL waiting, waiting, waiting, on this "proof" in the form of links to all that stuff you were bloviating about in this post...where's the link, for instance, to any hardcore proof--or just simple proof would suffice--that I EVER used anything that can even remotely be called "filthy language" or even "degrading language"? What happened to that? Does it or does it NOT exist? ...(snicker)...

[Syncro]

I have others to post to that have positive uplifting discussions so I will post to you (as I have told you) when I am finished posting to the rational people that want to debate.

Your personal attacks on me and others can wait.

Go to bed if you want, I will post to your false premises soon.

[A Jovial Cad]

And HERE WE ALL ARE ONCE AGAIN, from FR stadium, STILL waiting on those links--or proof of any kind, for that matter--that "Syncro" might be able to provide to certify, in even the slightest manner, the claims he made in this, his latest, greatest, and most idiotic post...and we wait on...(snicker)...Don't hold your breath, folks!

[lara]

You still did not answer my question. What did you mean when you said that the "Abortion is #1 crowd" won't leave?

You say that Keyes got 30% of the extreme pro-life vote. So what happens to that 30% when the Republicans try to run a moderate next time? And Keyes election wasn't based on morals alone. He backed President Bush 100% in the war on Iraq. Actually, when you think about it, Iraq is a morals issue too, isn't it?

[JeffAtlanta]

Yes, we don't understand why, and the Democrats are not interested in what God wants and many Conservatives don't understand. But this a good example of following God's plan instead of our own even if we don't fully understand it.

This is why "God's plan" shouldn't be used to form public policy. Most people who call themselves Christian have no idea what "God's plan" is. Its subjective and unverifiable.

My point stands that quoting bible verses to support policy scares people and drives them away. I wish pro-lifers would stop doing it because it guarantees that only practicing Christians will listen and these people are most likely already on the pro-life bandwagon.

Using scripture also damages all of republican party because it becomes guilty by association. The party will lose credibility in issues like American sovereignty, national defense, property rights and income redistribution since the party will be viewed simply as a bunch of bible thumpers.

If abortion is so wrong, it should be easy to argue it from a non-scriptual point of view. Use scientific evidence and non-ranting presentations to get the point across. It will help our cause.

By the way, the nation will never adopt the catholic view on contraception - please don't try to push that.

[A Jovial Cad]

Quit lying about what I've said, and you won't need to wait until you've *finished posting* elsewhere to respond--it's an odd kind of conservative--and an odder still so-called "Christian"--who has to ask the person he's lying about to wait until everyone else has left the room in order to CONTINUE lying about him....
Let's have those links "proving" your bogus claims in your previous posts now, please...and I'll go away. It's a straightforward request, after all: quit lying, fess up to everyone in the thread, and that'll be the end of it. Somehow I doubt we'll ever get that, though, because prideful liars so do hate to 'fess up...I've run across such perfect specimen's of that sort as yourself before, after all...

[Syncro]

it's precisely little tinfoil toy keyboarder's such as yourself that I get down on my knees and hope and pray to be able to confront, and hold up for all the world to see as ridiculous...as has already pretty thoroughly been done to date in this thread--but by all means, if you want to look still sillier, please continue...(snicker)...

Gosh, you ask me to show you the immature posts that you did, and then you show me an example with your words above.

And when you get on your knees, do you face Mecca, or who do you hope and pray to?

And do you tell your god (whoever it may be) that you demean others and snicker at them? Or do you snicker at your god too?

Go ahead and hold me up to the world for all to see if you want, but hold yourself up too.

I am sure your god will appreciate your condescending attitude.

Your god likes to demean people and hold them up to ridicule? Fine, worship at that alter if you want.

Oh what the heck is a little tinfoil keyboarder?

Projection?

[JeffAtlanta]

So what happens to that 30% when the Republicans try to run a moderate next time?

Probably only about 10% was actually "abortion is the #1 issue" voters The other 20% were do or die republicans. That 10% sits at home and is replaced by urban pro-choice fiscal conservatives. This is how Specter and all other moderates get elected.

As I've written before, the rabid "Abortion is the only true issue" crowd scares away more voters than it attracts. Its the equivalent to the ACT-UP crowd in democratic party. Notice, I didn't say "pro-lifers" - I specified those that view banning abortion as the only real issue and that all others really don't matter.

[JeffAtlanta]

Actually, when you think about it, Iraq is a morals issue too, isn't it?

This is what scares people. The left played up the morals card during the election to make us look like backwoods bible thumpers and not only did the left buy it, but a large portion of the right did too.

If Bush had proposed rolling back the tax cuts he would not have been reelected. If Bush had proposed giving the UN a larger role in US foreign policy he would not have been elected. If Bush had proposed a national health care system he would not have bee reelected. None of those have anything to do with morals. People voted for national security and economic policy.

BTW, Iraq is about national security.

[Syncro]

who has to ask the person he's lying about to wait until everyone else has left the room in order to CONTINUE lying about him

You are so out to lunch.

You liberals parse and twist words to the max.

Your personal attacks only show how out of the loop you are.

I will fulfill your requests, just keep refreshing.

[A Jovial Cad]

*I have others to post to that have positive uplifting discussions so I will post to you (as I have told you) when I am finished posting to the rational people that want to debate*

LOL...what that translates to is: "I can't hack it in debate with you..."

*Your personal attacks on me and others can wait*

Uh-huh...whatever you say. Anyone reading through the thread will see that *THAT* claim is pure garbage--which is par for the course. The "personal attacks" have been entirely initiated by you, from stem to stern. I invite any and all interested to scroll up and check it out...

*Go to bed if you want*

You first, sport.

*I will post to your false premises soon*

Uh-huh...those "false premises" have left you sputtering with incoherent rage, and making up nonexistent bilge without a speck of evidence to back it up--claims that remain, to this moment, unanswered in the proof department, because they never occurred in the first place.

STILL waiting on those links that might be able to "prove" your previous bogus claims...

[Syncro]

WHAT hypocrisy?

Well if I show you his posts that are hypocritical, you accuse me of using the "search" application.

I really don't want to be set up anymore, see ya in the morning.